Best strafing aircraft in WWII???

[Marcel]

Originally Posted by comiso90

Perhaps we should decide what strafing is....
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Strafing - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Strafing (adaptation of German strafen, to punish, specifically from the World War I humorous adaptation of the German catchphrase "Gott strafe England"), is the practice of firing on a static, or mobile targets of opportunity on land, sea, or air from a flying platform. The term is usually applied to machine gun or cannon fire from a variety of aircraft such as fixed-wing aircraft, helicopters, or unmanned aerial vehicles.

The thread is not about ground attack in general.. it is about strafing.

...

So firing a 75 mm from a B25 on either ship or vehicle is considered to be strafing according to your definition

Does anybody know if the 75 mm was ever effective?

[comiso90]

Originally Posted by Marcel

So firing a 75 mm from a B25 on either ship or vehicle is considered to be strafing according to your definition

Does anybody know if the 75 mm was ever effective?

it was very effective against ships!

The rate of fire was so damn slow. Lobbing a couple shells is not strafing by my definition...

B-25 Mitchell - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


>> Due to its low rate of fire (approximately four shells could be fired in a single strafing run and relative ineffectiveness against ground targets, the 75mm cannon was sometimes removed from both G and H models and replaced with two additional .50-caliber machine guns as a field modification.[2] T
No other bomber of World War II carried as many guns. However, the first 555 B-25Js (the B-25J-1-NC production block) were delivered without the fuselage package guns, because it was discovered that muzzle blast from these guns was causing severe stress in the fuselage next to the muzzles; while later production runs returned these guns, they were often removed as a field modification for that same reason.[4] In all, 4,318 B-25Js were built.

[Glider]

I admit that my understanding was that the 75mm wasn't very effective. Its rate of fire was so slow that only one or two shots could be fired in an attack run and few ships were ever sunk or even badly damaged after being hit by one or two 75mm shells.
Rockets were considered more effective as each rocket was four to five times more effective that one shell plus of course a number of them were fired on each pass.

Another factor being the stress the shell put on the aircraft which was significant.

[comiso90]

Dont get me wrong... I LOVE the B25J... effective or not, the idea of a Doolittle raider with a Sherman tank round makes me smile.

<pause for smile>

But for me, the mechanical rattle of hundreds or thousands of rounds of led rapidly spewed from a fast mover screaming on the deck while violently butchering flesh into crimson mist and transforming iron into twisted, scorched and shattered shards is the essence of strafing.


The occasional thud of a low velocity round, although fearsome, does not instill as much fear as a Beaufighter, Tempest or Thunderbolt..

What is the average rounds delivered during an "average" strafing for 20mm equipped warbirds? Some planes had a flatter angle of attack, thus more target time, but is there an average? ...

Which is more effective? 1000 of .50 cal rounds or 300 20MM rounds? (or whatever the ratio is)

[trackend]

The hispano 20mm was around 600 rounds per minute which is on a par with the .5, agreed with 14 .5's its a much higher rate of fire , the .5 is excellent and 600+ m/s is not bad the Hispano was 800+m/s so could take on tougher targets with a mix of hard and explosive rounds while the .303 took on the anti personel role IMO I think it was a could balance.

[filnorm]

Originally Posted by comiso90

The 75 mm cannon on the B25 was designed for anti-shipping in the pacific. In my mind, that is not strafing. Thats anti-shipping attack.

Well, if they used a mounted weapon (event though it was this caliber) it could be cosidered starfing (referring to the definition taken from Wikipedia)...
Regards, Filip

[comiso90]

Originally Posted by filnorm

Well, if they used a mounted weapon (event though it was this caliber) it could be cosidered starfing (referring to the definition taken from Wikipedia)...
Regards, Filip

I dont disagree.. but i think rate of fire weighs heavily...
lobing a couple rounds is not enveloping a targrt in a rain of led

[Glider]

Beaufighter 4 x 20mm each 10 rps + 6 x 303 each 20 rps = 160 rps
B25 14 x 0.5 each 13rps = 182 rps

Throw in the explosive content of the 20mm and there is nothing in it.

Has anyone realised how dumb this debate is. Does anyone fancy their chances in front of either of these aircraft?

[comiso90]

Originally Posted by Glider

Beaufighter 4 x 20mm each 10 rps + 6 x 303 each 20 rps = 160 rps
B25 14 x 0.5 each 13rps = 182 rps

Throw in the explosive content of the 20mm and there is nothing in it.

Has anyone realised how dumb this debate is. Does anyone fancy their chances in front of either of these aircraft?

Beaufighter is freakin awesome!... lots of rounds on target! In the strafing role..
i'd rather have 4 x 20 mm than one 75

[Marcel]

Originally Posted by comiso90

i'd rather have 4 x 20 mm than one 75

That's for sure. With a 75 mm you only have 1 shot a go

[The Basket]

I remember one Hurricane pilot saying he fired his 303s against a German tank in the battle of france. The tank commander closed his hatch and tank carried on its way.

You only get an ooooh with Typhoon. And with this Hawker fighter, the rounds didn't bounce.

[filnorm]

Does anyone have any detailed info on strafing missions of B-25Js in PTO (tagets, claims, units etc.)?

[drgondog]

This is an interesting debate because it begs the question, most devastating or most effective.

The Pappy Gunn modified B-25s had a crucial impact on the Battle of Bismark Sea when the Japanese tried to move reinforcements to New Gunea and then made major contributions from that time forward in missions from sinking troop transports and freighters with water line stikes from 10-14 .50's plus skip bombing with 250 to 500 ponders - or laying parafrags.

But wouyld it have survived in ETO? As Erich mentioned the 355th had the best total of German a/c destroyed on the ground and pioneered strafing of German airfields - but lost 92+ to German flak - twice as many as lost battling German fighters.. Itwas strafing at 350-400mph in shallow dives, quick strikes - one group to shoot up flak batteries - the rest to hammer the a/c.

B-25s, Beaufighters, etc would not do well in these missions.. Tempest, P-47s and Mustangs did this well and Mustangs did the most on German airfields and deep transportation strikes but more vulnerable..

If I was making a living strafing, deep in heavily defended areas, it would be in a Jug - the key is range here coupled with heavy firepower and relative survivability against both flak and fighters.

The A-26 takes top honors of the twin engine attack bombers, I believe

[Glider]

As ever a good point. The anti shipping wings of the RAF operated with some success against German naval forces off the coast of Europe and they were equipped with Beaufighters and Mossies. Normally the Rocket armed Beaus went for the AA escorts and the torpedo armed Beaus for the merchant vessels.
Obviously they were not equipped with B25's so no comparison can be made.

Its interesting to speculate how well the larger and/or slower B25's, B26 and Bostons would have been in a similar role. The German fighters were a significant risk being close to the coast and normally escorted the convoys. They would I suggest have been a larger risk than in the Far East due to the distances involved.

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Id have to go with the rugged P-47.