FLYBOYJ
"THE GREAT GAZOO"
Except when it's a P-39, then it's the machine!
When did the US start teaching "boom and zoom"
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GrauGeist
Generalfeldmarschall zur Luftschiff Abteilung
Unless you've read the pilot's manualExcept when it's a P-39, then it's the machine!
Thumpalumpacus
Major
Hi
The Dicta Boelcke as published in 'Dog-Fight, Aerial Tactics of the Aces of World War I' by Norman Franks, has the following:
Although Dicta #6 on this list would probably get you killed if undertaken over enemy territory.
Also there is the June 1915 edition of the 'RFC Training Manual Part II' which notes the aerial fighting techniques of the early aeroplanes:
Note the location of the sun is already important (note (b)).
Mike
Clayton Magnet
Staff Sergeant
- 864
- Feb 16, 2013
"early in the war" Chennault was advising the Chinese airforce. I don't think any AVG pilots were on location until well into 1941, and they didn't see any combat until late December.
Thumpalumpacus
Major
I think his mentioning the AVG supplies the context that "early in the war" means from the American perspective.
GrauGeist
Generalfeldmarschall zur Luftschiff Abteilung
There seems to be several versions, the original issued had seven rules, the 8th rule being added shortly after the first distribution of the Dicta in 1916.
In the original publication, Rule #6 was:
"6. If your opponent dives on you, do not try to evade his onslaught, but fly to meet it."
GregP
Major
I don't think it was necessarily "boom and zoom" in WWII or WWII. Chenault taught his people to use their airplane's strengths and minimize their weaknesses.
The P-40 wasn't ever going to be more maneuverable than a Ki-43 or an A6M, so the strengths were diving and use of higher speed. You can't dive on someone from below, so diving meant from above. The Spitfire was likely the most maneuverable high-performance fighter in the ETO, so using its strength meant dogfighting and out-turning it's opponents ... right up until it went to Australia and encountered the A6M Zero. Those engagements showed the Spitifre pilots that, when fighting a Zero, they needed to keep up their speed.
Boom and zoom came in with the early jets and the John Boyd fighter crowd, who invented energy maneuvering with the early fast-but-low specific thrust jet fighters.
I'm sure Biff can chime in here, but "energy maneuvering" was high developed by the F-86 / F-100 crowd, much more so than with pistons. Biff? Where are you and what do you think? Being from the F-15 population, I'm betting your perspective is way better than mine.
The P-40 wasn't ever going to be more maneuverable than a Ki-43 or an A6M, so the strengths were diving and use of higher speed. You can't dive on someone from below, so diving meant from above. The Spitfire was likely the most maneuverable high-performance fighter in the ETO, so using its strength meant dogfighting and out-turning it's opponents ... right up until it went to Australia and encountered the A6M Zero. Those engagements showed the Spitifre pilots that, when fighting a Zero, they needed to keep up their speed.
Boom and zoom came in with the early jets and the John Boyd fighter crowd, who invented energy maneuvering with the early fast-but-low specific thrust jet fighters.
I'm sure Biff can chime in here, but "energy maneuvering" was high developed by the F-86 / F-100 crowd, much more so than with pistons. Biff? Where are you and what do you think? Being from the F-15 population, I'm betting your perspective is way better than mine.
Hi
Yes, I have seen two versions of the 'Dicta' in various publications, a 7 rule version and an 8 rule version. The 7 rule appears in 'Dog-Fight' (Franks) as I have already posted, and Franks/Bailey/Guest also have it in 'Above the Lines' page 15, below:
The 8 rule version appears in several publications including 'The World War I Aviators Manual' edited by Chris McNab, pages 121-122, below:
It appears that the 8 rule one is later than the 7 rule, and it is the former that has #6 "If your opponent dives on you, do not try to evade his onslaught but fly to meet him." The 7 rule #6 "Keep your eye on the enemy and do not let him deceive you with tricks. If your opponent appears damaged, follow him down until he crashes to be sure he is not faking." disappears from the rules in the 8 rule version, the air war had moved on and this rule had now become "dangerous" due to the later more intense air war. Although the caveat about any publication is that they do not always contain "correct", McNab's comments after the rules is an example the "Tactical information was not entirely standardised and shared in the RFC and Aeronautique Militaire until late in the war.". It certainly was being shared during 1916, especially during Verdun, as the British National Archives have documents (I have copies of many of them) direct from the French Commanders, especially du Peuty and also from RFC Liaison Officers such as Capt. Cooper, the RFC incorporated some of the lessons from Verdun prior to the Somme battles. Aspects of the WW1 air fighting have apparently still not be recognised by authors of the present day so the confusion over "boom and zoom" during WW2 should not be surprising.
Mike
Greg,
I unfortunately can not say when EM or energy maneuvering became published before Boyd. I would think the Boom and Zoom is a version of it, and that was used by the AVG, and taught by Chennault (who understood it enough to realize it had specific tactical applications). Therefore it was "around" prior to Boyd but was refined extensively by him (to include aircraft design).
In pilot training we were taught energy management in the form of which order you performed maneuvers so as not to waste fuel climbing between them. Airline flying is very much driven but fuel husbandry as well.
Cheers,
Biff
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Peter Gunn
Master Sergeant
So, you're saying you Boom and Zoom a 767? Suddenly four bucks a gallon doesn't seem so bad...
LOL! Well, I guess you could...
Energy management on airliners comes into play starting with the descent, and finishes on final approach (final configuration and at approach speed). Unlike fighters they are much harder to get slowed down...
SaparotRob
Unter Gemeine Geschwader Murmeltier XIII
What if you removed the nose armor?
GrauGeist
Generalfeldmarschall zur Luftschiff Abteilung
I think the cabin heater was more of an issue...
buffnut453
Captain
Getting away from the Groundhog discussions...
To say that "boom and zoom" only became a "thing" during the jet age isn't correct. Even during the WW1, fighter pilots understood that he who has the height controls the battle. He can dictate where and when to engage, and can use the dive to accelerate and present a harder target for the victim. The main difference between WW1 and the jet age is that the ability to translate potential energy (i.e. altitude) for kinetic energy (i.e. speed) and vice versa is MUCH easier in a modern jet, and it spans a much larger operational envelope. However, the core principle remains unchanged.
To say that "boom and zoom" only became a "thing" during the jet age isn't correct. Even during the WW1, fighter pilots understood that he who has the height controls the battle. He can dictate where and when to engage, and can use the dive to accelerate and present a harder target for the victim. The main difference between WW1 and the jet age is that the ability to translate potential energy (i.e. altitude) for kinetic energy (i.e. speed) and vice versa is MUCH easier in a modern jet, and it spans a much larger operational envelope. However, the core principle remains unchanged.
FLYBOYJ
"THE GREAT GAZOO"
As pointed out, zoom and boom has been around since at least World War I. The only thing Boyd did was give the concept a name and quantify the maneuver based on specific aircraft performance
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