Done : Fw190A-6 1./JG1 Unteroffizier Rudolf Hübl, White-5 Oct,1943 Gruppe Build - Page 3 - Aircraft of World War II

Lucky13 · 01-10-2009, 07:19 PM

I take Erich word over pretty much everything else, unless that's book that he recommend....then it's even Stephen....

Airframes · 01-10-2009, 11:05 PM

Here you go M. Thought this pic might be useful for you, although it's a FW190 A4. The aircraft is from IV/JG1, taken at Arnhem (Deelen or Gilze - Rijen?) after a landing accident.
I've done a separate post with some FW190 drawings that might also be of use. See 'Focke Wulf Drawings' post, in the Modelling Section.
Terry.

Erich · 01-10-2009, 11:14 PM

well known pic Terry of a 1./JG 1 crate cracked up, white 4, there are some 6 pics of this crashed bird. It is very interesting that this being an A-4 it has outboard long barreled belt-fed MG151/20's installed and not the drum-fed short barreled type

Airframes · 01-11-2009, 12:48 AM

Thanks Erich, I thought the same, and had some doubts, about it being an A-4, due to the cannons. I couldn't find the other pics I've seen/have of it in enoug time to get the post up. So it IS a 1/JG1 bird - again, I had doubts about it being captioned (the pic) as a IV/JG1 kite, as I couldn't see a Gruppe marking. But, this particular pic came from the old Heinz Nowarra book, which has a number of misleading (? strange!) photo captions. There is one that declares "...Fw190's in the Battle of Britain..."!! I gave the benefit of the doubt to something being lost in the translation from German!
Terry.

109ROAMING · 01-11-2009, 05:25 AM

Nice shot Terry ,Never seen it before

Erich · 01-11-2009, 09:20 AM

the checkered design was terminated shortly after the 1944 year came into being and then I. gruppe used the white/black stripes with different coloured props and the spiral(s). the numbers stayed the same. this past August was honoured to visit Jerry C. and see colour footage of I./JG 1 and see first hand the mythical red/black checkerboard cowlings of 2nd staffel thought to be total nonsense..........nope the real thing existed.

good ol Heinz N's books were and I mean were the classic sources that we used back in the 60's early 70's.............man that seems like an eternity ago.

good pic Terry, Mombeeks JG 1 book also says white 4 is an A-4, but like you have my doubts

Airframes · 01-11-2009, 09:57 AM

Yes, I used to have Heinz's old 'Harleyford' books on the 190 and 109, and another which I can't quite remember. I got them between about 1962 to 1964, and still have another 3 Harleyfords, but the Nowarra ones were loaned out, and never came back!! Darn, I hate that!
The book the pic came from was published in the UK in 1988, having been first published in Germany in '87. Gosh! I didn't realise I'd had it that long - time flies!

Wurger · 01-11-2009, 10:32 AM

I think it was Fw190A-4.Look at these pics, please.The fuselage-wing transition at the wing leading edge looked differently for A-4 and A-5/A-6/A-8.As we all know, I'm sure about it, later Fw190A had the engine mount longer and for the reason there was added smothing like an additional section to make the engine cowling matching to the fuselage.The addition is clearly visible in the pics of A-5/A-6/A-8 as you can see in the included magnified shots.Comparing these later Fws to the enlarged part of Terry's pic the addition is not noticed at all.

Erich · 01-11-2009, 11:49 AM

it is probably an A-4 just because of the time frame as the A-7 and A-8 was introduced in 44. Good work W ~

E ~

Airframes · 01-11-2009, 11:56 AM

Yep, you're right Wojtek! I've just checked some scale drawings, and that extension was 152.5mm, and the enlarged leading edge wing fillet is clearly different. Good work!

Lucky13 · 01-11-2009, 11:57 AM

Indeed good work Wojtek!

Wurger · 01-11-2009, 12:07 PM

THX guys.

BTW What is the Fw190A-4 and A-6/A-8 lenght stated in you sources? Just of curiosity.

muller · 02-16-2009, 04:24 AM

Disaster! The site I ordered the kit from e-mailed me to tell me they can't get this particular kit from their supplier. They can't get ANY Hasegawa kits for the forseeable future. I'll probably get a Tamiya kit from them and try to find some aftermarket decals, I still want to build the checker nose scheme.

109ROAMING · 02-16-2009, 05:26 AM

Dam that sucks M ,Good luck on finding some decals!

Wayne Little · 02-16-2009, 05:44 AM

That does suck, big time.....however help is at hand...I have some black checker decals I wont be using....

If you go with Tamiya you will need the A-3 which can be converted to an A-4 without too much difficulty...

the JG1 book shows an A-4 "Yellow 6" with yellow cowl ring, an option if you are interested?

01-10-2009, 07:19 PM	#31
Lucky13 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: A Swede living in Glasgow, Scotland Posts: 17,331	I take Erich word over pretty much everything else, unless that's book that he recommend....then it's even Stephen.... __________________ JAN "Felicis Tredecim" "I´m going back to the front to relax" "THE BLACK CATS FLIES TONIGHT" "Find your enemy and shoot him down - everything else is unimportant!" "When you're out of F-8's... You're out of fighters!"

01-10-2009, 11:14 PM	#33
Erich the old Sage Join Date: May 2004 Location: Platonic Sphere Posts: 11,107	well known pic Terry of a 1./JG 1 crate cracked up, white 4, there are some 6 pics of this crashed bird. It is very interesting that this being an A-4 it has outboard long barreled belt-fed MG151/20's installed and not the drum-fed short barreled type __________________ Rip it up !

01-11-2009, 05:25 AM	#35
109ROAMING Senior Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: New Zealand Posts: 5,869	Nice shot Terry ,Never seen it before __________________ RIP Wigram AFB 1916-1995-2009

01-11-2009, 09:20 AM	#36
Erich the old Sage Join Date: May 2004 Location: Platonic Sphere Posts: 11,107	the checkered design was terminated shortly after the 1944 year came into being and then I. gruppe used the white/black stripes with different coloured props and the spiral(s). the numbers stayed the same. this past August was honoured to visit Jerry C. and see colour footage of I./JG 1 and see first hand the mythical red/black checkerboard cowlings of 2nd staffel thought to be total nonsense..........nope the real thing existed. good ol Heinz N's books were and I mean were the classic sources that we used back in the 60's early 70's.............man that seems like an eternity ago. good pic Terry, Mombeeks JG 1 book also says white 4 is an A-4, but like you have my doubts __________________ Rip it up !

01-11-2009, 11:49 AM	#39
Erich the old Sage Join Date: May 2004 Location: Platonic Sphere Posts: 11,107	it is probably an A-4 just because of the time frame as the A-7 and A-8 was introduced in 44. Good work W ~ E ~ __________________ Rip it up !

01-11-2009, 12:48 AM	#34
Airframes Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 11,529	Thanks Erich, I thought the same, and had some doubts, about it being an A-4, due to the cannons. I couldn't find the other pics I've seen/have of it in enoug time to get the post up. So it IS a 1/JG1 bird - again, I had doubts about it being captioned (the pic) as a IV/JG1 kite, as I couldn't see a Gruppe marking. But, this particular pic came from the old Heinz Nowarra book, which has a number of misleading (? strange!) photo captions. There is one that declares "...Fw190's in the Battle of Britain..."!! I gave the benefit of the doubt to something being lost in the translation from German! Terry.

01-11-2009, 09:57 AM	#37
Airframes Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 11,529	Yes, I used to have Heinz's old 'Harleyford' books on the 190 and 109, and another which I can't quite remember. I got them between about 1962 to 1964, and still have another 3 Harleyfords, but the Nowarra ones were loaned out, and never came back!! Darn, I hate that! The book the pic came from was published in the UK in 1988, having been first published in Germany in '87. Gosh! I didn't realise I'd had it that long - time flies!

01-11-2009, 11:56 AM	#40
Airframes Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 11,529	Yep, you're right Wojtek! I've just checked some scale drawings, and that extension was 152.5mm, and the enlarged leading edge wing fillet is clearly different. Good work!

01-11-2009, 11:57 AM	#41
Lucky13 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: A Swede living in Glasgow, Scotland Posts: 17,331	Indeed good work Wojtek! __________________ JAN "Felicis Tredecim" "I´m going back to the front to relax" "THE BLACK CATS FLIES TONIGHT" "Find your enemy and shoot him down - everything else is unimportant!" "When you're out of F-8's... You're out of fighters!"

01-11-2009, 12:07 PM	#42
Wurger Siggy Master Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Poland Posts: 15,982	THX guys. BTW What is the Fw190A-4 and A-6/A-8 lenght stated in you sources? Just of curiosity. __________________

02-16-2009, 04:24 AM	#43
muller Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The Emerald Isle Posts: 1,501	Disaster! The site I ordered the kit from e-mailed me to tell me they can't get this particular kit from their supplier. They can't get ANY Hasegawa kits for the forseeable future. I'll probably get a Tamiya kit from them and try to find some aftermarket decals, I still want to build the checker nose scheme. __________________

02-16-2009, 05:26 AM	#44
109ROAMING Senior Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: New Zealand Posts: 5,869	Dam that sucks M ,Good luck on finding some decals! __________________ RIP Wigram AFB 1916-1995-2009

02-16-2009, 05:44 AM	#45
Wayne Little Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Adelaide Sth. Aust. Posts: 14,801	That does suck, big time.....however help is at hand...I have some black checker decals I wont be using.... If you go with Tamiya you will need the A-3 which can be converted to an A-4 without too much difficulty... the JG1 book shows an A-4 "Yellow 6" with yellow cowl ring, an option if you are interested? __________________

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