info on George Laven, 8th FS, 49th FG?? - Aircraft of World War II

wmlaven · 12-31-2006, 12:07 AM

I'm looking for info on my uncle, George Laven, a P-38 ace and was happy to find this forum. Any info would be appreciated by me and my cousins (ie his kids).

FLYBOYJ · 12-31-2006, 05:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wmlaven

I'm looking for info on my uncle, George Laven, a P-38 ace and was happy to find this forum. Any info would be appreciated by me and my cousins (ie his kids).

Wow! If your uncle is George Laven, originally from San Antonio Texas he is a very famous P-38 ace, he was with the 49th FG, 5th AF. He flew a P-38 called "itsy bitsy." Check out this link that shows "itsy bitsy II."

B-24 "Asterperious Special"

George Laven was one of the first to score kills in the P-38. He spent the early part of the war in the Aleutians where he scored 4 kills. Later he served in the South Pacific where he picked up his last kill making him an ace. Although he only had 5 kills he was considered one of the more experienced P-38 drivers in the 5th AF. He flew with some of the most famous and high scoring P-38 aces of WW2 - Thomas McGuire and Jerry Johnson to name a few.

There is a book called "Peter Three Eight," which gives a very good perspective of P-38 aces. Your Uncle George has several pages written about him. One of his feats besides becoming an ace was flying his P-38 from the Aleutians to San Antonio Texas. By today's standards that's a long and treacherous trip.

I've attached a scan from the book "Peter Three Eight."

Are you in contact with him? Is he still alive? Anyway I hope this helps.

FLYBOYJ · 12-31-2006, 05:25 AM

There is a company that makes a die cast model with your uncle's markings on it.

ITSY BITSY P-38

"Itsy Bitsy" has been used in many P-38 models and even a painting..

http://www.alaskool.org/projects/ak_...itsy-76P38.jpg

Trumpeter 1/32 P-38 L-5-LO Lightning

LOCKHEED P-38 LIGHTNING

wmlaven · 12-31-2006, 11:20 AM

Yup, that's my uncle Butz (his childhood nickname because as a baby he reponded when his parents said "butzy, butzy" -- sort of an antidote to his warbird escapades.)

When he flew to San Antonio he did a low pass over the field and rolled the plane -- my grandmother fainted on the spot. That's the story I heard from my dad. I heard many war stories from Butz as a child. He didn't visit often, but it was always interesting when he did. I remember, too, that he always had fast cars -- Jaguar XKE, DeLorean, Avanti -- and he once flipped a DeLorean at 100+ mph and walked away unscratched.

Thanks for all the info. I'll check out the book. He also has a diecast model of his F-104 Really George which was also a plastic model kit. I'll pass your response along to my cousin, ie his daughter.

Butz died in 1995. He had been McDonnel Douglass's advisor to Israel after his retirement from the AF, then left Israel and died not too long after that. My dad is dead, too, so I can't learn more from him, but I could ask his kids questions if you have any.

FLYBOYJ · 12-31-2006, 11:43 AM

Glad to help - I did find info about his post war career, flying the F-100 out of George AFB and his F-104, but he will always be remembered as one of the early successful P-38 drivers. I worked for Lockheed for 10 years and actually worked in the building where they built P-38s so anything about the aircraft or those who flew them has always been of interest to me. There is also the P-38 association where many surviving P-38 drivers and enthusiast have reunions. You might want to check that out as well.

If you get any photos of your uncle and can post them here, please do!! Again, glad I could help!!!

wmlaven · 12-31-2006, 11:49 AM

Thanks again. If you have a link to the P-38 association, please pass it along. I'll check with my cousins about photos to post. I once had one of him with his F-104, but lost it years ago. As I understand he was one of Lockheed's test pilots for awhile, maybe just on the P-38.

FLYBOYJ · 12-31-2006, 12:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wmlaven

Thanks again. If you have a link to the P-38 association, please pass it along. I'll check with my cousins about photos to post. I once had one of him with his F-104, but lost it years ago. As I understand he was one of Lockheed's test pilots for awhile, maybe just on the P-38.

I believe he did work for Lockheed for a while...

FLYBOYJ · 12-31-2006, 12:38 PM

Here's some info...
P-38 Lightning Web Site Links

BTW - sorry to hear of your uncle's passing. He was an inspirational figure for those of us who are aviation enthusiasts as well as aviators.

FLYBOYJ · 12-31-2006, 02:54 PM

Here are more photos of your uncle...

wmlaven · 12-31-2006, 03:12 PM

Thanks so much for those photos. Yup, that's my dad and my grandmother.

FLYBOYJ · 12-31-2006, 03:13 PM

My pleasure, glad I could help.

tjlaven · 12-05-2007, 08:33 PM

Hi, I'm an admirer of George Laven, too. Unable to establish any familial connections but we share a fairly uncommon surname so I suspect there's a link somewhere.

I made a skin for his P-38L which can be flown in the online air combat simulator "Aces High".

Here is a picture of the skin in flight in the game:

Its a pretty easy game to download and get started in, if you are familiar with flight sims.

drgondog · 12-05-2007, 10:23 PM

Dr Frank Olynyk has a pretty good bio on Laven on page 396 of Stars and Bars which suumarizes his career, his scores in the 49th and his post WWII career through retirement.

tjlaven · 12-07-2007, 07:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drgondog

Dr Frank Olynyk has a pretty good bio on Laven on page 396 of Stars and Bars which suumarizes his career, his scores in the 49th and his post WWII career through retirement.

Could you post a link to that? I don't think I have a way to see it otherwise, and I'd like to learn when Laven left the 54th FS to go to the 49th FG.

I'd like to skin his P-38E for the game too, and the paint scheme of the squad's planes changed during their deployment (bars were added to the star insignia, red border surround in '43, 2-digit tail code added on top of rudder, squad art painted on the radiator housing on the booms, etc)

I'd like to know if Laven's personal plane, #76, Itsy Bitsy, would've gotten this treatment or had he already left for the 49th.

Thanks for your help!

drgondog · 12-07-2007, 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tjlaven

Could you post a link to that? I don't think I have a way to see it otherwise, and I'd like to learn when Laven left the 54th FS to go to the 49th FG.

I'd like to skin his P-38E for the game too, and the paint scheme of the squad's planes changed during their deployment (bars were added to the star insignia, red border surround in '43, 2-digit tail code added on top of rudder, squad art painted on the radiator housing on the booms, etc)

I'd like to know if Laven's personal plane, #76, Itsy Bitsy, would've gotten this treatment or had he already left for the 49th.

Thanks for your help!

Frank has not put his 668 page book online.

Laven went to 49th FG from 55th FG on 3 March 1945 - can't help with a/c details

12-31-2006, 12:07 AM	#1
wmlaven Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 4	info on George Laven, 8th FS, 49th FG?? I'm looking for info on my uncle, George Laven, a P-38 ace and was happy to find this forum. Any info would be appreciated by me and my cousins (ie his kids).

12-31-2006, 05:25 AM	#3
FLYBOYJ IP/Mech THE GREAT GAZOO Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado, USA Posts: 17,536	There is a company that makes a die cast model with your uncle's markings on it. ITSY BITSY P-38 "Itsy Bitsy" has been used in many P-38 models and even a painting.. http://www.alaskool.org/projects/ak_...itsy-76P38.jpg Trumpeter 1/32 P-38 L-5-LO Lightning LOCKHEED P-38 LIGHTNING __________________ > I Support Doug Gilliss <

12-31-2006, 11:43 AM	#5
FLYBOYJ IP/Mech THE GREAT GAZOO Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado, USA Posts: 17,536	Glad to help - I did find info about his post war career, flying the F-100 out of George AFB and his F-104, but he will always be remembered as one of the early successful P-38 drivers. I worked for Lockheed for 10 years and actually worked in the building where they built P-38s so anything about the aircraft or those who flew them has always been of interest to me. There is also the P-38 association where many surviving P-38 drivers and enthusiast have reunions. You might want to check that out as well. If you get any photos of your uncle and can post them here, please do!! Again, glad I could help!!! __________________ > I Support Doug Gilliss <

12-31-2006, 12:38 PM	#8
FLYBOYJ IP/Mech THE GREAT GAZOO Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado, USA Posts: 17,536	Here's some info... P-38 Lightning Web Site Links BTW - sorry to hear of your uncle's passing. He was an inspirational figure for those of us who are aviation enthusiasts as well as aviators. __________________ > I Support Doug Gilliss <

12-31-2006, 03:13 PM	#11
FLYBOYJ IP/Mech THE GREAT GAZOO Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado, USA Posts: 17,536	My pleasure, glad I could help. __________________ > I Support Doug Gilliss <

12-31-2006, 11:20 AM	#4
wmlaven Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 4	Yup, that's my uncle Butz (his childhood nickname because as a baby he reponded when his parents said "butzy, butzy" -- sort of an antidote to his warbird escapades.) When he flew to San Antonio he did a low pass over the field and rolled the plane -- my grandmother fainted on the spot. That's the story I heard from my dad. I heard many war stories from Butz as a child. He didn't visit often, but it was always interesting when he did. I remember, too, that he always had fast cars -- Jaguar XKE, DeLorean, Avanti -- and he once flipped a DeLorean at 100+ mph and walked away unscratched. Thanks for all the info. I'll check out the book. He also has a diecast model of his F-104 Really George which was also a plastic model kit. I'll pass your response along to my cousin, ie his daughter. Butz died in 1995. He had been McDonnel Douglass's advisor to Israel after his retirement from the AF, then left Israel and died not too long after that. My dad is dead, too, so I can't learn more from him, but I could ask his kids questions if you have any.

12-31-2006, 11:49 AM	#6
wmlaven Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 4	Thanks again. If you have a link to the P-38 association, please pass it along. I'll check with my cousins about photos to post. I once had one of him with his F-104, but lost it years ago. As I understand he was one of Lockheed's test pilots for awhile, maybe just on the P-38.

12-31-2006, 03:12 PM	#10
wmlaven Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 4	Thanks so much for those photos. Yup, that's my dad and my grandmother.

12-05-2007, 08:33 PM	#12
tjlaven Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 4	Hi, I'm an admirer of George Laven, too. Unable to establish any familial connections but we share a fairly uncommon surname so I suspect there's a link somewhere. I made a skin for his P-38L which can be flown in the online air combat simulator "Aces High". Here is a picture of the skin in flight in the game: Its a pretty easy game to download and get started in, if you are familiar with flight sims.

12-05-2007, 10:23 PM	#13
drgondog Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Scurry, Texas Posts: 4,307	Dr Frank Olynyk has a pretty good bio on Laven on page 396 of Stars and Bars which suumarizes his career, his scores in the 49th and his post WWII career through retirement.

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