PISTON ENGINE AIRCRAFT JET KILLS

Erich · 08-30-2007, 12:54 PM

Joe make a sticky out of it. think it would be wise to have both, I was planning to add a very short snippet to the original thread later today

FLYBOYJ · 08-30-2007, 01:00 PM

It's already a sticky - fire away...

Erich · 08-30-2007, 03:16 PM

back earlier in the thread,

October 7, 1944 364th fg pilot Lt. Elmer Taylor takes R. Zimmermanns Me 163 out to lunch, the rocket gizmo crash lands and pilots Farrel and W. Erfkamp blast it to pieces

Wildcat · 08-30-2007, 08:22 PM

Erich, from the book "Spitfire, Mustang and Kittyhawk in Australian Service"

- Australian pilot F/O John Haslope DFC whilst flying a Mustang III with 165 sqn RAF, shot don a Me163 on the 10th April '45 while escorting Lancasters and Halifaxes on a raid to Leipzig.

- Australian pilot Flt Lt Danny Reid DFC whilst flying Spitfire XIV RM796 with 41 sqn RAF, shot down an Ar234 near Enschede on the 2nd March 1945. Reid with one other Spit was patrolling around Nijmegen at the time.

Also have

- Australian pilot Frederick "Tony" Gaze whilst flying a Spitfire with 610 sqn RAF, shot down an Me262 over Munster on 14 Feb '45. Also shared in the destruction of a Ar234 on April 12 '45 with 41 sqn RAF.

Erich · 08-30-2007, 08:29 PM

wildcat do you have pics of the pilots and their mounts possibly ?

fer-de-lance · 09-01-2007, 11:53 PM

Spoke with Dr. Roscoe Brown PhD. (formerly of the 332nd FG) in New York about his action on March 24, 1945.

Brown mentioned that he chased one Me-262 after it had made a pass on some bombers but lost it in the clouds. He climbed back to a position to cover the bombers when another Me-262 approached from behind. He made a hard right turn and the Me-262 overshot. It apparently slowed down while flying under the bombers to get into position for a shot at them.

Brown tracked the Me-262 with his K-14 lead computing gun sight and score with a burst. The Me-262 slowed down even further. Brown was able to hit it with an extended burst and pieces came off. The German pilot then bailed out.

Wildcat · 09-03-2007, 04:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Erich

wildcat do you have pics of the pilots and their mounts possibly ?

Sorry Erich I don't. However the book I got the info from has gun camera pics of the Me163 shot down by Haslope, but my scanner is buggered at the mo. I reckon Graeme might have the book, he could possibly scan those pics for you.

chuckn49 · 02-19-2008, 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Erich

7 Ocotber, Kommando Nowotny intercepted B-24's and covering P-47's flown by Hub Zemke and Lt N. Benoit shot down Heinz Russel's Me 262 with Heinz bailing out successfully.

Everyone probably knows about this 361st pilot Urban Drew who shot down 2 Me 262's of Kommando Nowotny. Drew waited until 2 jets took off got in behind and shot down Lt. Gerhard Korbert who was killed in his crash-blew up and Hauptmann Arnold who was able to pop the canopy and bail out injured.

A I./KG 51 pilot bailed out unhurt under the P-47 guns of 78th fg Major R. E. Conner. the Me 262 was in the alnding approach near Osnabrück.

Just a quick correction to your Zemke post re: shooting down an ME-262. Zemke and his wingman, Lt. Norman Benoit were flying P-51s, not P-47s

drgondog · 02-24-2008, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chuckn49

Just a quick correction to your Zemke post re: shooting down an ME-262. Zemke and his wingman, Lt. Norman Benoit were flying P-51s, not P-47s

That is correct. Zemke was CO of 479th Fg at the time and the 479th transitioned from P-38L's in late September.

Graeme · 02-24-2008, 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wildcat

Sorry Erich I don't. However the book I got the info from has gun camera pics of the Me163 shot down by Haslope, but my scanner is buggered at the mo. I reckon Graeme might have the book, he could possibly scan those pics for you.

My apologies Wildcat, I only discovered your post today.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wildcat

- Australian pilot Flt Lt Danny Reid DFC whilst flying Spitfire XIV RM796 with 41 sqn RAF, shot down an Ar234 near Enschede on the 2nd March 1945. Reid with one other Spit was patrolling around Nijmegen at the time.

Reid was the squadron's artist and drew this accurate sketch when he returned from the mission. Good rendition of the Arado, from memory, as up until the encounter, he had never seen one before.

Wildcat · 02-24-2008, 11:02 PM

They're the ones! Thanks Graeme

Heinz · 02-29-2008, 08:16 AM

Very interesting wildcat and Graeme!

drgondog · 03-03-2008, 03:03 PM

guys in three different sources so far, including Stars and Bars and Fighter Units of 8th, the award on October 7 for Zemke and Benoit was a shared Me 109 30 mi West of Chemnitz.

Where is the source for a 262?

chuckn49 · 03-03-2008, 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drgondog

guys in three different sources so far, including Stars and Bars and Fighter Units of 8th, the award on October 7 for Zemke and Benoit was a shared Me 109 30 mi West of Chemnitz.

Where is the source for a 262?

"The Messerschmitt Me 262 Combat Diary" by John Foreman and S. E. Harvey claim it was an Me 262 according to the gun cameras from Col. Zemke and Lt. Benoit's planes.

I know from talking to him that Lt. Benoit believed he had shot down an Me 262 but, and, once again from conversations with Lt. Benoit, that Col. Zemke apparently believed he had shot down the Me 262, too.

Again, according to Foreman and Harvey, the plane was identified as belonging to Kommando Nowotny. John Frisbee seems to agree with this, too.

Naturally, in the heat and confusion of battle it is not unusual for pilots to believe things that did not happen. Since I was not there, I can only rely on the memories of one of the pilots involved.

drgondog · 03-05-2008, 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chuckn49

"The Messerschmitt Me 262 Combat Diary" by John Foreman and S. E. Harvey claim it was an Me 262 according to the gun cameras from Col. Zemke and Lt. Benoit's planes.

I know from talking to him that Lt. Benoit believed he had shot down an Me 262 but, and, once again from conversations with Lt. Benoit, that Col. Zemke apparently believed he had shot down the Me 262, too.

Again, according to Foreman and Harvey, the plane was identified as belonging to Kommando Nowotny. John Frisbee seems to agree with this, too.

Naturally, in the heat and confusion of battle it is not unusual for pilots to believe things that did not happen. Since I was not there, I can only rely on the memories of one of the pilots involved.

Chuck - this makes sense. By the time the award was processed by 8th FC into a Victory Credits Board Award, Zemke was a POW and yor brother probably would not have cared much one way or the other to try to correct -

I have gotten all my award types from 8th FC VCB as USAF 85 only has the award or partial award with no type, and Frank Olynyk has his from both the 8th AF VCB as a starter, then Encounter Reports as his follow up. I haven't looked at the Encounter Report