cfs modding

The Jug Rules! · 01-03-2006, 08:27 AM

Thanks man

gaussianum · 03-13-2006, 03:54 PM

Does anyone know how to add more torque to the models? Is it something to do with the "torque scalar" record, found on .AIR files?

Best Regards

JonJGoldberg · 03-20-2006, 08:37 PM

gaussianum... In which CFS simulator do you want to change torque values...

gaussianum · 04-03-2006, 03:05 PM

Hi JonJ,

CFS 1 and CFS 2. I probably have to reduce the damping profiles to actually see any kind of torque effects. I'm using AirEd, but I still have look into it in depth.

Best Regards

JonJGoldberg · 04-07-2006, 02:43 AM

...Good luck!!! Once in the air, torque is really not part of the math... As an experminent try this...

In you target '1-engine prop' aircract .cfg create, or enter the following if not there... After this Free fly your 'target'.

[piston_engine]
power_scalar = 9.9

[propeller]
thurst_scalar = 0.1

Oh the fun you will have taking off...

Take the same aircraft to quick combat... Find the 'monster' torque'... What torque?

Seems that when multi engine aircraft pull in a direction after being dammaged, is a factor of 'thrust' as opposed to torque.

PS > If you find a way please share!!!

gaussianum · 04-07-2006, 03:32 PM

Will do that JonJ, be sure.

I know that it's possible to experience it with CFS 1, since I've flown the Sopwith Camel, after making the Elevator/Aileron/Rudder Efficiency Tables all equal to 0.75 ( putting all the values in a straight line), and the torque was amazing!

But I didn't fly it before I made that change, so I don't know if it already had a fabulous torque before I messed with those values.

I'm going to try it with the Bf 109, to see if it works with non WWI biplanes (don't know if the MS engine makes a special case out of them).

I'm just beginning to tweak this thing, I'll keep posting with the developments.

BTW, great skins you're posting at the Combat Flight Center. Keep it up!

Best Regards

JonJGoldberg · 04-07-2006, 04:11 PM

...Looks like I have to eat my words... J Bekwith released a new version of 'Airwrench'... I'm trying to obtain a copy; the 'Preview' has a tab for torque, I really don't know however if it is good for CFS-2, as airwrench was made for MS sims from CFS-2 on...

There are places in the .air file for data such as prop wash effect on the wings, rudder and elevator... I believe this is where you 'tricked' the game... and it is not a bad idea...

There are also prop MOI settings, prop diameter, gear reduction... even 'mechinical' friction; but all they really seem to effect is data as it relates to the .DP, and throttle responce, such as how long it takes for your engine to ramp up... Or if your engine is OK after boost...

On the ground if the above is done to a Lighting, after setting the rotation of both to either 1, or -1, (pls use 1.0 thrust as above is a typo), there is plenty torque, once the wheels are up, plane in the air, nothing happening... OK something, but at 10 time power & two engines, torque appears during a speed change, but not in steady throttle flight...

JonJGoldberg · 04-11-2006, 11:29 AM

I'm eating...

JB's Airwrench has 'activated' torque!!! WOW!!!

I figured out how he did this...

Previously; the reason making chages to 'torque' values did nothing is containted within the 'SITUATIO' folder...

The 'model' for 1, 2, 3, & 4 engine flight 'dynamics' are contained within files called defair.flt & defgnd.flt.

Openable & editable with notepad, I use this file to alter many 'hidden' game settings, such as 'turning-on' airframe stress values, etc. Within these files are 'blocks'... heck, see below...

[Engine.1]
ThrottleLever=100.00
PropellerLever=100.00
MixtureLever=100.00
StarterSwitch=Both
Combustion=True
N1RPM=100.00
N2RPM=100.00
FuelFlow=070.63
FuelFlowStandard=081.25
Torque=1711
AbsorbedTorque=19
Thrust=1022
BladeAngle=029.64
LeftMagneto=True
RightMagneto=True
AntiIce=False
EPRBug=000.00
EGTBug=000.00
OilTemp=27730
OilPressure=17867
EPR=0
EGT=10881
ManifoldPressure=42417

Previous to 'Airwrench' this value was law... Unless you write code directly, & bypassed using AirEd, or Abacus FDE. The 'macro editing engines' within these programs have altered the .air files only. What JB has done with Airwrench is 'fantastic' as it writes code in both the .air file as well as the .cfg for each aircraft. The info written to each aircraft's .cfg file allows us to 'bypass' the imbeded model above.

Uh Oh...
I can't fly!!!
It has 'activated a hole lot of stuff... P factor, prop wash... Wow!!!
This is going to take time to play with...
Hats off JB!!!!

gaussianum · 04-11-2006, 03:47 PM

Hey JonJ,

You're saying that if I edit the files in the SITUATIO folder I can get more torque? I can leave the airfiles alone and simply edit the default files in this other folder?

You're using the registered version of AirWrench? Is its documentation the source for this breakthrough?

JonJGoldberg · 04-11-2006, 11:35 PM

I've not messed with this part of the defair.flt & defgnd.flt files... every plane in the sim uses these guidelines, or references... fixing one, messes up all others, I've assumed.

From JB's Airwrench paperwork...

In the older versions of MS flight simulator, most of the aircraft parameters were located in the 'air' file, but
as the simulator evolved from one version to the next, much of the air file content has been migrated to the
aircraft.cfg file.
Although the flight simulator needs both files to run, FS2004 aircraft.cfg files contain all the aircraft
parameters AirWrench needs to compile a corresponding air file 'from scratch'.
At run time, each version of the sim looks in different places in the two flight dynamics files for various
parameters. The key to getting a single set of flight dynamics files that works correctly across multiple
simulator versions is to ensure that all parameters in the air file and aircraft.cfg file are consistent with one
another. No other flight dynamics tool ensures this consistency as well as AirWrench.
AirWrench will generate flight dynamics for FS2002, FS2004, CFS2 and CFS3. Older versions of the
simulator (FS98, FS2000, and CFS1) are not backward compatible with the versions supported by
AirWrench. In some cases, AirWrench may be able to upgrade older flight dynamics to current standards,
but the updated flight dynamics will probably not work in the older simulators.

...The airfiles .air produced for CFS-2 using Airwrench, with torque, are unflyable... so far. This may be due to many reasons, trim for example, but my first 5 or so hours lead me to the conclusion that I must start tweaking the .cfg files, by trial and error, or torque just may not be possible in CFS-2. So far, the added 'math' for the applied torque is rendered at all times, at all speeds, weather the throttle is moving or not, regardless of power level; for example I entered into a 'flat spin' at engine idol, at 10K feet, as there was no way to rid myself of 'torque' unless I killed the engine. Still the plane pulled left.

Yes I'm a registered Airwrench user.

gaussianum · 04-12-2006, 08:36 PM

I modified the default .flt files, and I didn't see any effect on torque. There are some interesting parameters there, like airframe stress, that I will try and modify. Maybe we'll know for certain, wether or not editing any parameter in the file changes anything.

JonJGoldberg · 04-13-2006, 09:57 AM

You will need to activate all, but this does not mean they will work. When I was writing in the 'real' forum I described mods I did for my CFS-2, the data and work involved... Anyway long story short... most planes do not contain data to run the 'reality' settings within their .air files or .config files, or .dp files. They need to be added to the aircraft. You may have seen ... 'Reality-X' aircraft for example. These aircraft had a 'module' within their .dps, .air & .cfgs as well as 'runnung' a 'macro' that pointed to, and gave 'reference' for Airframe stress... these activated parameters permit these 'macros' the ability to introduce math, but do not provide the math.

If the game provided this info... man that would have been great. CFS-2 may still be alive...

Activating, or changing the above numbers in the 'engine.1' window will not effect any aircraft that does not point to it, except on the ground, and during 'quick' combat at mid air start up, however the reason I do not play with this is there are a number of aircraft I have that do... And every .air or .cfg uses these parameters, some of them (most do not point to 'torque' therefore I had you play with 'power' & 'thrust' within the aircraft's .cfg), if not all. If you open, if you have, Flight-1's aircraft, newer than their P-40's, there is no air file. Yes there is a place holder called an .air file... but somewhere in the very simple, but unlabeled .cfg are the pointers to the embedded CFS-2' codes it uses.

My understanding of the code in the engine windows are they are implemented upon the start of a flight, the aircraft author then chooses which values to continue and which become inactive, either at 'wheels-up' or the compleation of engine start if you are in the air. Haven't you noticed the only time 'torque' comes to play in the air, is during a switch of aircraft in quick combat or free flight.

gaussianum · 04-13-2006, 09:11 PM

Thanks for the info JonJ. I'll see what I can do with AirEd, and continue to experiment with it. Airwrench should probably be a much better tool for the job at hand.

JonJGoldberg · 04-14-2006, 09:13 AM

...here are some cool things, commands & thier 'lingo', to play with in your .cfg files... to help you 'tweak'. Better than making canges in the .air file... Commands that let you 'tweak away' in 'plane' talk... From a .cfg that 'torque' was added, but as I said the aircraft is not flyable... Think of the .air file as your 'starting' point... These 'catagories' are to be entered after the 'flight tuning' headder; the below examples are taken from my F-1 P-51 I told you I added torque to, using airwrench, but the plane was unflyable.

PS >> Data entered into the .cfg has more 'weight' or importance than the .air file in CFS-2, however the .air file is 'manditory' even if it only says go back to the .cfg, in essence. In CFS-2 there are still .air file 'only' commands or data that will not be accepted unless in the .air file. You will also notice 'airwrench' catagories... For the moment, I do not know how these work. My guess at the moment is these 'catagories' are place holders for 'Airwrench' commands upon opining the .air files.

[General]
performance=Weight: 7912 lbs Power: 1590 hp 7.5g Corner speed: 256 mph Max speed @ SL: 364 mph Max speed:437 mph @ 25000 ft Climb rate: 3475 ft/min @ 150 mph Orig Air File by VB Planes 8/13/01 Last Modified By JJG 6/28/05

[WEIGHT_AND_BALANCE]
empty_weight_CG_position= 0.000, 0.000, 0.000
empty_weight=7711.00000
empty_weight_pitch_MOI=8279.00000
empty_weight_roll_MOI=6039.00000
empty_weight_yaw_MOI=12990.00000
empty_weight_coupled_MOI=0.00000
[GeneralEngineData]
engine_type=0
fuel_flow_scalar=1.00000
Engine.0=8.333, 0.000, 0.083
[airplane_geometry]
wing_area=235.00000
wing_span=37.00000
wing_root_chord=6.33333
wing_dihedral=5.00000
wing_incidence=0.00000
wing_twist=0.00000
oswald_efficiency_factor=0.88000
wing_winglets_flag=0
wing_sweep=0.00000
wing_pos_apex_lon=1.58784
wing_pos_apex_vert=0.00000
htail_area=0.00000
htail_span=0.00000
htail_pos_lon=0.00000
htail_pos_vert=0.00000
htail_incidence=0.00000
htail_sweep=0.00000
vtail_area=0.00000
vtail_span=0.00000
vtail_pos_lon=0.00000
vtail_pos_vert=0.00000
vtail_sweep=0.00000
elevator_area=13.05000
aileron_area=24.70000
rudder_area=10.41000
elevator_up_limit=30.00000
elevator_down_limit=20.00000
aileron_up_limit=15.00000
aileron_down_limit=15.00000
rudder_limit=30.00000
elevator_trim_limit=18.00000
spoiler_limit=60.00000
spoilerons_available=0
aileron_to_spoileron_gain=0.00000
min_ailerons_for_spoilerons=0.00000
min_flaps_for_spoilerons=0.00000
[brakes]
toe_brakes_scale=1.00000
[smokesystem]
smoke.0=0
[gear_warning_system]
gear_warning_available=0
pct_throttle_limit=0.00000
flap_limit_idle=0.00000
flap_limit_power=0.00000
[Reference Speeds]
flaps_up_stall_speed=87.76660
full_flaps_stall_speed=70.38707
cruise_speed=221.93652
max_indicated_speed=444.00000
max_mach=1.00000
[autopilot]
autopilot_available=1
flight_director_available=0
autothrottle_available=0
autothrottle_arming_required=0
default_pitch_mode=0
default_bank_mode=0
use_no_default_bank=1
use_no_default_pitch=1
default_vertical_speed=1000.00000
autothrottle_takeoff_ga=1.00000
autothrottle_max_rpm=90.00000
pitch_takeoff_ga=8.00000
max_pitch=10.00000
max_pitch_acceleration=1.00000
max_pitch_velocity_lo_alt=2.00000
max_pitch_velocity_hi_alt=1.50000
max_pitch_velocity_lo_alt_breakpoint=20000.00000
max_pitch_velocity_hi_alt_breakpoint=28000.00000
max_bank=25.00000
max_bank_acceleration=1.80000
max_bank_velocity=3.00000
max_throttle_rate=0.10000
nav_proportional_control=9.00000
nav_integrator_control=0.25000
nav_derivative_control=0.00000
nav_integrator_boundary=2.50000
nav_derivative_boundary=0.00000
gs_proportional_control=9.52000
gs_integrator_control=0.26000
gs_derivative_control=0.00000
gs_integrator_boundary=0.70000
gs_derivative_boundary=0.00000
yaw_damper_gain=0.00000
[hydraulic_system]
normal_pressure=998.00000
[AirWrench]
Aircraft_Length=31.45000
Vmax_sl=319.30000
Vmax_ca=371.00000
V_rc=114.80000
Climb_Rate=3475.90000
Climb_Weight=9133.00000
Max_gforce=7.50000
Emergency_hp=1621.72464
nose_position_lon=11.00750
ActualIncidence=0.00000
ActualTwist=0.00000
ActualTailIncidence=0.00000
Aircraft_Type=1
FlowCorrection=1.00000
Power_Correction=1.00000
JetAltitude=0.00000
turboprop_critical_altitude=0.00000
target_roll_Vopt=263.30000
target_roll_rate=88.00000
pitch_damping=1.00000
yaw_damping=1.00000
elevator_scalar=1.00000
rudder_scalar=1.00000
Elevator_FF=30.00000
Aileron_FF=-30.00000
Roll_Response=30.00000
Control_Response=100.00000
V_Max_Control=510.90000
V_Zero_Control=1021.90000
Spin_Stability=100.00000
Stall_Stability=100.00000
Elevator_Propwash=0.87500
Rudder_Propwash=0.87500
spoiler_time=45.00000
afterburner_thrust=0.00000
mach_scale=1.00000
spoiler_cd=0.00000
spoiler_cl=0.00000
spoiler_cm=0.00000
flaps_cd_scalar=1.00000
flaps_cm_scalar=1.00000
gear_cd_scalar=1.00000
gear_cm_scalar=1.00000
cylinder_head_temperature=501.00000
exhaust_gas_temperature=1201.00000
fuel_pressure=16.50000
oil_pressure=60.00000
oil_temperature=241.00000
radiator_temperature=211.00000
exhaust_pressure_ratio=0.00000
interstage_turbine_temperature=-459.00000
knots_flag=0
cfs1_flag=0
laminar_flow=0
tab_edit=0
fixed_wing_pos=0
AirWrenchVersion=1.01.28
[fuel]
LeftMain= 0.400, -5.100, 0.000, 76.000, 0.000
RightMain= 0.400, 5.100, 0.000, 76.000, 0.000
Center1= -3.000, 0.000, 0.000, 85.000, 0.000
External1= -0.600, -2.200, -1.400, 75.000, 0.000
External2= -0.600, 2.200, -1.400, 75.000, 0.000
[flaps.0]
type=1
span-outboard=0.5
extending-time= 5.000
flaps-position.0=0.000
flaps-position.1=9.000
flaps-position.2=18.000
flaps-position.3=27.000
flaps-position.4=36.000
flaps-position.5=45.000
damaging-speed=189.720
blowout-speed=237.150
lift_scalar=1
drag_scalar=1
pitch_scalar=1
system_type=1
[forcefeedback]
gear_bump_nose_magnitude=6000
gear_bump_nose_direction=18000
gear_bump_nose_duration=250000
gear_bump_left_magnitude=6000
gear_bump_left_direction=35500
gear_bump_left_duration=250000
gear_bump_right_magnitude=6000
gear_bump_right_direction=500
gear_bump_right_duration=250000
ground_bumps_magnitude1=3250
ground_bumps_angle1=8900
ground_bumps_intercept1=5
ground_bumps_slope1=0.48
ground_bumps_magnitude2=750
ground_bumps_angle2=9100
ground_bumps_intercept2=0.075
ground_bumps_slope2=1
crash_magnitude1=10000
crash_direction1=1000
crash_magnitude2=10000
crash_direction2=9000
crash_period2=75000
crash_duration2=2500000
stick_shaker_magnitude=5000
stick_shaker_direction=0
stick_shaker_period=111111

Happy Holidays!!!

gaussianum · 04-14-2006, 02:26 PM

I'll try that with CFS2. For the moment I've been concentrating on CFS1. One thing I've found out is that the most 'torqued' airplane in CFS1 (the Camel) is just a converted FS98 airplane. The air file has a lot less records, some of which simply don't exist in CFS1 or 2. So, I've been backtracking (it's almost a voyage through time

and I am know examining FS98 aircraft. I've read people saying that after FS98, microsoft has been making a larger, and larger mess of the code. It's probably the price to pay for retro-compatibility.

I've been enjoying this conversation, but I may be leaving the forum in the near future.

Whatever the case, I'd like to tell you that it's been a pleasure to meet you, and if not here, I will be discussing this with you on some of the 'real' forums about CFS.

How is New York today? I wish you a very happy holiday too, JonJ!