 | Flight Sims are they really as real as actually flying?| Aviation Discuss Flight Sims are they really as real as actually flying? in the World War II - Aviation forums; An airplanes performance in the air is just a set of equations. For simulators, it can be made as accurate ... |
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10-29-2005, 12:56 PM
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#1 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Orange County, CA
Posts: 8,445
| An airplanes performance in the air is just a set of equations. For simulators, it can be made as accurate as the S/W writer wants it to be.
Of course theres always the problem of needing more and more CPU performance to simulate that last 1% of accuracy that really doesnt effect the fidelity of the aircraft simulation.
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10-29-2005, 01:05 PM
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#2 | | IP/Mech THE GREAT GAZOO
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Originally Posted by syscom3 The planes performance in the air is just a set of equations. It can be made as accurate as the S/W writer wants it to be.
Of course theres always the problem of needing more and more CPU performance to simulate that last 1% of accuracy that really doesnt effect the fidelity of the aircraft simulation. | You forgot one thing - the environmental aspects; The feel of the aircraft, the smells, temperature, G loading, all are part of the equation - and those equations you speak about are not finite - they change with temperature, density altitude etc., I know all programmable, but still not the real thing.
PC sims, no matter how good they are give a basis, they are excellent if you're flying "by numbers" or you're doing instrument training but unless you're in a real full motion sim (and even those have limitations) you're never going to grasp or understand the real feel of an aircraft unless you fly the real thing - and I could prove that by the amount of puke bags I had to give to some of my students who were heavy "PC Sim drivers."
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10-29-2005, 01:08 PM
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#3 | | Der Crewchief
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany
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Originally Posted by FLYBOYJ the first time I put em in a stall they Sh*t.... | I know I did.  Quote: |
Originally Posted by syscom3 An airplanes performance in the air is just a set of equations. For simulators, it can be made as accurate as the S/W writer wants it to be.
Of course theres always the problem of needing more and more CPU performance to simulate that last 1% of accuracy that really doesnt effect the fidelity of the aircraft simulation. | And you still will never get the real thing. Sorry arm chair pilot its not the same, I know you all like to think it is and proudly walk around with your microsoft liscense and your microsoft wings but it is not the same. Get out and fly a real plane. Its better and more "real".
__________________  US Army Blackhawk Crewchief 2000-2006 Classic ww2aircraft.net quotes: fly boy said: "isn't that the first jet bomber? becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles" "wait what ok who made the b-2 crash come on people that messed up its a b-2" "ah yes the mistel those things are so annoying is games and in real life" | |
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10-29-2005, 01:24 PM
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#4 | | IP/Mech THE GREAT GAZOO
Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado, USA
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Originally Posted by DerAdlerIstGelandet Quote: |
Originally Posted by FLYBOYJ the first time I put em in a stall they Sh*t.... | I know I did. | Quote: |
Originally Posted by DerAdlerIstGelandet And you still will never get the real thing. Sorry arm chair pilot its not the same, I know you all like to think it is and proudly walk around with your microsoft liscense and your microsoft wings but it is not the same. | It's like screwing a blow up doll! GOD DID I JUST SAY THAT?!?!  I mean like, I wouldn't know about those things! 
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10-29-2005, 01:27 PM
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#5 | | Der Crewchief
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany
Posts: 30,198
Country: | LOL that is just too funny. I have a bad mental image though now. I am scared for life, my wife will be sueing you!
__________________ US Army Blackhawk Crewchief 2000-2006 Classic ww2aircraft.net quotes: fly boy said: "isn't that the first jet bomber? becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles" "wait what ok who made the b-2 crash come on people that messed up its a b-2" "ah yes the mistel those things are so annoying is games and in real life" | |
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10-29-2005, 01:29 PM
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#6 | | IP/Mech THE GREAT GAZOO
Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado, USA
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Originally Posted by DerAdlerIstGelandet LOL that is just too funny. I have a bad mental image though now. | Me too! 
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10-29-2005, 01:30 PM
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#7 | | Der Crewchief
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany
Posts: 30,198
Country: | Now thats bad, when you get an image of yourself!
__________________ US Army Blackhawk Crewchief 2000-2006 Classic ww2aircraft.net quotes: fly boy said: "isn't that the first jet bomber? becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles" "wait what ok who made the b-2 crash come on people that messed up its a b-2" "ah yes the mistel those things are so annoying is games and in real life" | |
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10-29-2005, 01:31 PM
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#8 | | IP/Mech THE GREAT GAZOO
Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado, USA
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Originally Posted by DerAdlerIstGelandet Now thats bad, when you get an image of yourself! | Yea! (think good toughts,think good toughts,think good toughts,think good toughts
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10-29-2005, 01:36 PM
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#9 | | Der Crewchief
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany
Posts: 30,198
Country: | I cant think good thoughts.
__________________ US Army Blackhawk Crewchief 2000-2006 Classic ww2aircraft.net quotes: fly boy said: "isn't that the first jet bomber? becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles" "wait what ok who made the b-2 crash come on people that messed up its a b-2" "ah yes the mistel those things are so annoying is games and in real life" | |
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10-29-2005, 01:47 PM
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#10 | | IP/Mech THE GREAT GAZOO
Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado, USA
Posts: 13,524
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10-29-2005, 01:49 PM
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#11 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Orange County, CA
Posts: 8,445
| Anthing the plane does in the air can be modeled into the SW.
However, even if a pilot is puking and sweating and going blind from a hard gee turn, it still irrelevant to what the airplanes "state" is. It doesnt care about the pilot, only what position the flight controls are in.
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10-29-2005, 02:08 PM
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#12 | | IP/Mech THE GREAT GAZOO
Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado, USA
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Originally Posted by syscom3 Anthing the plane does in the air can be modeled into the SW.
However, even if a pilot is puking and sweating and going blind from a hard gee turn, it still irrelevant to what the airplanes "state" is. It doesnt care about the pilot, only what position the flight controls are in. | But who puts it in that position? A pilot! And some of those positions you may casually simulate with your little joy stick while sitting at the PC enjoying a Coke will result in sweat, puke, unconsciousness or even worse when done in the real vehicle, but the main point here is sometimes due to the physical state of the pilot because of previous maneuvers, they can't even accomplish the most basic maneuvers proficiently like so many die-hard PC sim drivers will do continually as they snack on a Snickers bar. Like the commercial goes, "There's nothing like the real thing." Although the sim may paint a very realistic picture of a situation, that picture is painted in what I call "Perfect World," and with that it's you'll never totaly evaluate the real world unless you're there...
Don't kid yourself on sims, you could be the best PC sim pilot in the world, you go fly a real airplane without real time training you'll probably sweat, puke, and sh*t before you role the thing into a big aluminum ball!
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10-29-2005, 02:42 PM
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#13 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Orange County, CA
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| Like I said, an airplane in flight is nothing but a set of equations that can be modeled for any accuracy an end user desires. An airplane doesnt care if a pilot is uncomfortable, scared or dead. All that matters is the position of the controls.
You can take any simulation to the nth degree for accuracy. But for most PC sims, being 95% accurate is acceptable for most people.
Just by flying around on a sim can give you a pretty good idea of what the plane is capable of. Its only when you get to the extremes of its flying envelope is when questions arise on how closely the software follows the real thing.
Just as the old saying about racing goes...."how much money you have tells me how fast you will go" also applies to simulators. More money = better software modeling = more accurate simulation.
By the way, I dont pretend I could fly a WW2 airplane, except straight and level and maybe gentle turns.
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10-29-2005, 03:19 PM
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#14 | | IP/Mech THE GREAT GAZOO
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Originally Posted by syscom3 Like I said, an airplane in flight is nothing but a set of equations that can be modeled for any accuracy an end user desires. An airplane doesnt care if a pilot is uncomfortable, scared or dead. All that matters is the position of the controls. | And you'll never get a full perspective of what the aircraft can and can't do Quote: |
Originally Posted by syscom3 You can take any simulation to the nth degree for accuracy. But for most PC sims, being 95% accurate is acceptable for most people. | If you want to get a simple picture of operation - you'll never get a full perspective of real world perfomance becuase that still involves many variables that will result in a 25% degradation based on the 5% you mention. Quote: |
Originally Posted by syscom3 Just by flying around on a sim can give you a pretty good idea of what the plane is capable of. Its only when you get to the extremes of its flying envelope is when questions arise on how closely the software follows the real thing. | Now there I agree and that's what I make my above statements on... Quote: |
Originally Posted by syscom3 Just as the old saying about racing goes...."how much money you have tells me how fast you will go" also applies to simulators. More money = better software modeling = more accurate simulation. | Agree - Quote: |
Originally Posted by syscom3 By the way, I dont pretend I could fly a WW2 airplane, except straight and level and maybe gentle turns. | That's a good thing! 
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10-29-2005, 06:00 PM
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#15 | | Der Crewchief
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany
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Originally Posted by syscom3 Like I said, an airplane in flight is nothing but a set of equations that can be modeled for any accuracy an end user desires. An airplane doesnt care if a pilot is uncomfortable, scared or dead. All that matters is the position of the controls.
You can take any simulation to the nth degree for accuracy. But for most PC sims, being 95% accurate is acceptable for most people.
Just by flying around on a sim can give you a pretty good idea of what the plane is capable of. Its only when you get to the extremes of its flying envelope is when questions arise on how closely the software follows the real thing.
Just as the old saying about racing goes...."how much money you have tells me how fast you will go" also applies to simulators. More money = better software modeling = more accurate simulation.
By the way, I dont pretend I could fly a WW2 airplane, except straight and level and maybe gentle turns. | And still is nothing like the real thing. A simulation is a simulation and flying is flying. Sorry not the same my friend.
__________________ US Army Blackhawk Crewchief 2000-2006 Classic ww2aircraft.net quotes: fly boy said: "isn't that the first jet bomber? becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles" "wait what ok who made the b-2 crash come on people that messed up its a b-2" "ah yes the mistel those things are so annoying is games and in real life" | |
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