What if: each Axis and Allied nation had only one fighter? - Aircraft of World War II

claidemore · 02-04-2009, 12:20 PM

A recent thread started by Smoltachaos asks the question; what if the Allies had only one fighter type?
I thought it would be interesting to expand on that idea and speculate on one fighter type for each of the major combatants for either side.
Limitiation would be any type in serious developement (excluding the odd-ball planes) that could have been brought into combat service before the time the country in question entered the war.
Major players include Germany, Italy, Japan, Great Britain (Commonwealth), USA, Soviet Union.
Feel free to offer opinions on any or all.

drgondog · 02-04-2009, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by claidemore

A recent thread started by Smoltachaos asks the question; what if the Allies had only one fighter type?
I thought it would be interesting to expand on that idea and speculate on one fighter type for each of the major combatants for either side.
Limitiation would be any type in serious developement (excluding the odd-ball planes) that could have been brought into combat service before the time the country in question entered the war.
Major players include Germany, Italy, Japan, Great Britain (Commonwealth), USA, Soviet Union.
Feel free to offer opinions on any or all.

For US - either F4U or P-51
For Germany - Fw 190
For Great Britain - Spitfire
For Japan - Ki 61 or A6M
Italy - Macchi C.200 which developed into C.202
USSR - Lagg 5

Vincenzo · 02-04-2009, 01:09 PM

109, macchi, zero, spit, buy spit, yak

Vincenzo · 02-04-2009, 01:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drgondog

For US - either F4U or P-51
For Germany - Fw 190
For Great Britain - Spitfire
For Japan - Ki 61 or A6M
Italy - Macchi C.200 which developed into C.202
USSR - Lagg 5

"have been brought into combat service before the time the country in question entered the war"

are you sure on corsair, mustang, 190, ki 61 and Lagg 5 (and why not La 5?)

p.s. for mustang if talking for allison version maybe possible

BombTaxi · 02-04-2009, 02:09 PM

Fw-190 wouldn't have been available at the outbreak of war either - Hitler would need to postpone the invasion of Poland quite substantially to wait for it, then there might not have been a war

My choice

UK - Spitfire
Germany - Bf109
USSR - LaGG 3
USA - P-40 (the P-51 might not have been developed if the RAF hadn't asked for it...)
Japan - A6M (the Ki-43 wasn't designed for carrier use)
Italy - C.200

So the US would potentially be without a carrier fighter while the Japanese had a very capable one - alternative history of the PTO anyone?

claidemore · 02-04-2009, 02:24 PM

Just to clarify: Limitation would be IN SERIOUS DEVELOPEMENT before outbreak of war, and COULD HAVE BEEN BROUGHT INTO PRODUCTION IN TIME FOR COMBAT.

Since it's a 'what if', we are assuming that if one type is going to be concentrated on, then development and production of that type will take priority and it will be available for combat at outbreak of hostilities for each country.

FW190 for example: first prototpe flew June 1, 1939. In that scenario there might have still been Me109s in use at outbreak of war, but the 190 would have been replacing it.

Vincenzo · 02-04-2009, 03:18 PM

it's impossible for FW 190 was ready in september '39 maybe for september '40 but no so fast

davparlr · 02-04-2009, 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drgondog

For US - either F4U or P-51
For Germany - Fw 190
For Great Britain - Spitfire
For Japan - Ki 61 or A6M
Italy - Macchi C.200 which developed into C.202
USSR - Lagg 5

I like this list but I think the Lagg 3 would better fit the latest time frame. Similarly the Ki 61 is marginable (fly Dec 1941)

drgondog · 02-04-2009, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vincenzo

it's impossible for FW 190 was ready in september '39 maybe for september '40 but no so fast

An airplane flying in the timeframe is definitely in Serious Development. The 190 was flying in June 1939.

If the scenario posed was "Operational" the answers are different. It is doubtful that several of my choices would have been operational unless each country ahd foresight and accelerated focused devlopment on my choices.

drgondog · 02-04-2009, 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by davparlr

I like this list but I think the Lagg 3 would better fit the latest time frame. Similarly the Ki 61 is marginable (fly Dec 1941)

Dave - I stuck to Serious Development guideline rather than 'operational' and an airplane that has gone into prototype fits that definition for me. But I do not argue your points!

Vincenzo · 02-04-2009, 04:29 PM

Ki 61 fighting in spring '43 i can understand a best development, but they are 15 months, at point it's best change the required time so all give planes with same timeline

Vincenzo · 02-04-2009, 04:32 PM

pratically this is a simply "best" fighter for nations so my choice it's
Me 262, G 55, Ki 84, Spitfire (griffon), P 47M, Yak (VK 107)

Soundbreaker Welch? · 02-04-2009, 07:44 PM

Let's see.

Britain: Spitfire
Germany: Fw 190D
Italy: Fiat G.55
USA: P-38L
Russia: La-7
Japan: A6M Zero

MikeGazdik · 02-05-2009, 01:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BombTaxi

Fw-190 wouldn't have been available at the outbreak of war either - Hitler would need to postpone the invasion of Poland quite substantially to wait for it, then there might not have been a war

So the US would potentially be without a carrier fighter while the Japanese had a very capable one - alternative history of the PTO anyone?

No, same as the Royal Navy with the Spitfire, the U.S. would have had no choice but put arresting gear on the P-40. The Spitfire wasn't a great carrier aircraft, but it did the job when needed.

claidemore · 02-05-2009, 02:02 AM

I reckon I should give it a go too.

Britain: Spitfire. It was operational at start of war, and the design was flexible enough to meet the demands of a fighter right up till 1945 (and after).
USA: P51. Again it was operational before USA entered war (I know this is stretching the rules a bit, since if Britain is using only 1 fighter, it might not have been developed, but who cares? :P ) Best range of any WWII fighter, and used 1/2 as many engines as a P38 (less drain on production and resources for same number of fighters).
Soviet Union: Yak. Operational at start of war, design lent itself to developement and improvement.
Germany: FW 190. More versatile than 109, might be pushing it for this plane to be operational in 1939, but by late 1940 it could have been replacing 109s.
Italy: RE 2000/2001/2005. Not produced in the numbers it should have been, but eventually it was developed into 'arguably' the best Italian fighter.
Japan: Ki-43 Oscar. I know it didn't officially develop into the Ki-84 (though there are plenty of similarities), but it's my fav Japanese plane.

02-04-2009, 12:20 PM	#1
claidemore Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: British Columbia, Canada Posts: 497	What if: each Axis and Allied nation had only one fighter? A recent thread started by Smoltachaos asks the question; what if the Allies had only one fighter type? I thought it would be interesting to expand on that idea and speculate on one fighter type for each of the major combatants for either side. Limitiation would be any type in serious developement (excluding the odd-ball planes) that could have been brought into combat service before the time the country in question entered the war. Major players include Germany, Italy, Japan, Great Britain (Commonwealth), USA, Soviet Union. Feel free to offer opinions on any or all. __________________

02-04-2009, 02:09 PM	#5
BombTaxi Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Brownhills, W. Mids, UK Posts: 1,189	Fw-190 wouldn't have been available at the outbreak of war either - Hitler would need to postpone the invasion of Poland quite substantially to wait for it, then there might not have been a war My choice UK - Spitfire Germany - Bf109 USSR - LaGG 3 USA - P-40 (the P-51 might not have been developed if the RAF hadn't asked for it...) Japan - A6M (the Ki-43 wasn't designed for carrier use) Italy - C.200 So the US would potentially be without a carrier fighter while the Japanese had a very capable one - alternative history of the PTO anyone? __________________ Good generals think about tactics. Great generals think about logistics. "If freedom is to be saved and enlarged, poverty must be ended. There is no other solution." - Nye Bevan "Any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind; and therefore never send to ask for whom the bell tolls; it tolls for thee" - John Donne, Meditation XVII

02-04-2009, 02:24 PM	#6
claidemore Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: British Columbia, Canada Posts: 497	Just to clarify: Limitation would be IN SERIOUS DEVELOPEMENT before outbreak of war, and COULD HAVE BEEN BROUGHT INTO PRODUCTION IN TIME FOR COMBAT. Since it's a 'what if', we are assuming that if one type is going to be concentrated on, then development and production of that type will take priority and it will be available for combat at outbreak of hostilities for each country. FW190 for example: first prototpe flew June 1, 1939. In that scenario there might have still been Me109s in use at outbreak of war, but the 190 would have been replacing it. __________________

02-04-2009, 07:44 PM	#13
Soundbreaker Welch? Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Colorado, USA Posts: 1,893	Let's see. Britain: Spitfire Germany: Fw 190D Italy: Fiat G.55 USA: P-38L Russia: La-7 Japan: A6M Zero __________________ "His motor's conked out!" "What's the differance, they're all Nazis!" "Luke, shut up!" "Fear the hook!" "Oh.....I wanna fly." "You mean the kind that go under water and fly up the stairs?" "What you doing? Oh Nooooo!"

02-05-2009, 02:02 AM	#15
claidemore Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: British Columbia, Canada Posts: 497	I reckon I should give it a go too. Britain: Spitfire. It was operational at start of war, and the design was flexible enough to meet the demands of a fighter right up till 1945 (and after). USA: P51. Again it was operational before USA entered war (I know this is stretching the rules a bit, since if Britain is using only 1 fighter, it might not have been developed, but who cares? :P ) Best range of any WWII fighter, and used 1/2 as many engines as a P38 (less drain on production and resources for same number of fighters). Soviet Union: Yak. Operational at start of war, design lent itself to developement and improvement. Germany: FW 190. More versatile than 109, might be pushing it for this plane to be operational in 1939, but by late 1940 it could have been replacing 109s. Italy: RE 2000/2001/2005. Not produced in the numbers it should have been, but eventually it was developed into 'arguably' the best Italian fighter. Japan: Ki-43 Oscar. I know it didn't officially develop into the Ki-84 (though there are plenty of similarities), but it's my fav Japanese plane. __________________

02-04-2009, 01:09 PM	#3
Vincenzo Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Lazio Posts: 806	109, macchi, zero, spit, buy spit, yak

02-04-2009, 03:18 PM	#7
Vincenzo Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Lazio Posts: 806	it's impossible for FW 190 was ready in september '39 maybe for september '40 but no so fast

02-04-2009, 04:29 PM	#11
Vincenzo Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Lazio Posts: 806	Ki 61 fighting in spring '43 i can understand a best development, but they are 15 months, at point it's best change the required time so all give planes with same timeline

02-04-2009, 04:32 PM	#12
Vincenzo Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Lazio Posts: 806	pratically this is a simply "best" fighter for nations so my choice it's Me 262, G 55, Ki 84, Spitfire (griffon), P 47M, Yak (VK 107)

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