Best Nightfighter of WW2 (Continued) - Aircraft of World War II

cheddar cheese · 03-08-2005, 02:42 PM

The only sense that lanc makes are smelly ones

(Yes, I know the spelling for that sentence is scents, but you get my drift.)

DAVIDICUS · 03-08-2005, 11:02 PM

Heinkel He-219 Uhu

Erich · 03-08-2005, 11:08 PM

why the Uhu ?

DAVIDICUS · 03-08-2005, 11:22 PM

http://www.nasm.si.edu/research/aero...einkel_219.htm

mosquitoman · 03-09-2005, 03:46 AM

It's the Mossie, that and the Beau defeated the blitz, it was also instrumental in removing the night-time threat to Malta

Erich · 03-09-2005, 08:08 AM

sorry DAvidicus but the Smithsonian article is bogus. The last production Heinkel 219 to serve on ops was the
A-2 variant. The A-5 , A-6 and A-7 never appeared. The operational record of I./NJG 1 flying the beast is at best dismal

KraziKanuK · 03-09-2005, 08:51 AM

Erich might shoot me down for this,

but the top speed usually listed (416mph) for the 219 was for an a/c that had been cleaned up > no antenna, no exhaust shrouds, and some other stuff removed which I have forgotten.

Erich · 03-09-2005, 09:42 AM

KK no I think the Uhu was a pig and the a/c probably did 375 mph max loaded in the air.

KraziKanuK · 03-09-2005, 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Erich

KK no I think the Uhu was a pig and the a/c probably did 375 mph max loaded in the air.

Erich, I agree. I think you read my post wrong. The number given for top speed is bogus as the a/c would not be of much operational without any radar antenna, yes? Unshrouded exhausts would be like a shooting star in a night sky, yes?

Erich · 03-09-2005, 01:26 PM

not necessarily. I just think the top speed of 416 is a bit much with all the radar aerials and given the fact the Uhu was a pretty good sized twin engine for the Germans. the Ju 88G-6 could even top out at 400 mph if pushed....

cheddar cheese · 03-09-2005, 02:34 PM

Best NF I say P-61

Erich · 03-09-2005, 03:00 PM

in the Pacific only...........

KraziKanuK · 03-09-2005, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Erich

not necessarily. I just think the top speed of 416 is a bit much with all the radar aerials and given the fact the Uhu was a pretty good sized twin engine for the Germans. the Ju 88G-6 could even top out at 400 mph if pushed....

Erich the nose was clean. Only the stubs were in place. The Mossie gained several mph when its exhaust shrouds were removed.

DAVIDICUS · 03-09-2005, 08:48 PM

I confess that I am unaware of the evidence disparaging the He-219.

What sources indicate that the He-219 was anything but a superb night fighter?

I think that the P-61C would have been a truly great night fighter but it never saw combat. I understand that the A and B versions were somewhat slow (370 mph).

delcyros · 03-10-2005, 01:06 PM

I agree, both, P-61C and He-219 were great nightfighters technically. But they also had little impact compared to the Mossie, the Me-110G and the Ju-88G. That is an important point, I belive. Even if they lack some speed and technical advantages, they managed to do the work over years pretty well. And the future belonged to jet driven nightfighters, anyway. I would vote for the Mossie, it proved to be reliable, it had excellent nightfighting capabilities, it was deployed in numbers and it stayed in front line use till the very end of ww2. I

03-08-2005, 11:02 PM	#2
DAVIDICUS Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 890	Heinkel He-219 Uhu __________________ . -=DAVIDICUS MAXIMUS=- .

03-08-2005, 11:08 PM	#3
Erich the old Sage Join Date: May 2004 Location: Platonic Sphere Posts: 11,113	why the Uhu ? __________________ Rip it up !

03-08-2005, 11:22 PM	#4
DAVIDICUS Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 890	http://www.nasm.si.edu/research/aero...einkel_219.htm __________________ . -=DAVIDICUS MAXIMUS=- .

03-09-2005, 03:46 AM	#5
mosquitoman Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Saffron Walden/Sheffield Posts: 2,991	It's the Mossie, that and the Beau defeated the blitz, it was also instrumental in removing the night-time threat to Malta __________________ When you realise that the light at the end of the tunnel is actually an oncoming train, you know it's time to run for your life

03-09-2005, 08:08 AM	#6
Erich the old Sage Join Date: May 2004 Location: Platonic Sphere Posts: 11,113	sorry DAvidicus but the Smithsonian article is bogus. The last production Heinkel 219 to serve on ops was the A-2 variant. The A-5 , A-6 and A-7 never appeared. The operational record of I./NJG 1 flying the beast is at best dismal __________________ Rip it up !

03-08-2005, 02:42 PM	#1
cheddar cheese Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: WSM, England Posts: 20,387	The only sense that lanc makes are smelly ones (Yes, I know the spelling for that sentence is scents, but you get my drift.)

03-09-2005, 08:51 AM	#7
KraziKanuK Banned Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 795	Erich might shoot me down for this, but the top speed usually listed (416mph) for the 219 was for an a/c that had been cleaned up > no antenna, no exhaust shrouds, and some other stuff removed which I have forgotten.

03-09-2005, 09:42 AM	#8
Erich the old Sage Join Date: May 2004 Location: Platonic Sphere Posts: 11,113	KK no I think the Uhu was a pig and the a/c probably did 375 mph max loaded in the air. __________________ Rip it up !

03-09-2005, 01:26 PM	#10
Erich the old Sage Join Date: May 2004 Location: Platonic Sphere Posts: 11,113	not necessarily. I just think the top speed of 416 is a bit much with all the radar aerials and given the fact the Uhu was a pretty good sized twin engine for the Germans. the Ju 88G-6 could even top out at 400 mph if pushed.... __________________ Rip it up !

03-09-2005, 02:34 PM	#11
cheddar cheese Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: WSM, England Posts: 20,387	Best NF I say P-61

03-09-2005, 03:00 PM	#12
Erich the old Sage Join Date: May 2004 Location: Platonic Sphere Posts: 11,113	in the Pacific only........... __________________ Rip it up !

03-09-2005, 08:48 PM	#14
DAVIDICUS Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 890	I confess that I am unaware of the evidence disparaging the He-219. What sources indicate that the He-219 was anything but a superb night fighter? I think that the P-61C would have been a truly great night fighter but it never saw combat. I understand that the A and B versions were somewhat slow (370 mph). __________________ . -=DAVIDICUS MAXIMUS=- .

03-10-2005, 01:06 PM	#15
delcyros Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Berlin (Kreuzberg) Posts: 1,753	I agree, both, P-61C and He-219 were great nightfighters technically. But they also had little impact compared to the Mossie, the Me-110G and the Ju-88G. That is an important point, I belive. Even if they lack some speed and technical advantages, they managed to do the work over years pretty well. And the future belonged to jet driven nightfighters, anyway. I would vote for the Mossie, it proved to be reliable, it had excellent nightfighting capabilities, it was deployed in numbers and it stayed in front line use till the very end of ww2. I __________________ ---delcyros---

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