Elvis
Chief Master Sergeant
Thanks for the clarification.
...then I guess my choice (allied), for now, is going to be "The Good Ship Lollypop".
I don't think even the B-25 was operational by '39, was it?
Elvis
best twin/triple engined bomber at outbreak world war II
- Thread starter Vincenzo
- Start date
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Thanks for the clarification.
...then I guess my choice (allied), for now, is going to be "The Good Ship Lollypop".
I don't think even the B-25 was operational by '39, was it?
Elvis
- Thread starter
- #42
Elvis
Chief Master Sergeant
...are we sure about that?...
Elvis
National Museum of the USAF said:
AcePilots.com said:
Greg Goebel's vectorsite.net said:
Elvis
Elvis
Chief Master Sergeant
Vincenzo,
After posting that, I see it may appear that I'm being a bit rude, so hopefully I haven't offended.
I only wanted to show the acceptance date from multiple sources, so it didn't look like I was taking the word of one website over the entire internet.
...and so, again, it looks like "The Good Ship Lollypop".
Elvis
After posting that, I see it may appear that I'm being a bit rude, so hopefully I haven't offended.
I only wanted to show the acceptance date from multiple sources, so it didn't look like I was taking the word of one website over the entire internet.
...and so, again, it looks like "The Good Ship Lollypop".
Elvis
- Thread starter
- #45
FLYBOYJ
"THE GREAT GAZOO"
True - the first production B-25 flight took place August 19, 1940.
Fascinating aircraft. Trounced in an Air Corps "Figure of Merit" scoring system in search of a new Attack-Bomber, the Maryland (design M/-5) received a score of 718 compared to the winning design, the Douglas DB-7 (design DS-4) of 905.
Glenn Martin wasn't too concerned as orders from the French were forthcoming as a result of changes to the Arms Embargo Act in October 1939.
Nevertheless in the right hands it proved to be a very capable aircraft. The British used it in the Middle East for reconnaissance, bombing and with an aggressive pilot, as a fighter. Flight Lieutenant Adrian Warburton ended with a score of 10 kills "in a short space of time" with the Maryland.
It had a very thin fuselage, replicated with the Baltimore. Story has it that James H. McDonnell designed the very slender fuselage based on the physical measurements of another Martin designer, Peyton M. Magruder (who went on to design the B-26 Marauder). He sat him down, added two inches to each side, and this established the maximum width of the fuselage.
Elvis
Chief Master Sergeant
...you realize the DB-7 eventually became the A-20 Havoc, right?
Actually, looking over the stats, both planes (Maryland and Havoc) had similar payloads and overall performance.
Eventually, the A-20 doubled its bombload (4K lbs., vs. 2K lbs.) with the addition of hardpoints under the wings to carry additional bombs.
Elvis
Actually, looking over the stats, both planes (Maryland and Havoc) had similar payloads and overall performance.
Eventually, the A-20 doubled its bombload (4K lbs., vs. 2K lbs.) with the addition of hardpoints under the wings to carry additional bombs.
Elvis
- Thread starter
- #49
For help me and you all in the choice i give more complete info on the planes, i exclude more old design.
Bristol Blenheim IV (2 Bristol Mercury XV 920 hp, 905 hp at TO, 995 HP max for 5')
crew: 3 Wing span 17.17 m Lenght 12.98 m. Wing area 43.57 m^.
weight: empty 4441 kg max 6532 kg (load 6122 kg).
fuel: 2125 liters, oil 117 liters (can add 2 tank of 227 liters in bomb bays)
bombs: internal 454 kg, external 145 kg
weapons: 3/5 7.7 mm
Speed max 428 km/h at 3595 m.
cruise 319 km/h at optimum alt.
ceiling 8.31 km (6.7 at full load)
at 1524 m. in 3.7'
at 3048 m. in 7.2'
climb slight over 450 m./1'
range 2350 km (full internal fuel, 454 kg bombs, cruise at 272 km/h)
range 3140 km (full internal fuel no bombs)
Handley Page Hampden I (2 Bristol Pegasus XVIII, 1050 hp)
crew: 4 W. S. 21.08 m., L. 16.33 m., W. A. 62.06 m^
weight: empty 5344 kg, max 9525 kg
fuel: 2973 liters
bombs: internal 1814 kg
weapons: 4 7.7 mm
speed max 409 km/h at 4205 m.
cruise economical 269 km/h at 4572 m, max 349 km/h at 4572 m.
ceiling 5.79 km
at 4572 in 18' 54''
climb 299 m/1'
range 3034 km (with 907 kg bombs)
range 1762 km (full load)
Vickers Wellington IA (2 Bristol Pegasus XVIII 1050 Hp)
crew: 6 W.S. 26.26 m., L. 19.69 m. W.A. 78.04 m^
weight: empty 8611 kg, max 12701 kg
fuel: 3167 liters
bombs: internal 2041 kg
weapons: 6 7.7 mm
speed max 379 km/h at 4724 m. (maybe over max speed)
cruise from 232 to 290 km/h
ceiling: 5.79 km
at 4050 in 25' (IC)
range 4102 km (with 454 kg bombs)
range 2904 km (not indicated, maybe full load)
Armstrong Whitworth Whitley IV (2 Rolls Royce Merlin IV, 1030 Hp at TO)
W.S. 25.6 m. L 21.25 m. W.A. 105.5 m^
weight: empty 7840 kg max 11773 kg (maybe load not max load)
fuel: 3205 liters (max 3800 liters maybe using some bomb bays)
bombs ?
weapons: 5 7.7 mm
speed max 394 km/h at 4870
cruise max 352 km/h at 4560
ceiling ?
at 4560 in 16'
climb ?
range 2896 km (max?)
Lockheed Hudson I (2 Wright R 1820 G102A, 1100 Hp at TO)
crew: 5 W.S. 19.96 m. L. 13.51 m. W.A. 51.14 m^
weight: empty 5484 kg max 8845 kg (load 7938 kg)
fuel: 2438 liters
bombs: internal 635 kg
weapons: 4 7.7 mm
speed max 396 km/h at 1980 m.
cruise 354 km/h
ceiling 7.62 km
at 3050 m. in 10'
climb 664 m/1' (other 472 m/1')
range 3154 km (max)
Martin Model 139 WH3A (2 Wright R 1820 G105A, 1000 Hp)
crew: 4 W.S. 21.48 m., L. 13.63 m., W.A. 65.35 m^
weight: empty 4682 kg, load 7087 kg
fuel ?
bombs: internal 1025 kg
weapons: 3 7.7 mm
speed max ~385 km/h
cruise ~295 km/h
ceilling 8.6 km
at 2894 m. in 4.9'
range 2760 km (max)
Douglas B-18A Bolo (2 Wright R1820 G53, 1000 Hp at TO)
crew: 6 W.S. 27.28 m., L. 17.63 m., W.A. 82.65 m^
weight: empty 7403 kg, max 12552 kg
fuel: over 3000 liters
bombs: internal 1996 kg (or 2948 kg)
weapons: 3 7.7 mm
speed max 347 km/h at 3056 m.
cruise 269 km/h
ceiling 7.28 km
at 3056 m. in 9.9'
climb 312 m/1'
range: 1850 km (with 1133 kg bombs)
range: 3400 km (max)
Mitsubishi Ki 21 Ia (Army Type 97 Heavy Bomber Model 1A) (2 Nakajima Ha-5 KAI, 950 Hp at TO, 1080 max)
crew: 5 W.S. 22.5 m., L. 16 m., W.A. 69.6 m^
weight: empty 4691 kg, max 7916 kg (7492 kg load)
fuel: 2635 liters
bombs: internal 1000 kg
weapons: 3 7.7 mm
speed max 432 km/h at 4000 m.
ceiling: 8.6 km
at 5000 m. in 13' 55''
climb 350/1'
range 1500 km (max bomb load)
range 2700 km (max fuel load)
note probably the Ib was in service they had 5 7.7 mgs and a more large bomb bay.
Mitsubishi G3M2a (Navy Type 96 Attack Bomber Model 21) (2 Mitsubishi Kinsei 41 or 42, 1075 Hp at TO)
crew: 5 W.S. 25 m., L. 16.45 m., W.A. 75 m^ (some report 84.3)
weight: empty ~4965 kg, loaded ~8000 kg
fuel: 3874 liters
bombs: external 800 kg
weapons: 3 7.7 mm
speed max 374 at 4180 (2b, for 2a max speed maybe near but a more low quote 2800m)
cruise ~275 km/h
ceiling 9.13 km
at 3000 in 8'19''
climb 360m/1'
range 4380 km (max)
note many data for model 22 difference this had more weapons so slight more heavy, the engine kinsei 45 max is at 4km (1000 hp) instead of 2.8 km (990 hp) of kinsei 41/42
Tupolev SB 2M103 (2 M 103, 960 Hp)
crew: 4 W.S. 20.33 m., L. 12.27, W.A. 56.7 m^
weight: empty 4427 kg, max 7750 kg (6175 kg load)
fuel: 1670 liters (+ 2 external tank 368 liters each)
bombs: internal 600 kg, external 1000 kg
weapons: 4 7.7 mm
speed max 419 km/h at 4000 m.
speed max 358 km/h at 0
ceiling 9.6 km
at 4000 m. in 7.45'
at 5000 m. in 8.4'
range 1800 km
note there is a late variant SB bis 3, small series, with some refinement this the difference: (lenght 12.24 load weight 6013 kg vel max 445 km/h at 4.5 km, range 1600 km)
Ilyushin DB-3 model 1939 (2 M87A, 950 Hp)
crew: 3 W.S. 21.44 m, L. 14.22 m., W.A.. 65.6 m^
weight: empty 5030 kg, max 9450 kg (7445 kg load)
fuel: ? (can use also 2 drop tank)
bombs: internal 1000 kg, external 2000 kg (max 2500 kg)
weapons: 3 7.7 mm
speed max 439 km/h at 4900 m.
speed max 345 km/h at 0 m.
cruise 320 km/h
ceiling 9.6 km
at 1000 m. in 2.4'
at 5000 m. in 12.1'
range 3800 km
note not 100% sure that this version was operational.
P.Z.L. 37 (2 Bristol Pegasus XX, 925 Hp, 970 Hp max, 909 Hp normal?)
crew: 4 W.S. 17.93 m., L. 12.92 m., W.A. 53.5 m^
weight: empty 4935 kg, max 9105 kg, (load 8880 kg, some report 4263 kg empty)
fuel: ?
bombs: internal 2400 kg
weapons: 3 7.92 mm
speed max 412km/h at 2800 m.
ceiling 5.9 km (full load)
climb 282m./1'
range 2600 km (?)
range 1500 km (full bombs)
Dornier Do 17Z-2 (2 Bramo 323P Fafnir, 1000 Hp)
crew: 4 W.S. 18 m., L. 15.8 m., W.A. 55 m^
weights: empty 5210 kg, max 8845 kg
fuel: 1550 liters, oil 204 liters (auxiliary tank in a bomb bay 896 liters)
bombs: internal 1000 kg
weapons: 4/6 7.92 mm
speed max 424 km/h at 4000
ceiling 8.15 km
at 1000 m. in 3'18''
climb 390 m./1'
range 1150 km (500 kg bombs)
range 3000 km (max fuel not bombs)
Junkers Ju 86G-1 (2 Bramo 132N, 865 Hp at TO)
crew: 4 W.S. 22.5 m., L. 17.5 m., W.A. 82 m^
weights: empty 5200 kg load 8230 kg
fuel: 1500 liters
bomb: internal 1000 kg
weapons: 3 7.92 mm
speed max 378 km/h
speed max 330 km/h at 0 m.
cruise max 340 km/h
ceiling 7.7 km
range 1400 km
Junkers Ju 88A-0 (2 Jumo 211 B1 1200 Hp)
crew: 4, W.S. 18.38, L. 14.36 m., W.A. 52.5 m^
weights: empty 7700 kg, max 12600 kg (load 10400 kg)
fuel: 1660 liters (+ auxiliary tanks in bomb bays 1215 liters and 680 liters + also 2 drop tank)
bombs: internal 1400 kg external 1500 kg (max 2400 kg)
weapons: 3 7.92 mm
speed max 450 km/h at 5500 m.
speed max 363 km/h at 0 m.
cruise max 350 km/h at 3500 m.
ceiling 9.8 km
climb 552m./1'
range 3677 km (max fuel and 500 kg bombs)
range 1258 km (max bombs (2400 kg) and internal fuel (1660 liters))
note only ten build in I/KG25
Heinkel He 111H-2 (2 Jumo 211A, 1000 Hp)
crew: 4, W.S. 22.6 m., L. 16.4 m., W.A. 87.6 m^
weights: empty 6740 kg, max 12600 kg
fuel: 3400 liters (+ auxiliary and drop tanks)
bombs: internal 2000 kg, external 2000 kg (max 2500 kg)
weapons: 3 7.92 mm
speed max 435 km/h at 6000 m.
ceiling 6.5 km
range 2000 km (?)
Fokker T V (2 Bristol Pegasus XXVI, 925 Hp)
crew: 5 W.S. 21, L. 16, W.A. 60.2 m^
weights: empty 4700 kg, max 7250 kg
fuel: ?
bombs: internal 1000 kg (most for true only 400 kg not just track)
weapons: 5 7.92 mm 1 20 mm
speedl max 417 km/h a 2800 m.
cruise 350 km/h
ceiling 7.5 km
range 1550 km (?)
Bloch MB 131 (2 Gnome et Rhône 14N10 or 11, 910 Hp at TO)
crew: 4, W.S. 20.27 m., L. 17.85 m., W.A. 52.05 m^
weights: 6050 kg, max 8600 kg
fuel: ?
bombs: internal 800 kg
weapons: 3 7.5 mm
speed max 385 km/h at 4000 m.
cruise 270 km/h
at 4000 in 11'
ceiling 7.25 km
climb 306m./1'
range 1200 km (max, maybe radius)
Lioré et Olivier LeO 451 (2 Gnome et Rhône 14N48 or 49, 1140 Hp at TO)
crew: 4, W.S. 22.52 m., L. 17 m., W.A. 68 m^)
weights: empty 7820 kg, max 11400 kg
fuel: 3225 liters, oil 170 liters
bombs: internal 1400 kg, external possible
weapons: 2 7.5 mm, 1 20 mm
speed max 495 km/h at 4800 m.
cruise max 420 km/h
ceiling 9 km
at 5000 in 14'
range 2300 km (with 500 kg bombs)
note only 5 operational in GB I/31
Potez 633 (2 Gnome et Rhône 14M6, 670 Hp)
crew: 2, W.S. 16 m., L. 11.07 m., W.A. 32.7 m^
weights: empty 2900 kg, max 4500 kg
fuel: 760 liters
bombs: internal 400 kg, external 200 kg
weapons: 2 7.5 mm
speed max 440 km/h at 4000 m.
ceiling 8 km
at 4000 m. in 8'30''
climb 570 m./1'
range 1300 km
Breda Ba 88 Lince (2 Piaggio XI RC40, 1000 Hp)
crew: 2, W.S. 15.6 m., L. 10.79 m, W.A. 33.34 m^
weights: empty 4650 kg, max 6750 kg
fuel: ?
bombs: internal 1000 kg
weapons: 1 7.7 mm, 3 12.7 mm
speed max 490 km/h at 4500 m.
ceiling 8 km
at 3000 m. in 7'30''
at 6000 m. in 15'19''
range 1640 km (?)
Caproni Ca. 135 (2 Isotta Fraschini Asso XI RC40, 825 Hp)
crew: 4, W.S. 18.8, L. 13.7, W.A. 60 m^
weights: empty 5600 kg, max 8400 kg
fuel: ?
bombs: internal 1600 kg
weapons:2 7.7 mm, 2 12.7 mm
speed max 365 km/h
ceiling 7.9 km
at 4000 m. in 16'45''
range 1600 km (?)
Fiat B.R. 20 Cicogna (2 Fiat A80, 1000 Hp)
crew: 4, W.S. 21.54 m., L. 16.98 m., W.A. 74.07 m^
weights: empty 6500 kg, max 10100 kg
fuel: 3600 liters
bombs: 1600 kg
weapons: 4 7.7 mm (only first 20), 2 7.7 mm, 1 12.7 mm (others)
speed max 430 km/h at 4000 m.
speed max 330 km/h at 0
cruise 343 km/h at 4850 m.
ceiling 7.6 km
at 5000 m. in 17'56''
at 3000 m. in 9'58''
at 6000 m. in 25'30''
range 1240 km (with 1000 kg bombs)
range 1920 km (normal ?)
range 3000 km (max)
Savoia Marchetti S.M. 79 Sparviero (3 Alfa Romeo 126 RC34, 780 Hp at TO)
crew: 4/5, W.S. 21. m., L. 15.8 m., W.A. 61.7 m^
weights: empty 6800 kg, max 10480 kg
fuel: 2550 kg
bombs: 1250 kg
weapons: 1 7.7 mm, 3 12.7 mm
speed max 430 km/h at 4000
speed max 360 km/h at 0
cruise speed 350/375 km/h
ceiling: 6.5 km (full load)
at 5000 m. in 19'45''
at 3000 m. in 9'15''
range 1900 km (with ? bombs)
range 3300 km (max)
Cant Z. 1007 Alcione (3 Isotta Fraschini Asso XI RC40, 825 Hp)
crew: 5, W.S. 24.8 m., L. 16.15 m., W.A. 75.3 m^
weights: empty 8210 kg, max 12210 kg
fuel: ?
bombs: ? (Bis load is 1200 kg)
weapons: 3 7.7 mm, 1 12.7 mm
speed max 430 km/h at 5000
cruise 366 km/h
ceiling 6.65 Km
at 4000 in 10'15''
range 2700 km (?)
Bristol Blenheim IV (2 Bristol Mercury XV 920 hp, 905 hp at TO, 995 HP max for 5')
crew: 3 Wing span 17.17 m Lenght 12.98 m. Wing area 43.57 m^.
weight: empty 4441 kg max 6532 kg (load 6122 kg).
fuel: 2125 liters, oil 117 liters (can add 2 tank of 227 liters in bomb bays)
bombs: internal 454 kg, external 145 kg
weapons: 3/5 7.7 mm
Speed max 428 km/h at 3595 m.
cruise 319 km/h at optimum alt.
ceiling 8.31 km (6.7 at full load)
at 1524 m. in 3.7'
at 3048 m. in 7.2'
climb slight over 450 m./1'
range 2350 km (full internal fuel, 454 kg bombs, cruise at 272 km/h)
range 3140 km (full internal fuel no bombs)
Handley Page Hampden I (2 Bristol Pegasus XVIII, 1050 hp)
crew: 4 W. S. 21.08 m., L. 16.33 m., W. A. 62.06 m^
weight: empty 5344 kg, max 9525 kg
fuel: 2973 liters
bombs: internal 1814 kg
weapons: 4 7.7 mm
speed max 409 km/h at 4205 m.
cruise economical 269 km/h at 4572 m, max 349 km/h at 4572 m.
ceiling 5.79 km
at 4572 in 18' 54''
climb 299 m/1'
range 3034 km (with 907 kg bombs)
range 1762 km (full load)
Vickers Wellington IA (2 Bristol Pegasus XVIII 1050 Hp)
crew: 6 W.S. 26.26 m., L. 19.69 m. W.A. 78.04 m^
weight: empty 8611 kg, max 12701 kg
fuel: 3167 liters
bombs: internal 2041 kg
weapons: 6 7.7 mm
speed max 379 km/h at 4724 m. (maybe over max speed)
cruise from 232 to 290 km/h
ceiling: 5.79 km
at 4050 in 25' (IC)
range 4102 km (with 454 kg bombs)
range 2904 km (not indicated, maybe full load)
Armstrong Whitworth Whitley IV (2 Rolls Royce Merlin IV, 1030 Hp at TO)
W.S. 25.6 m. L 21.25 m. W.A. 105.5 m^
weight: empty 7840 kg max 11773 kg (maybe load not max load)
fuel: 3205 liters (max 3800 liters maybe using some bomb bays)
bombs ?
weapons: 5 7.7 mm
speed max 394 km/h at 4870
cruise max 352 km/h at 4560
ceiling ?
at 4560 in 16'
climb ?
range 2896 km (max?)
Lockheed Hudson I (2 Wright R 1820 G102A, 1100 Hp at TO)
crew: 5 W.S. 19.96 m. L. 13.51 m. W.A. 51.14 m^
weight: empty 5484 kg max 8845 kg (load 7938 kg)
fuel: 2438 liters
bombs: internal 635 kg
weapons: 4 7.7 mm
speed max 396 km/h at 1980 m.
cruise 354 km/h
ceiling 7.62 km
at 3050 m. in 10'
climb 664 m/1' (other 472 m/1')
range 3154 km (max)
Martin Model 139 WH3A (2 Wright R 1820 G105A, 1000 Hp)
crew: 4 W.S. 21.48 m., L. 13.63 m., W.A. 65.35 m^
weight: empty 4682 kg, load 7087 kg
fuel ?
bombs: internal 1025 kg
weapons: 3 7.7 mm
speed max ~385 km/h
cruise ~295 km/h
ceilling 8.6 km
at 2894 m. in 4.9'
range 2760 km (max)
Douglas B-18A Bolo (2 Wright R1820 G53, 1000 Hp at TO)
crew: 6 W.S. 27.28 m., L. 17.63 m., W.A. 82.65 m^
weight: empty 7403 kg, max 12552 kg
fuel: over 3000 liters
bombs: internal 1996 kg (or 2948 kg)
weapons: 3 7.7 mm
speed max 347 km/h at 3056 m.
cruise 269 km/h
ceiling 7.28 km
at 3056 m. in 9.9'
climb 312 m/1'
range: 1850 km (with 1133 kg bombs)
range: 3400 km (max)
Mitsubishi Ki 21 Ia (Army Type 97 Heavy Bomber Model 1A) (2 Nakajima Ha-5 KAI, 950 Hp at TO, 1080 max)
crew: 5 W.S. 22.5 m., L. 16 m., W.A. 69.6 m^
weight: empty 4691 kg, max 7916 kg (7492 kg load)
fuel: 2635 liters
bombs: internal 1000 kg
weapons: 3 7.7 mm
speed max 432 km/h at 4000 m.
ceiling: 8.6 km
at 5000 m. in 13' 55''
climb 350/1'
range 1500 km (max bomb load)
range 2700 km (max fuel load)
note probably the Ib was in service they had 5 7.7 mgs and a more large bomb bay.
Mitsubishi G3M2a (Navy Type 96 Attack Bomber Model 21) (2 Mitsubishi Kinsei 41 or 42, 1075 Hp at TO)
crew: 5 W.S. 25 m., L. 16.45 m., W.A. 75 m^ (some report 84.3)
weight: empty ~4965 kg, loaded ~8000 kg
fuel: 3874 liters
bombs: external 800 kg
weapons: 3 7.7 mm
speed max 374 at 4180 (2b, for 2a max speed maybe near but a more low quote 2800m)
cruise ~275 km/h
ceiling 9.13 km
at 3000 in 8'19''
climb 360m/1'
range 4380 km (max)
note many data for model 22 difference this had more weapons so slight more heavy, the engine kinsei 45 max is at 4km (1000 hp) instead of 2.8 km (990 hp) of kinsei 41/42
Tupolev SB 2M103 (2 M 103, 960 Hp)
crew: 4 W.S. 20.33 m., L. 12.27, W.A. 56.7 m^
weight: empty 4427 kg, max 7750 kg (6175 kg load)
fuel: 1670 liters (+ 2 external tank 368 liters each)
bombs: internal 600 kg, external 1000 kg
weapons: 4 7.7 mm
speed max 419 km/h at 4000 m.
speed max 358 km/h at 0
ceiling 9.6 km
at 4000 m. in 7.45'
at 5000 m. in 8.4'
range 1800 km
note there is a late variant SB bis 3, small series, with some refinement this the difference: (lenght 12.24 load weight 6013 kg vel max 445 km/h at 4.5 km, range 1600 km)
Ilyushin DB-3 model 1939 (2 M87A, 950 Hp)
crew: 3 W.S. 21.44 m, L. 14.22 m., W.A.. 65.6 m^
weight: empty 5030 kg, max 9450 kg (7445 kg load)
fuel: ? (can use also 2 drop tank)
bombs: internal 1000 kg, external 2000 kg (max 2500 kg)
weapons: 3 7.7 mm
speed max 439 km/h at 4900 m.
speed max 345 km/h at 0 m.
cruise 320 km/h
ceiling 9.6 km
at 1000 m. in 2.4'
at 5000 m. in 12.1'
range 3800 km
note not 100% sure that this version was operational.
P.Z.L. 37 (2 Bristol Pegasus XX, 925 Hp, 970 Hp max, 909 Hp normal?)
crew: 4 W.S. 17.93 m., L. 12.92 m., W.A. 53.5 m^
weight: empty 4935 kg, max 9105 kg, (load 8880 kg, some report 4263 kg empty)
fuel: ?
bombs: internal 2400 kg
weapons: 3 7.92 mm
speed max 412km/h at 2800 m.
ceiling 5.9 km (full load)
climb 282m./1'
range 2600 km (?)
range 1500 km (full bombs)
Dornier Do 17Z-2 (2 Bramo 323P Fafnir, 1000 Hp)
crew: 4 W.S. 18 m., L. 15.8 m., W.A. 55 m^
weights: empty 5210 kg, max 8845 kg
fuel: 1550 liters, oil 204 liters (auxiliary tank in a bomb bay 896 liters)
bombs: internal 1000 kg
weapons: 4/6 7.92 mm
speed max 424 km/h at 4000
ceiling 8.15 km
at 1000 m. in 3'18''
climb 390 m./1'
range 1150 km (500 kg bombs)
range 3000 km (max fuel not bombs)
Junkers Ju 86G-1 (2 Bramo 132N, 865 Hp at TO)
crew: 4 W.S. 22.5 m., L. 17.5 m., W.A. 82 m^
weights: empty 5200 kg load 8230 kg
fuel: 1500 liters
bomb: internal 1000 kg
weapons: 3 7.92 mm
speed max 378 km/h
speed max 330 km/h at 0 m.
cruise max 340 km/h
ceiling 7.7 km
range 1400 km
Junkers Ju 88A-0 (2 Jumo 211 B1 1200 Hp)
crew: 4, W.S. 18.38, L. 14.36 m., W.A. 52.5 m^
weights: empty 7700 kg, max 12600 kg (load 10400 kg)
fuel: 1660 liters (+ auxiliary tanks in bomb bays 1215 liters and 680 liters + also 2 drop tank)
bombs: internal 1400 kg external 1500 kg (max 2400 kg)
weapons: 3 7.92 mm
speed max 450 km/h at 5500 m.
speed max 363 km/h at 0 m.
cruise max 350 km/h at 3500 m.
ceiling 9.8 km
climb 552m./1'
range 3677 km (max fuel and 500 kg bombs)
range 1258 km (max bombs (2400 kg) and internal fuel (1660 liters))
note only ten build in I/KG25
Heinkel He 111H-2 (2 Jumo 211A, 1000 Hp)
crew: 4, W.S. 22.6 m., L. 16.4 m., W.A. 87.6 m^
weights: empty 6740 kg, max 12600 kg
fuel: 3400 liters (+ auxiliary and drop tanks)
bombs: internal 2000 kg, external 2000 kg (max 2500 kg)
weapons: 3 7.92 mm
speed max 435 km/h at 6000 m.
ceiling 6.5 km
range 2000 km (?)
Fokker T V (2 Bristol Pegasus XXVI, 925 Hp)
crew: 5 W.S. 21, L. 16, W.A. 60.2 m^
weights: empty 4700 kg, max 7250 kg
fuel: ?
bombs: internal 1000 kg (most for true only 400 kg not just track)
weapons: 5 7.92 mm 1 20 mm
speedl max 417 km/h a 2800 m.
cruise 350 km/h
ceiling 7.5 km
range 1550 km (?)
Bloch MB 131 (2 Gnome et Rhône 14N10 or 11, 910 Hp at TO)
crew: 4, W.S. 20.27 m., L. 17.85 m., W.A. 52.05 m^
weights: 6050 kg, max 8600 kg
fuel: ?
bombs: internal 800 kg
weapons: 3 7.5 mm
speed max 385 km/h at 4000 m.
cruise 270 km/h
at 4000 in 11'
ceiling 7.25 km
climb 306m./1'
range 1200 km (max, maybe radius)
Lioré et Olivier LeO 451 (2 Gnome et Rhône 14N48 or 49, 1140 Hp at TO)
crew: 4, W.S. 22.52 m., L. 17 m., W.A. 68 m^)
weights: empty 7820 kg, max 11400 kg
fuel: 3225 liters, oil 170 liters
bombs: internal 1400 kg, external possible
weapons: 2 7.5 mm, 1 20 mm
speed max 495 km/h at 4800 m.
cruise max 420 km/h
ceiling 9 km
at 5000 in 14'
range 2300 km (with 500 kg bombs)
note only 5 operational in GB I/31
Potez 633 (2 Gnome et Rhône 14M6, 670 Hp)
crew: 2, W.S. 16 m., L. 11.07 m., W.A. 32.7 m^
weights: empty 2900 kg, max 4500 kg
fuel: 760 liters
bombs: internal 400 kg, external 200 kg
weapons: 2 7.5 mm
speed max 440 km/h at 4000 m.
ceiling 8 km
at 4000 m. in 8'30''
climb 570 m./1'
range 1300 km
Breda Ba 88 Lince (2 Piaggio XI RC40, 1000 Hp)
crew: 2, W.S. 15.6 m., L. 10.79 m, W.A. 33.34 m^
weights: empty 4650 kg, max 6750 kg
fuel: ?
bombs: internal 1000 kg
weapons: 1 7.7 mm, 3 12.7 mm
speed max 490 km/h at 4500 m.
ceiling 8 km
at 3000 m. in 7'30''
at 6000 m. in 15'19''
range 1640 km (?)
Caproni Ca. 135 (2 Isotta Fraschini Asso XI RC40, 825 Hp)
crew: 4, W.S. 18.8, L. 13.7, W.A. 60 m^
weights: empty 5600 kg, max 8400 kg
fuel: ?
bombs: internal 1600 kg
weapons:2 7.7 mm, 2 12.7 mm
speed max 365 km/h
ceiling 7.9 km
at 4000 m. in 16'45''
range 1600 km (?)
Fiat B.R. 20 Cicogna (2 Fiat A80, 1000 Hp)
crew: 4, W.S. 21.54 m., L. 16.98 m., W.A. 74.07 m^
weights: empty 6500 kg, max 10100 kg
fuel: 3600 liters
bombs: 1600 kg
weapons: 4 7.7 mm (only first 20), 2 7.7 mm, 1 12.7 mm (others)
speed max 430 km/h at 4000 m.
speed max 330 km/h at 0
cruise 343 km/h at 4850 m.
ceiling 7.6 km
at 5000 m. in 17'56''
at 3000 m. in 9'58''
at 6000 m. in 25'30''
range 1240 km (with 1000 kg bombs)
range 1920 km (normal ?)
range 3000 km (max)
Savoia Marchetti S.M. 79 Sparviero (3 Alfa Romeo 126 RC34, 780 Hp at TO)
crew: 4/5, W.S. 21. m., L. 15.8 m., W.A. 61.7 m^
weights: empty 6800 kg, max 10480 kg
fuel: 2550 kg
bombs: 1250 kg
weapons: 1 7.7 mm, 3 12.7 mm
speed max 430 km/h at 4000
speed max 360 km/h at 0
cruise speed 350/375 km/h
ceiling: 6.5 km (full load)
at 5000 m. in 19'45''
at 3000 m. in 9'15''
range 1900 km (with ? bombs)
range 3300 km (max)
Cant Z. 1007 Alcione (3 Isotta Fraschini Asso XI RC40, 825 Hp)
crew: 5, W.S. 24.8 m., L. 16.15 m., W.A. 75.3 m^
weights: empty 8210 kg, max 12210 kg
fuel: ?
bombs: ? (Bis load is 1200 kg)
weapons: 3 7.7 mm, 1 12.7 mm
speed max 430 km/h at 5000
cruise 366 km/h
ceiling 6.65 Km
at 4000 in 10'15''
range 2700 km (?)
davparlr
Senior Master Sergeant
Although it doesn't quite make the time line although it did fly by Sep, '39, here is some stats on the B-23 compared to the Ju-88A-1.
Top speed B-23-282 mph, Ju-88-286 mph.
Ceiling B-23-31,600 ft, Ju-88-30,600 ft.
Range w/load B-23-1455 miles w/4000lbs, Ju-88-1550 mile w/2200lbs
Quite close. While 38 were built, the B-23 was passed over for manufacture because of the higher performing B-25.
Top speed B-23-282 mph, Ju-88-286 mph.
Ceiling B-23-31,600 ft, Ju-88-30,600 ft.
Range w/load B-23-1455 miles w/4000lbs, Ju-88-1550 mile w/2200lbs
Quite close. While 38 were built, the B-23 was passed over for manufacture because of the higher performing B-25.
Yes I did thanks Elvis.
Elvis
Chief Master Sergeant
Graeme,
You're welcome.
--------------------------------
I know this wasn't on the list, and I seem to be the only one waving its flag, but for anyone interestd, here's a bit on the B-18, courtesy of the good folks at The National Museum of the USAF...
"DOUGLAS B-18 BOLO
The Douglas Aircraft Co. developed the B-18 to replace the Martin B-10 as the U.S. Army Air Corps' standard bomber. Based on the Douglas DC-2 commercial transport, the prototype B-18 competed with the Martin 146 (an improved B-10) and the four-engine Boeing 299, forerunner of the B-17, at the Air Corps bombing trials at Wright Field in 1935. Although many Air Corps officers judged the Boeing design superior, the Army General Staff preferred the less costly Bolo (along with 13 operational test YB-17s). The Air Corps later ordered 217 more as B-18As with the bombardier's position extended forward over the nose gunner's station.
Though equipped with inadequate defensive armament and underpowered, the Bolo remained the Air Corps' primary bomber into 1941, and the Japanese destroyed some B-18s during the surprise attacks on Dec. 7. By early 1942, improved bombers like the B-17 replaced the Bolo as first-line bombardment aircraft. Many B-18s were then used as transports, or modified as B-18Bs for anti-submarine duty.
TECHNICAL NOTES:
Armament: Three .30-cal. guns (in nose, ventral and dorsal positions), plus 4,500 lbs. of bombs carried internally
Engines: Two Wright R-1820-53s of 1,000 hp each
Crew: Six
Maximum speed: 215 mph at 15,000 ft.
Cruising speed: 167 mph
Range: 2,100 miles
Ceiling: 23,900 ft.
Span: 89 ft. 6 in.
Length: 57 ft. 10 in.
Height: 15 ft. 2 in.
Weight: 27,000 lbs. loaded "
...and a little more...
"The Douglas B-18 was originally designed and built as the DB-1 (Douglas Bomber #1) for the Army Air Corps 1934 requirement for a long range bomber. The DB-1 was based on the Douglas DC-2 and retained many of the latter aircraft's features, including the wing and aft fuselage. The DB-1 was in competition with the Martin Model 146 (an enlarged B-10) and the Boeing Model 299. Although the Boeing entry was clearly superior, the DB-1 was initially favored by the Army General Staff for two reasons. First, the Boeing Model 299 crashed during testing. The crash was the result of pilot error but was technically disqualified from the competition. Second, the DB-1 could be built for about half the cost of the Model 299 (B-17). The General Staff considered the B-17 too expensive and opted for an order for 99 B-18s and only 13 Y1B-17s in 1936.
Thirty-five more B-18s were ordered in 1937, including the last B-18, which had a power nose turret and was designated DB-2 by Douglas. The Army continued to favor the B-18 into the late 1930s when 217 more were ordered as improved B-18As in 1937-1939."
Elvis
You're welcome.
--------------------------------
I know this wasn't on the list, and I seem to be the only one waving its flag, but for anyone interestd, here's a bit on the B-18, courtesy of the good folks at The National Museum of the USAF...
"DOUGLAS B-18 BOLO
The Douglas Aircraft Co. developed the B-18 to replace the Martin B-10 as the U.S. Army Air Corps' standard bomber. Based on the Douglas DC-2 commercial transport, the prototype B-18 competed with the Martin 146 (an improved B-10) and the four-engine Boeing 299, forerunner of the B-17, at the Air Corps bombing trials at Wright Field in 1935. Although many Air Corps officers judged the Boeing design superior, the Army General Staff preferred the less costly Bolo (along with 13 operational test YB-17s). The Air Corps later ordered 217 more as B-18As with the bombardier's position extended forward over the nose gunner's station.
Though equipped with inadequate defensive armament and underpowered, the Bolo remained the Air Corps' primary bomber into 1941, and the Japanese destroyed some B-18s during the surprise attacks on Dec. 7. By early 1942, improved bombers like the B-17 replaced the Bolo as first-line bombardment aircraft. Many B-18s were then used as transports, or modified as B-18Bs for anti-submarine duty.
TECHNICAL NOTES:
Armament: Three .30-cal. guns (in nose, ventral and dorsal positions), plus 4,500 lbs. of bombs carried internally
Engines: Two Wright R-1820-53s of 1,000 hp each
Crew: Six
Maximum speed: 215 mph at 15,000 ft.
Cruising speed: 167 mph
Range: 2,100 miles
Ceiling: 23,900 ft.
Span: 89 ft. 6 in.
Length: 57 ft. 10 in.
Height: 15 ft. 2 in.
Weight: 27,000 lbs. loaded "
...and a little more...
"The Douglas B-18 was originally designed and built as the DB-1 (Douglas Bomber #1) for the Army Air Corps 1934 requirement for a long range bomber. The DB-1 was based on the Douglas DC-2 and retained many of the latter aircraft's features, including the wing and aft fuselage. The DB-1 was in competition with the Martin Model 146 (an enlarged B-10) and the Boeing Model 299. Although the Boeing entry was clearly superior, the DB-1 was initially favored by the Army General Staff for two reasons. First, the Boeing Model 299 crashed during testing. The crash was the result of pilot error but was technically disqualified from the competition. Second, the DB-1 could be built for about half the cost of the Model 299 (B-17). The General Staff considered the B-17 too expensive and opted for an order for 99 B-18s and only 13 Y1B-17s in 1936.
Thirty-five more B-18s were ordered in 1937, including the last B-18, which had a power nose turret and was designated DB-2 by Douglas. The Army continued to favor the B-18 into the late 1930s when 217 more were ordered as improved B-18As in 1937-1939."
Elvis
- Thread starter
- #53
- Thread starter
- #54
After studying the data. I think that the best bomber (twin-triple engine) was Heinkel He 111H2, this is not excellent in any parameter (i watch, defensive weapons, bomb load, range, speed, weight/hp, weight/wing area) but is good in all.
p.s. little correction, this is one of best for bomb load
p.s. little correction, this is one of best for bomb load
