IAI Nesher and Mirage 5

[maxs75]

Is the following paragraph true? It's the first time that I hear that.

From www.acig.org:

"Very soon and again with the US help, the cooperation with France was re-established in a clandestine operation, which saw delivery of 50 „embargoed“ Mirage 5Js in crates to Israel with the help of US C-5 Galaxy transports. These aircraft were not the same 50 Mirage 5J built for Israel: these were taken by the French Air Force. Instead, between 1969 and 1971 Dassault has built a new series: the aircraft were paid for by the USA and then shipped to IAI, which put them together between late 1969 and 1973, explaining in the public that it was beginning production of an “indigenous” Israeli fighter, originally called Mirage Mod, but later Nesher. Officially, this was “possible” due to cooperation of a Swiss engineer who should have „revealed“ the secrets of Mirage 5 to Israel (and was even sentenced to several years of prison for doing this!). However, the company for which he was working was involved only in the production of Atar engines, and he could in no way have supplied the entire technical documentation need for the Israelis to build a completely new fighter. "

Max

[FLYBOYJ]

It probably is true and i think these had J-79s in them.....

[Glider]

Sounds like the USA went to a lot of trouble when they could have just supplied some F4's. For that reason alone I really don't know
The immediate need of the IAF was for spares for the Atar. France had a reputation for selling cheap jets but expensive spares and insisting that maintanence was undertaken in France. For this requirement the plans supplies by the Swiss engineer would have been beyond price.
FJ is right when pointing out that the Nesher had J79 giving them a healthy performance boost. Plus of course irriating the hell out of the French.

[FLYBOYJ]

Originally Posted by Glider

Sounds like the USA went to a lot of trouble when they could have just supplied some F4's. For that reason alone I really don't know
The immediate need of the IAF was for spares for the Atar. France had a reputation for selling cheap jets but expensive spares and insisting that maintanence was undertaken in France. For this requirement the plans supplies by the Swiss engineer would have been beyond price.
FJ is right when pointing out that the Nesher had J79 giving them a healthy performance boost. Plus of course irriating the hell out of the French.

I think at the time there was a restriction on US arms to Israel. In 1972 Nixion lifted that restriction and F-4s got sent there...

[maxs75]

Sorry. I realised that this is a WW2 forum only. I just saw "aircraft requests".

About Nesher: Nesher an un-licensed copy of Dassault Mirage 5. It was built in about 60 examples from 71 to 74 and was involved

in the Kippur war. Some of the fought the Falkland war with Argentinian AF. It retained the Atar engine.

IAI Kfir was instead an enhanced Nesher with J79 engine, and 200 were built from 75 to 86. Something similar happened to the

remaining Dassault Super Mystere B2 (anyway they weren't new build): they were up-engined with J52 engine (the same mounted on

A-4 Skyhawk, also in service in Israel).

The story of Nesher is usually the following: the plan were stolen by israeli 007 and it was produced by IAI. I was surprised

reading thet it was actually built by Dassault!

Probably the F-4 limitations were lifted before. The first squadrons were formed in 1969, and the F-4 fought the attrition war in

1969-1970

Max