Best World War II Aircraft?

[Twitch]

The Ho 18 would have had the range to make the run to the east US coast. It was designed to carry a 4,400-lb payload not 10,000 lbs. as Davparlr is talking about. 7,400 miles was ample. Most assuredly the Me 264's 9,300 mile range was ample wasn't it? And remember this was on internal fuel. There were hardpoints on the craft for external tankage on most of these craft, the Ho 229 included.

At any rate making hip shot guesses wasn't what successful aero engineers did then or do now. It obvious that they calculated tankage and fuel consumption in regard to takeoff weight and payload carried to project a range sufficient to reach the east coast from Europe.

The Horten brothers were no jamokes who just fell off the turnip truck. They were designing and building flying machines since the late 20s. The Ho 229 which would have become the Go 229 was in development since 1934 in forerunner machines. The all wing concept was not an off the wall idea with no foundation. As Delcyros mentions the design was extensively tested and found suitable.

Lateral stability issues were going to be addressed but the war ended 1st. Whether the Ho 229 would have ended up with small vertical stabilizers is of no consequence. We must acknowledge that research and development phases of prototype aircraft address these type of issues and they are modified as needed. It is the nature of the whole process. It is 100% for sure the final Go 229 would have been as stable, serviceable craft. Any problems would have been solved. In fact the observed stability waver was at landing speeds. At high speed the ship was stable.

The point isn't whether the Amerika bomber could have been built before the end of the war. It couldn't. The whole deal is simply acknowledging what is possible or not. The Me 264 was ready for the call to commence production in 1942. I most certainly could have been in service by 1944. Of course we know many things intervened to change that, Hitler was one of those factors, which was often the case. Would 2 tons of bombs per plane have made significant inroads in damaging the American homeland? Of course not.
Would a dirty nuke?

As Bullockracing says they would have needed to commence a long range nuclear bomber project earlier. The Weimar Republic, long before Hitler, began a rocket program that reached fruition as the A-4 (V-2.) The A-9/A-10 were ready for construction. This was a 2-stage ICBM capable of reaching the eastern US. Given a couple of years it would have been in service. Had research into nuclear energy been authorized in the 20s, as rockets were, men like Einstein would have been involved in solving the puzzle before the Nazi ever became a factor in Germany.

We look at the actual history and what happened and are sometimes oblivious to the luck of our fate. Had Germany's tedious cordialness with Russia lasted a year longer and the D-Day assault was repulsed the war could have easily droned on a couple more years. With a late start against Germany the Sovs would have been much farther from Germany in 1945 and with a year of reorganization after a failed D-Day the Allies strategy would have been altered also.

It is amazing how fate, sychronicity and pure dumb luck decide things sometimes. Minor changes of a million things one way or the other would have had far-reaching consequnces in the war. Just fun to speculate!

[orcacomeback]

I think IL2

[lesofprimus]

U thought wrong....

[kiwimac]

FW-190 D series and the TA-152

[lesofprimus]

And in an example of perfectly bringing a topic back on track, kiwimac goes with a fighter aircraft as best WWII aircraft.... Could make for an intresting discussion, defending that one...

I can see why u would pick those 2 planes kiwi, but I cant overlook the contributions of other planes that impacted the war effort more....

[syscom3]

Originally Posted by Twitch

.........It was designed to carry a 4,400-lb payload not 10,000 lbs. as Davparlr is talking about. 7,400 miles was ample.

The nukes of that era weighed far in excess of 4400 lbs. Plus they were large devices that required big fat bomb bays. I dont think this "amerika bomber" would have the performance necessary to carry a very heavy bomb externally.

Would a dirty nuke?

In those days, uranium enriched to the point of being usable in a dirty bomb was to valuable to be wasted like that.

As Bullockracing says they would have needed to commence a long range nuclear bomber project earlier. The Weimar Republic, long before Hitler, began a rocket program that reached fruition as the A-4 (V-2.) The A-9/A-10 were ready for construction. This was a 2-stage ICBM capable of reaching the eastern US. Given a couple of years it would have been in service. Had research into nuclear energy been authorized in the 20s, as rockets were, men like Einstein would have been involved in solving the puzzle before the Nazi ever became a factor in Germany.

You cant rush technology. Even if development had started in the 20's, untill key metallurgical and guidance issues were resolved, it wasnt going to "fly".

[davparlr]

Originally Posted by Twitch

The Horten brothers were no jamokes who just fell off the turnip truck. They were designing and building flying machines since the late 20s. The Ho 229 which would have become the Go 229 was in development since 1934 in forerunner machines. The all wing concept was not an off the wall idea with no foundation. As Delcyros mentions the design was extensively tested and found suitable.

I hope this comment did not come about because I compared them to the Wright brothers. The Horten brothers were well ahead of their times and had great ideas. The Wright brothers were also well ahead of their times and implemented procedures that are still in use today in aerospace design. It is an honor to be a compared to the Wright brothers.

[Soundbreaker Welch?]

Horten Ho- Most Alien looking fighter

The Pancake didn't look that normal either.

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Originally Posted by lesofprimus

And in an example of perfectly bringing a topic back on track, kiwimac goes with a fighter aircraft as best WWII aircraft.... Could make for an intresting discussion, defending that one...

I can see why u would pick those 2 planes kiwi, but I cant overlook the contributions of other planes that impacted the war effort more....

I agree with you and while I believe that the 190D and the 152 were the best fighters built, I go with the C-47.

[jhor9]

Originally Posted by FLYBOYJ

Best WW2 "PLANE." I would assume all around - yes this has been discussed before and its simple -

THE C-47!!!!

I would tend to agree with flyboy. It was right up at or near the top of the list. It was used for everything except combat, and logistics play a very strong part in the winning of a war.

[plan_D]

De Havilland Mosquito for me.

Reasons:

The De Havilland Mosquito was, in my opinion, the most useful single type of aircraft produced in World War II. Created in the face of fierce opposition from the officialdom, it flew through the war performing any task asked of it with great excellence.

As a reconnaissance plane, the Mosquito was a high-speed spy. The first prototype (Serial #W4051) was handed over to the Photographic Reconnaissance Unit (PRU) on 13 July 1941, it became the first Mosquito taken on charge by the RAF. #W4054 and #W4055 followed on 22 July and 8 August respectively to the, now, No.1 PRU which was equipped with Spitfires, Ansons, Wellingtons and now, Mosquitos. Beginning in September No.1 PRU received seven more production PR.Mk.1s #W4056 and #W4058-63.
On 16 September, 1941, the first PR.Mk.1 went into action over the Bay of Biscay. The generator broke down, forcing the cameras to have no power. Sqn. Leader Rupert Clarke aborted the sortie, flying #W4055 at full pace he managed to out-run three pursuing Bf-109s at 23,000 feet. The following day the same crew, and the same plane returned over enemy terrority to photograph Brest, La Pallice and Bordeaux, they arrived back at Benson at 1745. This was the first successful PR sortie by a Mosquito.

The PR.VIII Mosqutio arrived in service with No. 540 Sqn. based at RAF Leuchars. Equipped with the Merlin 61 1,565-hp engine, these Mosqutios could fly high altitude missions over enemy terrority. These planes began their career on 19 February, 1943 then continued to carry out battle-assessment and target recon for the rest of the war. The PR.VIII Mosqutio also pictured the experimental rocket site at Peenemunde, and confirmed the existence of the V-1 flying-bomb along with it's dispersed launch sites.

Next came the PR.IX and PR.XVI Mosqutio. No.544 Sqn. was the first squadron to be equipped with the PR.IX, and it's first sortie was on the night 13/14 September 1943 when Flight Lieutenant R.L.C Blythe covered Vannes.
The PR.XVI began production in November 1943, with 100-Imp gal drop tanks these aircraft could cover 2,000 miles. On 19 Feburary 1944 a PR.XVI brought back photos of Berlin despite German interceptors had the skies covered. PR.XVI were despatched to No.544 Sqn. in March 1944, then No.540 in July 1944. The first were urgently despatched to No.140 Sqn. 2nd TAF, and helped in mapping out Normandy for the June invasion. The PR.IV, IX and XVI served across Europe, Middle East and the Far East.

The PR.Mk.34 came into service in June 1945. These were sent to the airfield at Cocos Island. They made recon flights to Kuala Lumpur and Port Swettenham. Thirty-Eight sorties had been made by this type by VJ-Day. The PR.Mosquito soldiered on as the PR.Mk.34A with the RAF until 15 December, 1955 with No.81 Sqn. based at Seletar, Singapore.

The USAAF was the second largest operator of the Mosqutio during the war. It received 40 Canadian-built F-8 Mosquitos and 80 PR.XVI Mosquitos , the USAAF did not use the F-8s operationally but the PR.XVI with the US 8th AF were used from 1944 right up until VE-Day. Operating at heights up to and including 37,000 feet these blue and red Mosqutios performed photo- and weather recon and chaff-dispensing duties.

To be continued... ... next time : Night Fighter Mosquito.

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

I am with the C-47 for reasons stated.

If we break it down it goes like this for me:

Overall: C-47
Fighter: Ta-152
Bomber: B-29
Ground Attack: Il-2 (this one is debatable for me though.
Transport/Cargo: C-47

[Gnomey]

I'd agree with that list Adler, as you say though the ground attack is debatable it could be one of the IL-2, FW-190F, Tiffy, JU-87G or the P-47...

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Exactly there are so many to choose from. I actually think I lean more to the Tiffy or the Fw-190F.

[plan_D]

Night-Fighter Mosquito:

The night-fighter prototype (#W4052) was the second Mosquito to fly when it took to the skies on 15 May, 1941. It flew less than six months that the first Mosquito prototype, was officially marked the F.Mk.II. It differed from the bomber prototype by having reinforced wing-spars, four Hispano 20 mm cannon, four .303 Browning machine-guns, bulletproof windscreen and an AI.Mk.IV radar.

Twenty-one of the first fifty Mosquitos built were night-fighters. Now designated the NF.Mk.II, these planes reached frontline service in January 1942. The night-fighter was the last Mosquito to reach service, being declared operational with No.157 Sqn. in April, 1942. This was followed by 23 Sqn. in July, which flew long-range intruder missions over Northern Europe to catch returning German bombers. The unit then moved to Malta where they destroyed seventeen aircraft in their first three months of service on the island.
At this point in the war aircraft flying over Axis Europe were not allowed to carry radar. This was to prevent the technology falling into Axis hands. Instead, the NF.Mk.IIs used for the intruder role were equipped with the 'Gee' navigational aid and designated NF.Mk.II (Special) or NF.Mk.II (Intruder). 466 NF.Mk.IIs were completed.

The next variant was the NF.Mk.XII which introduced the AI.Mk.VIII centimetric radar into service. The inclusion of this new radar in a nose radome necessitated the removal of the Browning machine-guns, all types excluding the NF.Mk.XV after this were solely equipped with the four 20-mm cannon. This variant entered service with 85 Sqn. and all 97 NF.Mk.XIIs were converted from NF.Mk.IIs.
The next variant was the NF.Mk.XIII. This was based on the FB.Mk.IV Mosquito with strengthened wings. This variant carried 50-Imp gal external fuel tanks and was equipped with the AI.Mk.VIII radar. This variant, along with the NF.Mk.XII equipped ten RAF units. Fifty NF.Mk.XIII were fitted with nitrous-oxide injection systems to provide their Merlins with extra power above 20,000 feet for short periods of time.

The Mosquito was suffering from the performance of it's radar at this time, so the next variant introduced the American-built SCR-720 centimetric radar. (UK designation AI.Mk.X). This came into the NF.Mk.XVII which was another conversion of the NF.MK.II built with the AI.Mk.X. One hundred were converted into this type, and it scored it's first kill with No.25 Sqn. in February 1944.
The next variant was the NF.Mk.XIX which was a new-build. To offset the drag caused by the AI.Mk.X this variant was fitted with Merlin 25s rated at 1,635-hp. These were either equipped with the AI.Mk.VIII or X radar, and introduced new developments into the night sky. These included the rear-facing radar 'Monica' and the 'Serrate' which picked up German AI transmissions. The NF.Mk.XIX put these to good effect while protecting Bomber Commands 'heavies' from Luftwaffe night-fighters.

The NF.Mk.30 was the final night-fighter mark to enter service in the war. It differed from the Mk.XIX in having Merlin-70 series engines with two-stage superchargers and cabin pressurisation. These entered service in mid-1944 and had equipped nine RAF squadrons by the wars end, half of these Mosquitos were used in the bomber support role.

Another night-fighter Mosquito was the NF.Mk.XV. Converted from the B.Mk.XVI during 1942 to counter the expected threat from the Ju-86 high-altitude bomber. Equipped with Merlin-61 two-stage engines, four-bladed propellers and extended wing-tips. It flew for the first time in August 1942 but the threat failed to materialise and the type was recalled from service after five more B.Mk.IVs had also been converted.

Prowling the night skies, this plane in all it's variants proved to be a thorn in the Luftwaffe's side too big to pluck. The Mosqutio saw the bombers through the network of German aerial defences, and successfully made the German hunters, the hunted. Also while performing night intruder missions over North-Europe and Italy the night-fighter Mosquito kept the Luftwaffe crews on their toes and alert, as they were not safe until they were out of their planes. At any time a Mosquito could appear out of the night sky.

Next...Fighter-Bomber Mosquito

::Attached Picture:: Mosquito NF.Mk.II (Special) of No.23 Sqdn.