P-38 Cockpit heating

[Sgt. Pappy]

With all the random sources out there, it's difficult to find some true answers.

Almost all sources name the Lightning as Der Gabelschwanz Teufel but that whole jazz seems made up propaganda.

So I'm trying to figure out the actual heating upgrades made to the P-38 in the cockpit and on the cockpit. That is, the pilot's heating and the defrosters. Was it the P-38J that introduced at least adequate heating, while the P-38L perfected it? Or did the heating just suck in all P-38's BUT the L? Some sources say that J's had horrible heating/defrosting, others say it was solved in the J.

My P-38H, J, L, F-5B pilot's manual states that 'late [P-38] airplanes' have heat ducted from both engines while earlier versions have heat only from the right engine and that 'later airplanes' have electrical heating equipment. Not much detail in the variants there.

So, question summary:

1) Was it the P-38J that introduced at least adequate heating, while the P-38L perfected it? Or did the heating just suck in all P-38's BUT the L?

2) Pilots speak highly of their P-38J's even in the ETO but were they really comfortable and able enough to fight at high alts?

3) If it was the P-38J, which subvariant solved the heating? J-15? J-25?

[A4K]

'Der Gabelschwanz Teufel' means the 'fork tailed devil'.

I have the pilots manual for the P-38 at home, so will check it out for ya over the weekend.

[Sgt. Pappy]

Thanks A4K! Much appreciated. Is it the same manual as mine?

Oh yes, I meant that Der Gabelschwanz Teufel was more American propaganda perhaps in order to make people think the Germans were absolutely terrified of it. More often than not, improper training for P-38 pilots meant that initially, the Germans didn't have much to fear until later models came out.

[A4K]

G'day mate!
Sounds like we've probably got the same manuals, as I couldn't get any more information than that out of mine. Sorry about that.

[HoHun]

Hi Sgt,

>Oh yes, I meant that Der Gabelschwanz Teufel was more American propaganda perhaps in order to make people think the Germans were absolutely terrified of it.

It might be more of a post-war invention by the writer and warbird lover Martin Caidin, from what I've heard.

I can tell you for certain that "Gabelschwanzteufel" is just one syllable short of a tongue twister, at least for my North German voice organ.

I'm sure that even if someone in the German forces had come up with that name, it would have been eroded to "Gabi" pretty quickly - a (once) rather popular girl's name in Germany.

The absence of references to "Gabelschwanzteufeln" or "Gabis" in books written by Luftwaffe airmen and the routine use of the name "Lightning" to describe the type leads me to conclude that the Germans never knew of this supposed nickname in WW2.

"Gabelschwanz" actually sounds more like an ornithological term, as the Red Kite and the Black Kite were called "Gabelweihen" ('forked harriers') for the shape of their tails. (You'll probably recognize the "...weihe" part of the name as it was applied to the Focke-Wulf Fw 58, too

I've seen an RLM-approved aircraft recognition book from WW2 that provided mnemonic names for the various types, such as "three-finger Ju" for the Ju 88 (for the looks of the short nose between the two produting engines), and it simply listed the P-38 as "zweischwänzige Lightning" ('twin-tailed Lightning').

Quite logical, as the tail does not actually fork!

Regards,

Henning (HoHun)

[Sgt. Pappy]

Hah then I'm right about the propaganda.

Thanks HoHun. So many books a.k.a. 'reliable resources' have said that the Germans called it the Gabelschwanz teufel, and the same books state the P-38J's weight IDENTICAL to the L which makes no sense... even the P-38J blocks prior to the J-25.

So I'm having a hard time with the details like cockpit heating, electrical equipment and so forth without running into false info. if anyone has some great, test-proven data on the P-38 (like weights) that may help me a lot. Thanks!

[A4K]

Interesting info Henning, thanks!

Will let you know if I find anything, Sgt.