RAF Bomber Command Diary... Jan 1945...... - Page 2 - Aircraft of World War II

Erich · 05-28-2006, 11:32 AM

well I hope they both come back realy soon ...............

the Mossie was shot down by a Ju 88G-6 from 12./NJG 2, Fw. Mangelsdorf. I have a pic of him and his crew by their Ju 88G. Hooters father was the pilot of the Mossie as the radio op was KIA

Soundbreaker Welch? · 06-02-2006, 01:17 AM

Yeah.

Nice info on all the times those bombers crashed in specific missions is quite interesting.

Twitch · 06-02-2006, 11:05 AM

Always check out Ebay for any book title 1st.

hooter · 06-11-2006, 02:18 PM

Hi guys-
sorry for not being back-but unbelievably since i joined my father died-not totally unexpected being 85-but being robbed of the last few weeks was difficult-he said he managed to gain an extra 61 years.
So i am left with the monumental task of trying to write down the things he told me-to tell some truths and let the great grand children know about the most remarkable man I ever met, that they have missed.
Anyway (I am still a bit choked, if thats the right word)I digress

hooter · 06-11-2006, 02:29 PM

the book to read-because his account in his own words is in there-is page 168/169- 'confounding the reich' by martin w bowman and tom cushing
He, flt Lt Tommie Smith, was detailed to an Ash patrol to Stendal fighter airfield near berlin on the night of 16/17 january-after a fruitless night they set course for home-but over the area of the steinhuder lake they came across an airfield with aircraft with nav. lights on-and went in to have a bash (his words) -the germans did tell him that it was two quads at the end of the runway that did for him (they said eight guns) at 200 ft-they were firing at his muzzle flashes from his canon-guys if you post let me know by email if allowed-Im an engineer that works unsociable hours away alot-so my computer time is limited

hooter · 06-11-2006, 02:39 PM

If you want information from his pilots log let me know-i havent had time to read it-it was all filled with names and photographs-a big detective story-I would love to find more about the german side of what happened-after the war dad sent food parcels to the german corporal who showed much kindness to him-I have a picture of the corporal beside his trucks-dad was destrought when the guy disappeared after the end of the war-letters from him stopped coming and he was behind, I think, the iron curtain-first is to find out more about the site of the initial incident-then where my father was taken after, via the gestapo-the only thing he never spoke about to any member of the family, to a convent hospital near fassberg

hooter · 06-11-2006, 02:52 PM

If I've got this right there should be an attachment of the man himself-who had written on the back that he didnt normally look so serious-any ideas on the plane?
regards to all

Erich · 06-11-2006, 03:40 PM

post away please hooter ! am I correct that your fathers Mossie was shot down by a German nf ? as I posted on the other page.

16/17 January 45

German Nf defences claimed 19 RAF bombers with inclusion of 1 Mosquito VI. the German pilot was Rudolf Mangelsdorf at 22.11 hrs. his other kill this eve was at 22.05 hrs over a Halifax south of Hannover.

Oblt. Wiethüchter of III./NJG 3 claiamed a Hali near Magdeburg
Hptm. von Tesmar of IV./NJG 3 claimed a Hali near Dduerstadt
Hptm Dreher claimed hali from IV./NJG 3
Feldwebel Rannefeld of IV./NJG 3 claimed a Hali
Leutnanat Schäfer of 7./NJG 2 claimed 2 kills, the first at 22.03 hrs a Lanc and the other also a Lanc at 22.14 hrs both RAF craft S.E. of Hildesheim
Oberstlt. Walter Borchers of STab./NJG 5 flying a Ju 88G-6 shot dwon 3 Lancsters
Oberlt. Ehrhardt of I./NJG 5 shyot down a Hali
Hauptmann Werner Hopf of III./NJG 5 shot down 3 Hali's.
Oberlt. Breitfeld of III./NJG 5 shot down 2 Hali's
Oblt. Kurt Welter and the two kills are suspect...........flying a Me 262A-1a shot down 2 Lancasters

E

lesofprimus · 06-11-2006, 03:52 PM

Erich, I think he was implying that his Dad got smoked by a double-quad anti-aircraft battery on the edge of the airfield...

hooter · 06-11-2006, 03:58 PM

Hi Erich,
no not nightfighters-but flak from the two towers at the end of the runway-the germans did credit him with 3 kills, all ME109's-actually 1 destroyed, 1 damaged, and the third spun out and blew up-dads pilot number was 100750 and his navigator was A C Cockayne (both with 23 squadron)-now buried in Becklingen War Cemetary.
He lost one engine immediately-climbed, feathered the prop-and then the other one stopped-and all thoughts of back to blighty stopped too-then began the crash landing and the five miracles that my father reckoned saved his life-the first was finding a snow covered field over the black forrest and crash landing without blowing up immediately at 300mph
regards

Erich · 06-11-2006, 04:25 PM

hmmmmmm, ok lets get this stright shall we. Was your dad on a night mission over Stendal airfield or a day time mission as you mention 3 ground kills ?

E

Erich · 06-11-2006, 04:30 PM

I am correct you fathers a/c was indeed shot down by a German Ju 88G-6 not ground based flakvierling. just looked up the German information although terribly brief to me from Germany as well as Holland ........crahs liste as 21.30 hrs but German time is a bit different / crashed near Bekedorf.

Code and squadron of the German claim match perfectly along with the F/O whom you said. I have a pick of manglesdorf and his crew plus their Ju 88 G

lesofprimus · 06-11-2006, 04:41 PM

Excellent researching Erich..... Are u able to post the pic???

Erich · 06-11-2006, 04:43 PM

side notation : have just sent out two e-mails to two Danish research friends on this incident so should be enlightening if Rudi's claim is confirmed or Stendal Flakvierlings !

III./NJG 2 as a gruppe was based at Marx and Varel
but again I need to confirm just what gruppe Rudi was in for sure as it may have been IV./NJG 3 or ?

E ♫

Erich · 06-11-2006, 04:45 PM

YES

I hope this works

05-28-2006, 11:32 AM	#16
Erich the old Sage Join Date: May 2004 Location: Platonic Sphere Posts: 11,107	well I hope they both come back realy soon ............... the Mossie was shot down by a Ju 88G-6 from 12./NJG 2, Fw. Mangelsdorf. I have a pic of him and his crew by their Ju 88G. Hooters father was the pilot of the Mossie as the radio op was KIA __________________ Rip it up !

06-02-2006, 01:17 AM	#17
Soundbreaker Welch? Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Colorado, USA Posts: 1,896	Yeah. Nice info on all the times those bombers crashed in specific missions is quite interesting. __________________ "His motor's conked out!" "What's the differance, they're all Nazis!" "Luke, shut up!" "Fear the hook!" "Oh.....I wanna fly." "You mean the kind that go under water and fly up the stairs?" "What you doing? Oh Nooooo!"

06-02-2006, 11:05 AM	#18
Twitch Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: City of the Angels California Posts: 809	Always check out Ebay for any book title 1st. __________________

06-11-2006, 03:40 PM	#23
Erich the old Sage Join Date: May 2004 Location: Platonic Sphere Posts: 11,107	post away please hooter ! am I correct that your fathers Mossie was shot down by a German nf ? as I posted on the other page. 16/17 January 45 German Nf defences claimed 19 RAF bombers with inclusion of 1 Mosquito VI. the German pilot was Rudolf Mangelsdorf at 22.11 hrs. his other kill this eve was at 22.05 hrs over a Halifax south of Hannover. Oblt. Wiethüchter of III./NJG 3 claiamed a Hali near Magdeburg Hptm. von Tesmar of IV./NJG 3 claimed a Hali near Dduerstadt Hptm Dreher claimed hali from IV./NJG 3 Feldwebel Rannefeld of IV./NJG 3 claimed a Hali Leutnanat Schäfer of 7./NJG 2 claimed 2 kills, the first at 22.03 hrs a Lanc and the other also a Lanc at 22.14 hrs both RAF craft S.E. of Hildesheim Oberstlt. Walter Borchers of STab./NJG 5 flying a Ju 88G-6 shot dwon 3 Lancsters Oberlt. Ehrhardt of I./NJG 5 shyot down a Hali Hauptmann Werner Hopf of III./NJG 5 shot down 3 Hali's. Oberlt. Breitfeld of III./NJG 5 shot down 2 Hali's Oblt. Kurt Welter and the two kills are suspect...........flying a Me 262A-1a shot down 2 Lancasters E __________________ Rip it up !

06-11-2006, 03:52 PM	#24
lesofprimus Minister of Whoopass Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Long Island Native in Mississippi Posts: 18,458	Erich, I think he was implying that his Dad got smoked by a double-quad anti-aircraft battery on the edge of the airfield... __________________ My IL2 Video Tribute to My Grandfather: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HtzN5RuNNJk My 1/32nd Rendition of His Corsair: http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/2-p...3-a-20416.html

06-11-2006, 02:18 PM	#19
hooter Junior Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 22	Hi guys- sorry for not being back-but unbelievably since i joined my father died-not totally unexpected being 85-but being robbed of the last few weeks was difficult-he said he managed to gain an extra 61 years. So i am left with the monumental task of trying to write down the things he told me-to tell some truths and let the great grand children know about the most remarkable man I ever met, that they have missed. Anyway (I am still a bit choked, if thats the right word)I digress

06-11-2006, 02:29 PM	#20
hooter Junior Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 22	the book to read-because his account in his own words is in there-is page 168/169- 'confounding the reich' by martin w bowman and tom cushing He, flt Lt Tommie Smith, was detailed to an Ash patrol to Stendal fighter airfield near berlin on the night of 16/17 january-after a fruitless night they set course for home-but over the area of the steinhuder lake they came across an airfield with aircraft with nav. lights on-and went in to have a bash (his words) -the germans did tell him that it was two quads at the end of the runway that did for him (they said eight guns) at 200 ft-they were firing at his muzzle flashes from his canon-guys if you post let me know by email if allowed-Im an engineer that works unsociable hours away alot-so my computer time is limited

06-11-2006, 02:39 PM	#21
hooter Junior Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 22	If you want information from his pilots log let me know-i havent had time to read it-it was all filled with names and photographs-a big detective story-I would love to find more about the german side of what happened-after the war dad sent food parcels to the german corporal who showed much kindness to him-I have a picture of the corporal beside his trucks-dad was destrought when the guy disappeared after the end of the war-letters from him stopped coming and he was behind, I think, the iron curtain-first is to find out more about the site of the initial incident-then where my father was taken after, via the gestapo-the only thing he never spoke about to any member of the family, to a convent hospital near fassberg

06-11-2006, 03:58 PM	#25
hooter Junior Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 22	Hi Erich, no not nightfighters-but flak from the two towers at the end of the runway-the germans did credit him with 3 kills, all ME109's-actually 1 destroyed, 1 damaged, and the third spun out and blew up-dads pilot number was 100750 and his navigator was A C Cockayne (both with 23 squadron)-now buried in Becklingen War Cemetary. He lost one engine immediately-climbed, feathered the prop-and then the other one stopped-and all thoughts of back to blighty stopped too-then began the crash landing and the five miracles that my father reckoned saved his life-the first was finding a snow covered field over the black forrest and crash landing without blowing up immediately at 300mph regards

06-11-2006, 04:25 PM	#26
Erich the old Sage Join Date: May 2004 Location: Platonic Sphere Posts: 11,107	hmmmmmm, ok lets get this stright shall we. Was your dad on a night mission over Stendal airfield or a day time mission as you mention 3 ground kills ? E __________________ Rip it up !

06-11-2006, 04:30 PM	#27
Erich the old Sage Join Date: May 2004 Location: Platonic Sphere Posts: 11,107	I am correct you fathers a/c was indeed shot down by a German Ju 88G-6 not ground based flakvierling. just looked up the German information although terribly brief to me from Germany as well as Holland ........crahs liste as 21.30 hrs but German time is a bit different / crashed near Bekedorf. Code and squadron of the German claim match perfectly along with the F/O whom you said. I have a pick of manglesdorf and his crew plus their Ju 88 G __________________ Rip it up !

06-11-2006, 04:41 PM	#28
lesofprimus Minister of Whoopass Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Long Island Native in Mississippi Posts: 18,458	Excellent researching Erich..... Are u able to post the pic??? __________________ My IL2 Video Tribute to My Grandfather: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HtzN5RuNNJk My 1/32nd Rendition of His Corsair: http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/2-p...3-a-20416.html

06-11-2006, 04:43 PM	#29
Erich the old Sage Join Date: May 2004 Location: Platonic Sphere Posts: 11,107	side notation : have just sent out two e-mails to two Danish research friends on this incident so should be enlightening if Rudi's claim is confirmed or Stendal Flakvierlings ! III./NJG 2 as a gruppe was based at Marx and Varel but again I need to confirm just what gruppe Rudi was in for sure as it may have been IV./NJG 3 or ? E ♫ __________________ Rip it up !

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