 | Weird World War 2 Facts| Aviation Discuss Weird World War 2 Facts in the World War II - Aviation forums; Well yeah I can understand that but you would think for the old WW2 aircraft and such that wuold be ... |
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07-06-2005, 05:26 PM
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#46 | | Der Crewchief
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany
Posts: 29,456
Country:  | Well yeah I can understand that but you would think for the old WW2 aircraft and such that wuold be known.
__________________  US Army Blackhawk Crewchief 2000-2006 Classic ww2aircraft.net quotes: fly boy said: "isn't that the first jet bomber? becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles" "wait what ok who made the b-2 crash come on people that messed up its a b-2" "ah yes the mistel those things are so annoying is games and in real life" | 
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07-06-2005, 08:13 PM
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#47 | | "Shooter"
Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Moorpark, CA
Posts: 12,544
Country:  | Hmmm, lets see, brains, speed and altitiude. I guys those idiots had 2 out of three!
__________________  http://www.vg-photo.com Wherever their bones may lie, the courage of heroes is consecrated in the hearts and engraved in the history of the free. Lt Col Honner DSO MC, 39th Commander speaking of the dead from the battle of Kokoda. | |
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07-06-2005, 08:17 PM
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#48 | | IP/Mech THE GREAT GAZOO
Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado, USA
Posts: 13,010
Country: |  Yep- I think sometimes the numbers are published, mainly in recip aircraft, they are a bit more forgiving at their absolute altitude.
Jets are not fun when they flame out and airstarts, if successful usually mean hot section inspections at a minimum!
__________________ "IF ITS RED OR DUSTY, DON'T TOUCH IT"  | |
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07-06-2005, 08:19 PM
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#49 | | "Shooter"
Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Moorpark, CA
Posts: 12,544
Country: | Very dangerous position to be in. I have seen it on numerous occasions. They have all been "sphincter tinglers"
__________________ http://www.vg-photo.com Wherever their bones may lie, the courage of heroes is consecrated in the hearts and engraved in the history of the free. Lt Col Honner DSO MC, 39th Commander speaking of the dead from the battle of Kokoda. | |
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07-07-2005, 03:16 AM
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#50 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: London
Posts: 2,800
| I am not familiar with the phrase super cruise, but the lightning could go supersonic without using afterburner if that is what you mean by supercruise. This doesn't mean that it could be considered a cruise speed which I think most people would consider to be a speed that could be maintained for a considerable time. 0.87 sounds about right for a true cruise speed.
The extra thrust without going to afterburner was sometimes used to give the aircraft acceleration and regain energy without draining the tanks dry which was sometimes the only option with other planes of the era.
The lightning had a number of other firsts for which it wasn't given credit for. The Red Top guided missile was the first Infa Red missile that had a head on (or all aspect) capability which is a significant tactical advantage.
The radar was also unusually automated for the time which also helped.
The climb rate of 60,000ft/min is accurate and it was interesting when Phantoms took on Lightnings in exercises as USA Phantom pilots tended to go vertical which didn't work against the Lightning.
One quirk was that when fitted with drop tanks they were above the wing not below. The range was poor but no worse than the F104, Mirage or Mig 21 which were its main rivals. F4's could of course go a lot further.
The lightning could almost the a contender for the best plane that never sold in signifiant numbers award. | |
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07-07-2005, 05:26 AM
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#51 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 533
| From Thunder & Lightnings http://www.thunder-and-lightnings.co.../memories.html Quote: |
They developed a powerful air conditioning system to keep the pilots cool. Semi-conductors would not work above 65°C, so they stuck to using vacuum-tube avionics, even for the radar. It was a monster item of equipment, weighing in at slightly over half a ton. Its pulse-Doppler search and track were basic, but the valve technology and its awesome power gave it unmatched power to burn through the thickest electronic jamming to a range of fifty miles, it would kill a rabbit at one kilometre if activated on the ground. | Is this true? | |
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07-07-2005, 06:00 AM
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#52 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 12,057
Country:  | I do not know about the part you made bold but the Lightning had an impressive 120 degree RADAR. That's more coverage than many RADARs on aircraft these days - that's because aircraft these days use AWACs to guide them.
__________________ "When you go home tomorrow, don't expect anyone to know what you have been through. Even if they did know, most people probably wouldn't care anyway. Some of you may get the medals you deserve, many more of you will not. But remember this, all of you are now members of the front-line club, and that is the most exclusive club in the world." - Lt. Col. Matthew Maer CO 1st Battalion, the Princess of Wale's Royal Regiment. Camp Abu Naji, Oct. 2004  To those in that club. | |
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07-07-2005, 06:41 AM
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#53 | | "Shooter"
Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Moorpark, CA
Posts: 12,544
Country: | Having worked around that stuff in the air force, I kind of doubt it. The reason is that it only had a 50 mile range, so the power coming out of the feedhorn should not have been that hot. But the sentence is worded oddly, so it may mean that it could get 50 miles through jamming. Now if that is the case, I can believe it. Standing in front of it would have been dangerous for anyone or anything on the ground.
But I do have a question. Where did they mount that gear and more importantly, where did they mount the radar antenna? Couldn't have been in the nose.
__________________ http://www.vg-photo.com Wherever their bones may lie, the courage of heroes is consecrated in the hearts and engraved in the history of the free. Lt Col Honner DSO MC, 39th Commander speaking of the dead from the battle of Kokoda. | |
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07-07-2005, 09:08 AM
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#54 | | Der Crewchief
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany
Posts: 29,456
Country: | I believe it was placed in a cone in the inlet. Quote:
The P.1 was retroactively designated the "P.1A". The P.1B was to feature twin Rolls-Royce Avon afterburning engines; a larger tailfin; airborne intercept (AI) radar in a cone in the inlet, which was changed from elliptical to circular
http://www.vectorsite.net/aveeltg.html |
__________________ US Army Blackhawk Crewchief 2000-2006 Classic ww2aircraft.net quotes: fly boy said: "isn't that the first jet bomber? becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles" "wait what ok who made the b-2 crash come on people that messed up its a b-2" "ah yes the mistel those things are so annoying is games and in real life" | |
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07-07-2005, 09:19 AM
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#55 | | "Shooter"
Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Moorpark, CA
Posts: 12,544
Country: | Hmm, didn't know that. I would think vibration and possible heat might cause problems with that. But then again, I only worked on the ground based stuff.
__________________ http://www.vg-photo.com Wherever their bones may lie, the courage of heroes is consecrated in the hearts and engraved in the history of the free. Lt Col Honner DSO MC, 39th Commander speaking of the dead from the battle of Kokoda. | |
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07-07-2005, 09:27 AM
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#56 | | Der Crewchief
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany
Posts: 29,456
Country: | I might be wrong, I am just going off of what I read in the last few minutes through a search.
__________________ US Army Blackhawk Crewchief 2000-2006 Classic ww2aircraft.net quotes: fly boy said: "isn't that the first jet bomber? becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles" "wait what ok who made the b-2 crash come on people that messed up its a b-2" "ah yes the mistel those things are so annoying is games and in real life" | |
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07-07-2005, 10:47 AM
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#57 | | IP/Mech THE GREAT GAZOO
Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado, USA
Posts: 13,010
Country: | Quote: |
Originally Posted by Smokey From Thunder & Lightnings http://www.thunder-and-lightnings.co.../memories.html Quote: |
They developed a powerful air conditioning system to keep the pilots cool. Semi-conductors would not work above 65°C, so they stuck to using vacuum-tube avionics, even for the radar. It was a monster item of equipment, weighing in at slightly over half a ton. Its pulse-Doppler search and track were basic, but the valve technology and its awesome power gave it unmatched power to burn through the thickest electronic jamming to a range of fifty miles, it would kill a rabbit at one kilometre if activated on the ground. | Is this true? | TRUE - I read te MIG-25's Radar could do the same!
__________________ "IF ITS RED OR DUSTY, DON'T TOUCH IT" | |
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07-07-2005, 10:52 AM
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#58 | | Der Crewchief
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany
Posts: 29,456
Country: | How effective was the Mig-25's radar. How far out could it detect enemy aircraft and such not.
__________________ US Army Blackhawk Crewchief 2000-2006 Classic ww2aircraft.net quotes: fly boy said: "isn't that the first jet bomber? becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles" "wait what ok who made the b-2 crash come on people that messed up its a b-2" "ah yes the mistel those things are so annoying is games and in real life" | |
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07-07-2005, 10:57 AM
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#59 | | IP/Mech THE GREAT GAZOO
Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado, USA
Posts: 13,010
Country: | In it's day it was the most powerful airborne radar. I'm not in a position to post stats (traveling again for work) but I've read this on several occasions.
__________________ "IF ITS RED OR DUSTY, DON'T TOUCH IT" | |
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07-07-2005, 11:02 AM
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#60 | | Der Crewchief
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany
Posts: 29,456
Country: | I also have heard the same as you are stating it was built to combat the high flyng US spy planes and such not.
__________________ US Army Blackhawk Crewchief 2000-2006 Classic ww2aircraft.net quotes: fly boy said: "isn't that the first jet bomber? becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles" "wait what ok who made the b-2 crash come on people that messed up its a b-2" "ah yes the mistel those things are so annoying is games and in real life" | |
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