 | Hypothetical battle: P40 Q2 VS P51K| Aviation Discuss Hypothetical battle: P40 Q2 VS P51K in the World War II - Aviation forums; That's fine!... |
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02-12-2006, 01:47 PM
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#16 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: City of the Angels California
Posts: 810
| That's fine! 
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02-12-2006, 04:29 PM
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#17 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: In WW2 Land, CODUO, SWON
Posts: 705
Country:  | One comment though, we're talking about real combat, not simulated combat between the two planes. I've heard before that the mustang could not absorb as much damage as its contemporaries in the Allied airforce, if so, then wouldn't it be the case that the P40 could out last the Mustang and bring the 20mms to bear following some dive and turn tactics. I could be wrong, but between the P40 and P47, those two planes had the highest diving speed, and the P40 held the speed after the dive for a while. | |
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02-12-2006, 04:38 PM
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#18 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Boise, Idaho
Posts: 1,178
| Are you sure about that Climb speed for the P-51D, my Pilots hand book gives 9min to 20,000ft @ METO power.
The P-38L has the fastest roll rate above 325mph, though it is just a bit slower than the P-51 below that.
wmaxt | |
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02-12-2006, 10:29 PM
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#19 | | Banned
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 110
| I thought this thread was about the P-40Q and the P-51K (a "D" built in a different plant). The P-40 had the best roll rate of any American fighter if you believe the flight tests.
Captain Eric Brown of the RAF also said the P-40 rolled better than any otehr American fighter. I'd be a bit skeptical about claims from aces who flew only one type of fighter. Specifically, many P-47 aces flew several models of P-47 and each one got better ... but they were still P-47s. Eric Brown flew more types than anyone else in the world, and I believe him.
There is considerable evidence that the P-39 also had a very good rate of roll, and we ALL know the late-model P-38s were strong in roll. Everyone wishes they were stronger in turning ... but let's all recall that the highest-scoring American ace flew a P-38. Couldn't have been all THAT bad, huh?
All that being said, the graphs I have seen from WWII show the P-40 with the best roll rate of all .... American, that is.The makers of these graphs are careful to not show everything in one graph. | |
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02-12-2006, 11:00 PM
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#20 | | IP/Mech THE GREAT GAZOO
Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado, USA
Posts: 13,231
Country: | Mentioned this before - Chuck Yeager said the P-39 was his favorite WW2 fighter....
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02-13-2006, 01:36 PM
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#21 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: City of the Angels California
Posts: 810
| I'm going to mention just one thing and then stay away from these fantasy comparisons forever. Comparing aircraft specifications is nice armchair pastime but as each person accurately mentions factors that weigh on the outcome of a combat it is senseless to say "with comparable pilots, which is better," simply because the myriad of variables such as initial placement of combatants, altitude, speed, visibility and so much more. When it comes down to a pilot choosing to do one thing instead of another and the opponent reacting in one way instead of another- all moves being logical- it just doesn't prove anything. There's simply too many factors you all are dropping in to prove some obscure point without substantiation.
Sorry but it's too much of taking the dynamics of air combat and putting them in a vacuum. This ain't meant to dicourage anyone and is meant for no one person. Just something to think about. Hey don't kill me....
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02-13-2006, 01:51 PM
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#22 | | IP/Mech THE GREAT GAZOO
Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado, USA
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Country: | Quote: |
Originally Posted by Twitch Sorry but it's too much of taking the dynamics of air combat and putting them in a vacuum. This ain't meant to dicourage anyone and is meant for no one person. Just something to think about. Hey don't kill me.... | This has been mentioned in some earlier posts when thse comparisons are done - it even includes when some try to throw in expeciences while flying PC simulators and making comparisons based on that!!! 
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02-14-2006, 09:41 AM
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#23 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: City of the Angels California
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| I apologize for being overly harsh on this. Being an ex- flight sim jockey I certainly enjoyed the "what if" scenarios as much as the next guy. I think everyone should kick around as much as possible about the planes, the pilots and the combats. Hey it's better than watching some dumb sports on TV.
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02-14-2006, 09:43 AM
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#24 | | IP/Mech THE GREAT GAZOO
Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado, USA
Posts: 13,231
Country: | Quote: |
Originally Posted by Twitch I apologize for being overly harsh on this. Being an ex- flight sim jockey I certainly enjoyed the "what if" scenarios as much as the next guy. I think everyone should kick around as much as possible about the planes, the pilots and the combats. Hey it's better than watching some dumb sports on TV. | Agree - I kill Migs while my wife watches American Idol! 
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02-14-2006, 12:35 PM
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#25 | | Master of Ewes
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 19,959
Country:  | thing is though there's not a great deal more that we can do than looking at stats to compare planes, pilots accounts are hard to come by and will often show bias, i agree that comparing stats will not give definate winner but it's about as close as we're gonna get.......
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