JG 300 / IV (Sturm)JG 3 pictures? - Aircraft of World War II

von hahn · 07-17-2009, 06:04 PM

Hi all,

Does anyone have any pictures of FW190 A-8 Sturmbocks of either 5. , 6. , or 8./JG 300, or of IV (Sturm) JG3?

Thank you!
vh

beaupower32 · 07-17-2009, 10:45 PM

A line-up of FW 190 A-8s of II./J.G. 300, 1944, including White 5 + -, White 15 + -, and White 18 + -

'Black 12 + ' was the third aircraft built in the production run at the Ago factory at Oschersleben in April 1944. In June 1944, elements of IV.(Sturm)/J.G. 3 transferred from southern Germany to Dreux in Normandy, and for a week flew fighter-bomber operations over the invasion front. During the return flight to Germany, this aircraft force-landed near Dijon in eastern France. The IV. Gruppe ~ marking aft of the Balkenkreuz was overpainted on this FW 190 A-8

lesofprimus · 07-18-2009, 06:49 AM

Some...

FalkeEins · 07-22-2009, 03:51 PM

hey vh

..don't forget II.(Sturm)/ JG4 ..a new book translation ..worth getting !

an anonymous machine from IV./JG 3 - photo sent to me by Willi Unger (RIP)

seesul · 07-22-2009, 04:13 PM

Hi Neil,

have you ever been in touch with Klaus Neumann?

Erich · 07-22-2009, 04:27 PM

Neils pic of Unger in unmarked machine is alos in my collection sent by him along with at least 25 other fotos.

above on Schwarze 12 artistic rendering by Dekker- fact info is incorrect......of course that depends on which black 12 we are talking about too.

Neumann went into hiding and was never able to adress him at his home for the elderly. his photo album of many pics is long gone most likely trashed. Neil and I discussed this fact whe we were running the Sturmgruppen web-site some years ago Roman.

FalkeEins · 07-22-2009, 04:31 PM

Hi guys,

..Erich's right, Neumann never got in touch and by the time he passed away was already lost to this world.. Robert Forsyth did get to meet with Neumann when researching his JV 44 book a few years ago - a very strange experience apparently. I'm trying to get the full story..

Erich - nice to see you around, you are MIA on one or two other boards we frequent !

the 'black 12' Dekker illustrated appeared on photos in Lorant's Fw 190 book - I haven't seen them anywhere else. I've got a couple of very nice prints, but can't post them ..saving them for a 'project', who knows, one day..!

Erich · 07-22-2009, 04:38 PM

hey friend, yes 09 has been a devastating struggle of tragedy for my family. But we are trying to move forward, and will

seesul · 07-22-2009, 04:43 PM

Thx Erich and Neil!
Neil, should you get the full story one day, post it please.
´cause Klaus is among the fighters who got down few Forts over my town...

Wayne Little · 07-23-2009, 06:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FalkeEins

hey vh

..don't forget II.(Sturm)/ JG4 ..a new book translation ..worth getting !

Looking forward to this and the JG 2 Volume via my local friend/supplier.....waiting patiently!

FalkeEins · 07-23-2009, 08:09 AM

..Thanks Wayne - enjoy! especially if you've not seen any of the foreign language editions.

one of my fave shots from the JG 300 book (Vol II) - Hubert Engst 6./JG 300 IIRC

Erich · 07-23-2009, 02:02 PM

yes great shot Neil

remember this: L in the pit and B chatting from the ground, II.Sturm/JG 300

credit JYL

seesul · 07-23-2009, 02:42 PM

Neil or Erich,

did Klaus Neumann join the German Luftwaffe after the WW2?
And another question- what is the detailed difference between A-8/R2 and A-8/R8. The number of armour plates only?
And the last question- what was the pure Sturmbock version- R2 or R8?

Erich · 07-23-2009, 03:12 PM

Roman I would have to check his bio, was writing one up 4-5 years ago but would have to dig it out, Neil may know more quickly than I and may have some different opinions as well on the R2 vs the R8. the R8 was suppose to be the standard SturmFw variant in November 44's end with the cowling fairings and no mg 131's the R2 could have them or could be removed and the cowlings faired over. the R2 flown by JG 301 especially in III. gruppe had no armor-extra but had outboard 3cm cannon and the mg 131's over the cowling.

in JG 3, 4 and 300 the R2 had all the armor plating/ fittings but the R8 had the extra armor butted around the engine as well as the ammo boxes and some had leading wing edges armored...........as you might guess a real slow clumsy doof crate flying on the missions and when engaged by Us P-51's, was doomed

the Panzer-Scheuklappen was standard on most Sturms in JG 3 but was removed in nearly all cases from JG 300 crates. JG 4 removed the canopy coverings after their disaster on 11 September 1944, although striking hard on the US 100th bg they were slow and shot down by return fire of the B-17's and US escorts from the 339th fg. Excess icing was a major concern forming between the armor glas covers and the canopy glas

seesul · 07-23-2009, 03:23 PM

Thx Erich!
I´ve just opened a new thread about those 2 versions before I saw your answer. No problem, feel free to discuss there as well http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/tec...nce-19820.html (Fw-190A-8/R2 and Fw-190A-8/R8 - the difference)

07-17-2009, 06:04 PM	#1
von hahn Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 33	JG 300 / IV (Sturm)JG 3 pictures? Hi all, Does anyone have any pictures of FW190 A-8 Sturmbocks of either 5. , 6. , or 8./JG 300, or of IV (Sturm) JG3? Thank you! vh

07-17-2009, 10:45 PM	#2
beaupower32 Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Charleston, South Carolina Posts: 1,295	A line-up of FW 190 A-8s of II./J.G. 300, 1944, including White 5 + -, White 15 + -, and White 18 + - 'Black 12 + ' was the third aircraft built in the production run at the Ago factory at Oschersleben in April 1944. In June 1944, elements of IV.(Sturm)/J.G. 3 transferred from southern Germany to Dreux in Normandy, and for a week flew fighter-bomber operations over the invasion front. During the return flight to Germany, this aircraft force-landed near Dijon in eastern France. The IV. Gruppe ~ marking aft of the Balkenkreuz was overpainted on this FW 190 A-8 __________________ The Gates of Hell are open Day and Night. A Guilty Conscience is the Hell of a Living Soul. Abandon All Hope, You who Enter here. Dante's Inferno Last edited by beaupower32; 07-17-2009 at 11:02 PM.

07-18-2009, 06:49 AM	#3
lesofprimus Minister of Whoopass Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Long Island Native in Mississippi Posts: 18,459	Some... __________________ My IL2 Video Tribute to My Grandfather: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HtzN5RuNNJk My 1/32nd Rendition of His Corsair: http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/2-p...3-a-20416.html Last edited by lesofprimus; 07-18-2009 at 06:54 AM.

07-22-2009, 03:51 PM	#4
FalkeEins Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Capel-le-Ferne, Kent, England Posts: 102	hey vh ..don't forget II.(Sturm)/ JG4 ..a new book translation ..worth getting ! an anonymous machine from IV./JG 3 - photo sent to me by Willi Unger (RIP) __________________ My modelling blog by FalkeEins My Luftwaffe blog by FalkeEins Jet & Prop by FalkeEins Last edited by FalkeEins; 07-22-2009 at 04:03 PM.

07-22-2009, 04:13 PM	#5
seesul Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Zlin, Czech Republic Posts: 2,856	Hi Neil, have you ever been in touch with Klaus Neumann? __________________ Roman Susil Zlin, Czech Republic ...a friend of Joe Owsianik,So. Plainfield, NJ, a former left waist gunner from B-17G ''Tail End Charlie" from 2ndBG,20th Sqdn who was forced to bail out on Aug. 29th, 1944 over my country.

07-22-2009, 04:27 PM	#6
Erich the old Sage Join Date: May 2004 Location: Platonic Sphere Posts: 11,109	Neils pic of Unger in unmarked machine is alos in my collection sent by him along with at least 25 other fotos. above on Schwarze 12 artistic rendering by Dekker- fact info is incorrect......of course that depends on which black 12 we are talking about too. Neumann went into hiding and was never able to adress him at his home for the elderly. his photo album of many pics is long gone most likely trashed. Neil and I discussed this fact whe we were running the Sturmgruppen web-site some years ago Roman. __________________ Rip it up !

07-22-2009, 04:31 PM	#7
FalkeEins Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Capel-le-Ferne, Kent, England Posts: 102	Hi guys, ..Erich's right, Neumann never got in touch and by the time he passed away was already lost to this world.. Robert Forsyth did get to meet with Neumann when researching his JV 44 book a few years ago - a very strange experience apparently. I'm trying to get the full story.. Erich - nice to see you around, you are MIA on one or two other boards we frequent ! the 'black 12' Dekker illustrated appeared on photos in Lorant's Fw 190 book - I haven't seen them anywhere else. I've got a couple of very nice prints, but can't post them ..saving them for a 'project', who knows, one day..! __________________ My modelling blog by FalkeEins My Luftwaffe blog by FalkeEins Jet & Prop by FalkeEins Last edited by FalkeEins; 07-22-2009 at 04:36 PM.

07-22-2009, 04:38 PM	#8
Erich the old Sage Join Date: May 2004 Location: Platonic Sphere Posts: 11,109	hey friend, yes 09 has been a devastating struggle of tragedy for my family. But we are trying to move forward, and will __________________ Rip it up !

07-22-2009, 04:43 PM	#9
seesul Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Zlin, Czech Republic Posts: 2,856	Thx Erich and Neil! Neil, should you get the full story one day, post it please. ´cause Klaus is among the fighters who got down few Forts over my town... __________________ Roman Susil Zlin, Czech Republic ...a friend of Joe Owsianik,So. Plainfield, NJ, a former left waist gunner from B-17G ''Tail End Charlie" from 2ndBG,20th Sqdn who was forced to bail out on Aug. 29th, 1944 over my country.

07-23-2009, 08:09 AM	#11
FalkeEins Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Capel-le-Ferne, Kent, England Posts: 102	..Thanks Wayne - enjoy! especially if you've not seen any of the foreign language editions. one of my fave shots from the JG 300 book (Vol II) - Hubert Engst 6./JG 300 IIRC __________________ My modelling blog by FalkeEins My Luftwaffe blog by FalkeEins Jet & Prop by FalkeEins

07-23-2009, 02:42 PM	#13
seesul Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Zlin, Czech Republic Posts: 2,856	Neil or Erich, did Klaus Neumann join the German Luftwaffe after the WW2? And another question- what is the detailed difference between A-8/R2 and A-8/R8. The number of armour plates only? And the last question- what was the pure Sturmbock version- R2 or R8? __________________ Roman Susil Zlin, Czech Republic ...a friend of Joe Owsianik,So. Plainfield, NJ, a former left waist gunner from B-17G ''Tail End Charlie" from 2ndBG,20th Sqdn who was forced to bail out on Aug. 29th, 1944 over my country. Last edited by seesul; 07-23-2009 at 02:55 PM.

07-23-2009, 03:12 PM	#14
Erich the old Sage Join Date: May 2004 Location: Platonic Sphere Posts: 11,109	Roman I would have to check his bio, was writing one up 4-5 years ago but would have to dig it out, Neil may know more quickly than I and may have some different opinions as well on the R2 vs the R8. the R8 was suppose to be the standard SturmFw variant in November 44's end with the cowling fairings and no mg 131's the R2 could have them or could be removed and the cowlings faired over. the R2 flown by JG 301 especially in III. gruppe had no armor-extra but had outboard 3cm cannon and the mg 131's over the cowling. in JG 3, 4 and 300 the R2 had all the armor plating/ fittings but the R8 had the extra armor butted around the engine as well as the ammo boxes and some had leading wing edges armored...........as you might guess a real slow clumsy doof crate flying on the missions and when engaged by Us P-51's, was doomed the Panzer-Scheuklappen was standard on most Sturms in JG 3 but was removed in nearly all cases from JG 300 crates. JG 4 removed the canopy coverings after their disaster on 11 September 1944, although striking hard on the US 100th bg they were slow and shot down by return fire of the B-17's and US escorts from the 339th fg. Excess icing was a major concern forming between the armor glas covers and the canopy glas __________________ Rip it up !

07-23-2009, 03:23 PM	#15
seesul Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Zlin, Czech Republic Posts: 2,856	Thx Erich! I´ve just opened a new thread about those 2 versions before I saw your answer. No problem, feel free to discuss there as well http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/tec...nce-19820.html (Fw-190A-8/R2 and Fw-190A-8/R8 - the difference) __________________ Roman Susil Zlin, Czech Republic ...a friend of Joe Owsianik,So. Plainfield, NJ, a former left waist gunner from B-17G ''Tail End Charlie" from 2ndBG,20th Sqdn who was forced to bail out on Aug. 29th, 1944 over my country.

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