first aircraft to attack japanese aircraft

[nimrod.michaeli]

i heard that the first aircraft to down an japanese aircraft during wwii was father and son having a ride on dec 7 when the attack happened

is that correct

if yes how many aircraft did they downed

[ccheese]

According to Wiki....

"Lieutenants Kenneth Taylor and George Welch were staying at Wheeler for cards and dancing. They saw the planes burning and called the Haleiwa field to see if their planes were ok. They were and they took off in a car, dodging bullets. As they got there, the planes were gassed up, but not fully loaded. It did not matter as they took off. Out of the 23 planes shot down, the Lieutenants shot down seven. When they landed there was no ship that had not been hit, no place that had not been bombed. Most of the people were either wounded or dead."

Charles

[Soundbreaker Welch?]

Kenneth Taylor and George Welch deserve credit for being the first to shoot down Japanese planes attacking the US, but there were was some other US pilots who fought the Japanese before that.

The Flying Tigers, American pilots who joined the Chinese Air Force to fight the Japanese in China, shot down planes in China, flying P-40's.

They didn't belong to the US Army Air Force, but they were there with the approval of the United States, even if it didn't admit it to Japan.

[ToughOmbre]

Originally Posted by Soundbreaker Welch?

Kenneth Taylor and George Welch deserve credit for being the first to shoot down Japanese planes attacking the US, but there were was some other US pilots who fought the Japanese before that.

The Flying Tigers, American pilots who joined the Chinese Air Force to fight the Japanese in China, shot down planes in China, flying P-40's.

They didn't belong to the US Army Air Force, but they were there with the approval of the United States, even if it didn't admit it to Japan.

Not so Soundbreaker. The first combat mission of the AVG was December 20, 1941.

It's a common misconception that the Flying Tigers were fighting the Japanese prior to the attack on Pearl Harbor.

The John Wayne movie had it all wrong. But I still love the "Duke" anyway.

TO

[davebender]

Japan invaded Shanghai during early 1932. I expect that China managed to shoot down a few Japanese aircraft during that battle.

[evangilder]

I would venture to guess that too, Dave. It's hard to believe that from 1932 to 1941, they didn't lose any aircraft to enemy fire. It all comes down to the man in the cockpit. Look at the Finns with the Brewster Buffalo. Even the P-26 Peashooter managed to down a few Japanese airplanes during the initial battle for the Philippines.

[Shinpachi]

I thought Zero fighter was invincible at the early stage of war

[Waynos]

Nothing is invincible. It was the highest performing fighter in the region for a while but you can always be shot down if the other guy has a loaded gun.

[MikeGazdik]

I believe the question is about the Pearl Harbor attack. I have never heard of the father / son team. I have read many accounts of Taylor and Welch and the like. I did not recall them shooting down 7. If so, nice work! I also have confused myself as to if they were in P-36's or P-40's.

[Jerry W. Loper]

Originally Posted by Shinpachi

I thought Zero fighter was invincible at the early stage of war

The Zero enjoyed air superiority in the Pacific for about the first six months of the war because it was well-armed (two 20-mm. cannon plus two 7.7-mm. machine guns), very maneuverable, and unknown to Allied pilots. Allied pilots were able to deal with the Zero after learning its strong and weak points, and adjusting their tactics. By 1943, the Zero really should have been replaced by Japan's next generation naval fighter, but had to fight on to the end. (I recall reading that at the end of the war, more than half of all of Japan's single-engine, single-seat fighters were still Zeros.)

[davebender]

A nice site. Unfortunately it only goes back to 1937.
Hkans Aviation page - Sino-Japanese Air War 1937-45

14 August 1937
At 15.30, the 34th Provisional PS received the task to bomb Shanghai Dagong Cotton Factory (occupied by Japanese) with six Hawks. Squadron Leader Captain Chow Ting-Fong flew a Hawk III loaded with two 50kg and five 18kg bombs while the other five aircraft in the formation were Hawk IIs loaded with six 18kg bombs. Since he was worried that the speed difference between the Hawks might affect the formation, Chow Ting-Fong didn’t raise the landing gear on his Hawk III in order to reduce the speed and the let the Hawk IIs with fixed landing gear more easily keep the formation.
When Chow Ting-Fong arrived over Shanghai, a Japanese seaplane suddenly broke through the cloud layer and headed towards the 34th PS group. Chow Ting-Fong had no enough time to respond, and also he had more important duties, so he decided not to engage this enemy plane and instead continued towards the target with his companions. When arriving over the target, Chow found that there were very many targets to attack. The six Hawks attacked separately targets independently. After accomplish their task and was on their way home, Chow and Wang Zhikai found a Japanese reconnaissance aircraft. Chow opened fire on it, but have to give up the chase when it ran away into the protective area of Japanese air defence.
During the return flight, Lieutenant Ha Huwen was forced to make an emergency landing at Jiashan airfield because of lacking oil. The other five fighters landed at Jianqiao airport at 17:10.

The IJNAF Kanoya Kokutai despatched nine Mitsubishi G3M2 Model 21 long-range bombers under the command of Lieutenant Commander Nitta to attack the Schien-Chiao Airfield near Hangchou and nine under the command of Lieutenant Commander Asano to attack the Kwangteh Airfield. The Japanese planes took off from Matsuyama Airfield in Taipei at 14:50 (local Japanese time), each carrying two 250kg bombs.

The raid was soon spotted by the Chinese and the Chinese intelligence reported that a number of Japanese bombers had taken-off from an airfield Taiwan, crossed the Formosa Strait and were heading north over Chekiang in the direction of Hangchou. At this time Hangchou was only defended by a handful of Hawk IIIs flown by instructors from the Central Chinese Aviation Academy since reinforcements from Chou Chia-Kou hadn't been able to fly in due to bad weather. Colonel Kao Chi-Hang had previously flown from Nanchang to Schien-Chiao to await the 4th PG's Hawk III's which were flying in from Chou Chia-Kou in the Honan Province and which was under his command. The three squadrons of the 4th PG encountered heavy weather en route, with heavy rain and low visibility.

However barely had the warning been received when a number of Hawk IIIs from the 21st and 23rd Squadrons of the 4th PG landed. The newly arrived fighters were hurriedly re-fuelled but this was far from complete when the air alarm started due to the arrival of Lieutenant Commander Nitta's bombers. Colonel Kao rushed to his aircraft no. IV-1, which had just been landed by Captain Mao Ying-Chu. Ordering Mao to go get another aircraft, Kao jumped into IV-1 and, without waiting to be refuelled, took off immediately. He joined up with Lieutenant Tan Won who had just spotted Nitta's flight (No.1 Shotai) of 3 G3M's.

The Japanese came in at the low "attack" altitude of 500m, which made it easier for the Chinese to intercept them right after the take-off. The Japanese dropped their bombs on the airfield doing little damage. Tan opened fire on the No.3 G3M in Nitta's Shotai. However, the much more experienced Kao noted that Tan had opened fire from out of effective range. Kao then bore in himself and closed in also on the No.3 Japanese aircraft. He first silenced the two Japanese gunners and then closed in to 20m(!) firing steadily at the left engine. The wing tanks on the left wing caught fire and the G3M crashed burning near the town of Ban Shan near the airfield.
Kao then spotted the no. 3 Shotai and attacked the no. 2 aircraft. Again, Kao bore in to close range riddling the G3M with 70 hits and crippling the left engine. Kao then ran out of fuel and had to make a dead stick landing at Schien-Chiao. The Japanese G3M managed to limp back to Matsuyama on one engine. But as it touched down, the left landing gear collapsed and the aircraft suffered "moderate damage". The Japanese later took this plane out of service to be displayed in Japan and, to all intents and purposes, it was written off.

While Kao was attacking the No.2 plane in no. 3 Shotai, 21st PS Squadron Leader Captain Lee Kuei-Tan and his wingmen Lieutenant Wang Wen-Hua and Lieutenant Liu Chi-Sheng caught up with the no. 3 plane of the Shotai. Shooting at the hapless G3M repeatedly, the three brought it down near Ban Shan.

The two flights led by Lieutenant Commander Asano ran into a single Hawk III flown by Captain Chow Ting-Fong (Squadron Leader of the 34th Provisional Pursuit Squadron made up of cadets flying Hawk II's). Chow was a flight instructor from the Air Force Academy and his guns were empty from an earlier action over Shanghai. He, nevertheless, dived into the attack, putting the Japanese off their aim as they dropped their bombs on Kwangteh.
When the 22nd PS reached Schien-Chiao, the Japanese bombers had already dropped their bombs. They took off trying to catch the Japanese bombers that were flying east. They flew to the mouth of the Chien Tang Chiang (river) amid low cloud and bad weather where they lost sight of the Japanese aircraft and returned to base. Pilots included in this chase were flight leader Lieutenant Le Yi-Chin and 2nd Lieutenant Chang Kuang-Ming. However, Lieutenant Cheng Hsiao-Yu of the 22nd PS managed to intercepted them. Cheng had taken off too late to intercept Nitta's flights and flew on to Chien Tang Chiang on a hunch. Spotting the G3M's, Cheng gave chase and caught up with no. 2 aircraft of the no. 2 Shotai over Chao-Er. Cheng shot up the right engine and the wing tanks of this G3M and sent him away streaming fuel. This G3M eventually ran out of fuel just short of the Taiwan coast and ditched just off the lighthouse at the mouth of Keelung Harbour.
The Chinese lost one Hawk III which ran out of fuel when it tried to take off as Nitta's G3M's arrived overhead. This unfortunate Hawk no. 2105 crashed into a tree, mortally injuring its pilot Lieutenant Liu Shu-Fan. Another pilot from the same flight, Lieutenant Chin An-Yi, was slightly injured when his Hawk no. 2106 also ran out of fuel and ended up force landing next to an AA gun position.

So, the final tally for the day was 3 G3Ms destroyed and one written off on landing. Actually, Chinese pilots made only 3 claims but AA gun crews also made 3 additional claims. As a result, 6 claims were submitted in total (and publicised for propaganda purposes).

The 14th Squadron’s Northrops 2E light bombers bombed Japanese lines during the day.

During the day Claire Chennault (acting as operational CO of the Chinese Air Force) launched Chinese aircraft against the Japanese fleet off Shanghai. The Chinese aircraft failed to hit any ships and mistakenly attacked the British cruiser HMS Cumberland but fortunately their bombs fell wide of the ship. They also dropped bombs into the Shanghai city centre, accidentally killing more than 1700 civilians and wounding a further 1800

[Messy1]

Thanks for the link to that site DB. I will have to look it over. I always enjoy being informed about another great site.

[Njaco]

Some interesting stuff....

from the book "Pearl Harbor" by H. P. Willmott pgs 131 - 132

"The Japanese missed Haleiwa Field, and it was from here that five American aircraft managed to get airborne. The first two aircraft to take off were credited with six victories over Ewa and Wahialua, but were somewhat fortunate to escape destruction when they were all but caught at Wheeler Field taking on more ammunition. Wheeler Field itself saw five of its aircraft take off, their pilots were credited with shooting down two Japanese aircraft for the loss of one of their own number. At Bellows Field three American aircraft attempting to get into the air were destroyed, one on the ground and the other two immediately upon take-off: only one pilot survived."