P40: The underated underdog, or just behind the times - Page 3 - Aircraft of World War II

carpenoctem1689 · 11-22-2005, 07:06 PM

Attempts were made to 'clean up' the P-40, but because it was niether urgent nor in demand (as in the german case with the Me-109) it was allowed to recede into the history books as a workhorse, not the best, but it did the job that was asked of it. I mean if the japanese had taken the aluetians, and then kept moving on and on towards more american territory very quickly and unstoppably, then maybe we would have pushed an successor through, but it of course would have had some serious shortcomings, like the much later 109s, with the very, very rough high speed handling, short range, and just a slight redesign of progressive airframes with ever-uprated engines. But fact is, new and more advanced fighters were coming out, negating the real NEED and push to upgrade something from the mid 30s.

book1182 · 11-26-2005, 11:25 AM

It was a great plane for it's early war fighting. It showed it could hold its own with the Zero if flown right. I think it fits in with early war planes. The Hurrican, Zero, I-16, and Bf-109E. I think if it would have gotten the super charger it would have been a winning design. It was rugged, had a heavy punch with its guns, and it could dive like all american planes.

Glider · 11-26-2005, 11:45 AM

Just something new that I picked up today, I saw a photo of P40's taking off from an American Carrier in Tunisia. They were transferring to the shore and flew in.
I had never heard of such a transfer using P40's before, does anyone have any information on this?

FLYBOYJ · 11-26-2005, 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glider

Just something new that I picked up today, I saw a photo of P40's taking off from an American Carrier in Tunisia. They were transferring to the shore and flew in.
I had never heard of such a transfer using P40's before, does anyone have any information on this?

Oh yes, Operation Tourch - I think they were the 325th FG...

Glider · 11-26-2005, 11:48 AM

Thanks

DerAdlerIstGelandet · 11-26-2005, 11:56 AM

Yes you are correct. It was Operation Torch and on the 10 and 11 of November the US Navy Escort Carrier Chenango launched 78 USAAF P-40's where they flew to a field at Port Lyautey. From there they flew there operations.

Glider · 11-26-2005, 12:11 PM

Must have been a hell of a big Escort Carrier, but thanks again to you both

DerAdlerIstGelandet · 11-26-2005, 12:42 PM

American Escort Carriers were larger than the Royal Navy Escort Carriers.

Call them Light Fleet Aircraft Carriers if you will. The one that launched the P-40s mentioned above was the Chenango of the Chenango class (CVE-27-29). She was launched on Jan. 4, 1939 and were ex Oilers converted to Aircraft Carriers. She had a length of 556 ft and carried a normal compliment of only 34 naval fighters. When she launched the 78 P-40s she was only ferrying them from the United States. They launched off of her deck to go to land based airfields.

carpenoctem1689 · 11-26-2005, 03:00 PM

That was common though in the african and mediterranean theaters, flying land based planes to isalands or airfields from carriers. After the British found out how un-economical it was to try and fly the aircraft straight to malta, they started ferrying spitfires for sure, and some hurricanes i think, earlier on, to malta. The idea kept on working, because it was needed. Though when the luftwaffe became more numerous in the area, it became increasingly perilous for ships of any sort to come anywhere near malta.

DerAdlerIstGelandet · 11-27-2005, 02:55 PM

Exactly.

carpenoctem1689 · 11-29-2005, 01:11 AM

Had to happen in the Pacific theater too, and thats an even more extreme show of the concept. So many tiny islands dotted throughout the vast expanses of blue ocean, and no aircraft that could fly from hawii or anywhere else to get to the forward bases. They either had to be shipped in crates and assembled on islands, also very common, or shipped on carriers and flown onto airstrips. Hell if it worked in the Med with spitfires, and in the doolittle raids with a friggin' B-25, you could damn well get army planes off carriers.

DerAdlerIstGelandet · 11-29-2005, 12:45 PM

Yes they did it several times I believe. I dont have much info on it though. Only the Doolittle and the P-40s in Operation Torch.

evangilder · 11-29-2005, 01:51 PM

Somewhere I have a photo of P-47s on the deck of a carrier in the Pacific. They did that to get them to where they were going as well.

cheddar cheese · 11-29-2005, 03:55 PM

You mean this one evan?

carpenoctem1689 · 11-29-2005, 07:05 PM

I saw one of P-51Ds somewhere, ill do my best to find it again, it was in color i believe too.

11-26-2005, 11:25 AM	#32
book1182 Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: United States Posts: 75	It was a great plane for it's early war fighting. It showed it could hold its own with the Zero if flown right. I think it fits in with early war planes. The Hurrican, Zero, I-16, and Bf-109E. I think if it would have gotten the super charger it would have been a winning design. It was rugged, had a heavy punch with its guns, and it could dive like all american planes. __________________ Get the greedy bastard...

11-26-2005, 11:56 AM	#36
DerAdlerIstGelandet Der Crewchief Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany Posts: 33,150	Yes you are correct. It was Operation Torch and on the 10 and 11 of November the US Navy Escort Carrier Chenango launched 78 USAAF P-40's where they flew to a field at Port Lyautey. From there they flew there operations. __________________ fly boy:"isnt that the first jet bomber becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles"[/I]

11-26-2005, 12:42 PM	#38
DerAdlerIstGelandet Der Crewchief Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany Posts: 33,150	American Escort Carriers were larger than the Royal Navy Escort Carriers. Call them Light Fleet Aircraft Carriers if you will. The one that launched the P-40s mentioned above was the Chenango of the Chenango class (CVE-27-29). She was launched on Jan. 4, 1939 and were ex Oilers converted to Aircraft Carriers. She had a length of 556 ft and carried a normal compliment of only 34 naval fighters. When she launched the 78 P-40s she was only ferrying them from the United States. They launched off of her deck to go to land based airfields. __________________ fly boy:"isnt that the first jet bomber becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles"[/I]

11-27-2005, 02:55 PM	#40
DerAdlerIstGelandet Der Crewchief Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany Posts: 33,150	Exactly. __________________ fly boy:"isnt that the first jet bomber becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles"[/I]

11-29-2005, 12:45 PM	#42
DerAdlerIstGelandet Der Crewchief Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany Posts: 33,150	Yes they did it several times I believe. I dont have much info on it though. Only the Doolittle and the P-40s in Operation Torch. __________________ fly boy:"isnt that the first jet bomber becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles"[/I]

11-22-2005, 07:06 PM	#31
carpenoctem1689 Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 286	Attempts were made to 'clean up' the P-40, but because it was niether urgent nor in demand (as in the german case with the Me-109) it was allowed to recede into the history books as a workhorse, not the best, but it did the job that was asked of it. I mean if the japanese had taken the aluetians, and then kept moving on and on towards more american territory very quickly and unstoppably, then maybe we would have pushed an successor through, but it of course would have had some serious shortcomings, like the much later 109s, with the very, very rough high speed handling, short range, and just a slight redesign of progressive airframes with ever-uprated engines. But fact is, new and more advanced fighters were coming out, negating the real NEED and push to upgrade something from the mid 30s.

11-26-2005, 11:45 AM	#33
Glider Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: London Posts: 3,649	Just something new that I picked up today, I saw a photo of P40's taking off from an American Carrier in Tunisia. They were transferring to the shore and flew in. I had never heard of such a transfer using P40's before, does anyone have any information on this?

11-26-2005, 11:48 AM	#35
Glider Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: London Posts: 3,649	Thanks

11-26-2005, 12:11 PM	#37
Glider Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: London Posts: 3,649	Must have been a hell of a big Escort Carrier, but thanks again to you both

11-26-2005, 03:00 PM	#39
carpenoctem1689 Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 286	That was common though in the african and mediterranean theaters, flying land based planes to isalands or airfields from carriers. After the British found out how un-economical it was to try and fly the aircraft straight to malta, they started ferrying spitfires for sure, and some hurricanes i think, earlier on, to malta. The idea kept on working, because it was needed. Though when the luftwaffe became more numerous in the area, it became increasingly perilous for ships of any sort to come anywhere near malta.

11-29-2005, 01:11 AM	#41
carpenoctem1689 Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 286	Had to happen in the Pacific theater too, and thats an even more extreme show of the concept. So many tiny islands dotted throughout the vast expanses of blue ocean, and no aircraft that could fly from hawii or anywhere else to get to the forward bases. They either had to be shipped in crates and assembled on islands, also very common, or shipped on carriers and flown onto airstrips. Hell if it worked in the Med with spitfires, and in the doolittle raids with a friggin' B-25, you could damn well get army planes off carriers.

11-29-2005, 01:51 PM	#43
evangilder "Shooter" Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Moorpark, CA Posts: 14,803	Somewhere I have a photo of P-47s on the deck of a carrier in the Pacific. They did that to get them to where they were going as well. __________________ http://www.vg-photo.com For once you have tasted flight you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards, for there you have been and there you will long to return. Leonardo Da Vinci

11-29-2005, 07:05 PM	#45
carpenoctem1689 Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 286	I saw one of P-51Ds somewhere, ill do my best to find it again, it was in color i believe too.

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