Could Axis aircraft catch the Mosquito in Dec 1941?

[freebird]

Did the Germans or Japanese have any interceptors in 1941 that could catch (or shoot down) a Mossie PR flying at max altitude?

[Vincenzo]

maybe the 109F-4 but only if already there

[Glider]

To the performance of the Mosquito was its high cruising speed which made it difficult to intercept and its range. It could simply run like hell and was often able to maintain the high speed for longer than the chasing fighters. There were many examples of Mosquito's outrunning fighters.

[davebender]

High speed, high altitude aircraft are the toughest targets to intercept. For instance the SR-71 was operational for 30 years and I don't think a single one was lost to enemy action.

Catching a Mosquito flying at max altitude would be mostly a matter of luck.

[Tante Ju]

Catching it is probably not a problem, making a good intercept vector is. I don't think it was that fast at altitude. Most Mosquito had low alitude engines did not?

[Denniss]

The GM-1 boosted Bf 109 F-4/Z may have been able to be the insect killer if properly vectored in.

[wuzak]

Catching it is probably not a problem, making a good intercept vector is. I don't think it was that fast at altitude. Most Mosquito had low alitude engines did not?

Early versions, such as the PR.I had single stage engines. The performance also varied quite a bit depending on the exhaust. The early saxophone exhaust was some 15-20mph slower than the later ejector exhausts.

The Mosquito PR Mk I had a range of 2,180 miles, top speed of 382mph and ceiling of 35,000 feet. It had the range and speed to photographic targets inside Germany – indeed one early mission reached as far as Poland! The only problem with the PR Mk I was that there were never enough of them.

De Havilland Mosquito PR Mk I

382mph would be with the ejector exhausts.

[wuzak]

After a little more reading, it seems that the PR.I did have the saxophone exhausts. However, PR.Is were basically the same as W4051, which was the PR prototype. This meant it had the single piece flaps with the short nacelle and the short span #1 tailplane.

The max speed would have been achieved between 20,000ft and 25,000ft, I believe.

[wuzak]

The GM-1 boosted Bf 109 F-4/Z may have been able to be the insect killer if properly vectored in.

How would they be "properly vectored in"?

[mhuxt]

A JG 77 pilot was given credit for a Mosquito recce craft on 4 December 1941, though some sources say the Mossie had previously been damaged by flak.

[davebender]

Germany was experimenting with ground control radar during 1939. By December 1941 they had a pretty good air defense system for detecting, tracking and intercepting enemy aircraft.

[wuzak]

Germany was experimenting with ground control radar during 1939. By December 1941 they had a pretty good air defense system for detecting, tracking and intercepting enemy aircraft.

More interested in the positioning of the intercepting aircraft.

[Siegfried]

Germany was experimenting with ground control radar during 1939. By December 1941 they had a pretty good air defense system for detecting, tracking and intercepting enemy aircraft.

Indeed by December 41 there were the following
1 Several versions of Freya (Including the A/N version with lobe switching to about 0.2 degree)
2 Wurzburg-D with a range of about 35 knautical miles, 0.3 degree accuracy and 25m range accuracy
3 Wurzbug-Riesse with over double the range and 0.15 degree accuracy.

The Wurzburgs had an electronic computer that converted the elevation, bearing and range data into cartesian form and also gave target velocity independant of the FLAK predictor.

The problem with intercepting a mosquito is that with say only a small speed advantage (say 5%) getting an intercept is very hard. I believe the Luftwaffe used specially prepared Me 109, often with GM-1. An Me 109G1 or G2 would be better than a Me 109G6 because of its cleaner aerodynamics. These aircraft were lightened, polished, well maintained.

The Me 163 rocket fighter's role was meant to be intercepting reconaisance aircraft approaching high value targets, not attacking bombers.

Unfortunatly for the Luftwaffe the Mosquito was configured to be as fast as a single engine fighter but with twin engines; so long as the British maintained reasonable parity in engine technology, which they certainly did, the Mosquito would be fairly safe.

[freebird]

After a little more reading, it seems that the PR.I did have the saxophone exhausts. However, PR.Is were basically the same as W4051, which was the PR prototype. This meant it had the single piece flaps with the short nacelle and the short span #1 tailplane.

The max speed would have been achieved between 20,000ft and 25,000ft, I believe.

So what would the top speed be at max alt - 34,000 to 37,000?

The problem with intercepting a mosquito is that with say only a small speed advantage (say 5%) getting an intercept is very hard. I believe the Luftwaffe used specially prepared Me 109, often with GM-1. An Me 109G1 or G2 would be better than a Me 109G6 because of its cleaner aerodynamics. These aircraft were lightened, polished, well maintained.

The Me 163 rocket fighter's role was meant to be intercepting reconaisance aircraft approaching high value targets, not attacking bombers.

I should have put "operational" interceptor I suppose.
AFAIK, the Me 163 is not operational in 1941 or 1942, and the Me 109G is introduced mid-1942?

So I suppose the Axis fghter would have to approach at a steep angle and try to shoot up into the Mossie?
What would the effective range of a 20mm cannon be when firing up at 60 or 70 deg angle?

Did Japan have any aircraft that could have a chance to intercept the Mossie in 1942?

[Siegfried]

In 1940 the Luftwaffe had the Me 109F1 and from 1941 to 1942 the Luftwaffe had the Me 109F2 and F4 in service. With GM-1 and some stripping they might have stood a chance, the F4 was the fastest of these aircraft. I have only vague information on the mosquito hunters, not dates and types.