Consolidated PBY vs. Heinkel He-115

[FLYBOYJ]

The PBY was reliable, sturdy and for the most part, self contained. The crew was able to perform required maintenance while deployed in forward areas. But it biggest asset, reliability - something that many WW2 flying boats lacked...

[V-1710]

I was sort of limiting this discussion to twin engined flying boats/seaplanes. There were many fine 4 engined flying boats, as the Sunderland, 'Emily', PB2Y, and the Martin Mars. How about the PBM Mariner?

[trackend]

PBY all the way brilliant design and as FBJ and others have pointed out extremly reliable (very hand when your several hours from home) I love the idea of the drop down wing floats to reduce drag

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

If you want to talk about large multiengine than you have to go with the Emily, Bv-222, Bv-238, PB2Y, PBM, Marlin, Mars, and Sunderland.

[k9kiwi]

Have a search for the night cats "Black Cats" from the pacific theatre.

or just go here Black Cats - U.S. Navy fighting PBY Catalinas in the Pacific during WWII

The Japs just LOOOOVED those guys. Couldn't hear them coming, sure as h@ll new they had been.

[Twitch]

Yeah big, 4-engine flying boats are another category entirely. The Mariner had a penchant for leaking gas a old PBY guy that flew both told me.

[FLYBOYJ]

The point here there were better WW2 flying boats, but they either weren't reliable or not deployed effectively or with the right on board equipment (MAD). That's where the PBY takes it!

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

That I will agree with FBJ.

[Kiwikid]

Back to the original comparison there isn't one. The Catalina could alight on rough seas. The He115 was a floatplane and really was limited to sheltered water flying, though no doubt there were many hairy landings on rough seas by brave He115 crews.

Widen the debate to compare like with like and the Do-18 is superior to the PBY

[the lancaster kicks ass]

well remember you weren't ever supposed to sand any sort of seaplane in rough seas, many were lost that way, yes it obviously happened at times but it was never autherised, not even in larger ones like the Sunderland or E8K (please tell me if that's the right designation i can never remember )..........

[Kiwikid]

I think from memory it was the HK8.

As a general principle a flying boat can handle rougher water than a floatplane. The Do-18 excelled at this because it did not rely upon wing sponsoon floats.

Catching a float on a wave can be quite fatal too as happened to (I think it was) Phillipe Cousteau the son of Jaques Cousteau using a Catalina.

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

As I said in other posting above you can not compare the PBY to the He-115 because they are 2 totally different type of aicraft.

The best aircraft compare the PBY to (seaplanes in her class) are the Do-18, Do-24, and Do-26. The Do-18, Do-24 and Do-26 outperform the PBY and are actually better seaplanes than the PBY but for reasons that FBJ stated such as onboard equipment and effective deployment the PBY takes the catagory of best seaplane of WW2.

I personally like the Do-24 the best though because of her looks.

[USS HERON]

The comparison is useful from a technical viewpoint, but operationally the issue of one vs. the other remains academic.

The PBY was designed as a long ranged patrol plane, then had torpedo / level bomber duties added. The He 115 was designed as a fast floatplane, and there was a record attempt made at one point before the war, and then militarized as a torpedo bomber, scout plane. Chronologically parallel, technically very diverse.

The PBY's long ranged was critical in the Pacific and the Atlantic. The He 115's speed very useful in the Biskaya, Norway, and the Baltic. Against slow, unarmed merchant ships without fighter cover, as in the Russian convoys, the He 115 had a real chance. The PBY as a Black Cat did well in the South Pacific. Both, nevertheless, were very vulnerable to enemy fighter interception.

Most beautiful? Depends entirely on individual criteria. For merchant captain in the Norwegian Sea, an He 115 was an ugly sight. For a Marine pilot in the water off Bougainville, a PBY DUMBO was beauty without comparison.

[JoeB]

An interesting comparison of PBY and Do-24 was in the Dutch Naval Air Force in the Dutch East Indies (Indonesia) early in the Pacific War; it operated both types, and alongside USN units operating PBY-4's and -5's. Some of those Dutch Do-24's had a 20mm dorsal turret, providing considerably more protection than the .50 cal waste hatches (PBY-4) or blisters (PBY-5), but not many Do's happened to be caught by Japanese fighters. They sank a Japanese DD though, while neither US or Dutch PBY's happened to score any signficant sinkings in that period (Dec '41-fall of DEI in late Feb '42). However from the Dutch perspective in early '42, the PBY-5's they received were new planes while the Do's were pretty worn out after a few months of war.

I agree He-115 is not a comparable plane to the PBY, but here's an interesting picture, an He-115B of Kusten-flieger Gruppe 406 shortly before its destruction by F4F-4's from USS Ranger off the coast of Norway Oct 4, 1943, one of the relatively few Luftwaffe a/c shot down by the USN in WWII.



Joe

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

I still dont believe a true comparison can be made between the 115 and the PBY.

Take the PBY and the Do 24 and then you can make a comparison. The Do 24 wins in my opinion as well.

You have to love the PBY however.