Aircraft of World War II - Warbird Forums
 



Go Back   Aircraft of World War II - Warbird Forums > World War II - Aviation > Technical > Flight Test Data

Flight Test Data This is a section for flight test data. Any test data from any country of any era. This is mainly for reference and to answer questions about aircraft performance based of flight test data.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 03-25-2009, 08:25 PM   #1
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,765
Performance Comparison: Yakovlev Fighter Family

Hi everyone,

Here is a preliminary performance comparison between the various fighters of the Yakovlev family.

(This thread is a spin-off from Clay's thread here: http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/avi...ane-17485.html (P-40 vs. Yak-1 vs. Hurricane) )

I have restricted myself to the most typical ones with M-105P, M-105PF and M-105PF engines. One reason for that is lack of data - anything on other engines used in the Yaks and even on these three engines would be welcome! The M-105PF2 power graph I used is semi-synthetic, based on the assumption that the PF2 was the same as a PF, but cleared for higher boost pressures. The M-105P and PF power graphs are from a scan that appears to be a German wartime summary.

For the basic speeds, I have mainly relied on data reproduced from Yefim Gordon's and Dmitri Khazanov's Soviet Combat Aircraft of the Second World War Volume One: Single-Engined Fighters. (Thanks, Juha! :-)

To minimize possible errors from the semi-synthetic M-105PF2 power graph, I have based the Yak-3 speeds on the sea level speeds, while the other graphs are calibrated for absolute top speeds.

With the faster variants, there appears to be a mismatch between calculated critical altitude and recorded critical altitude. I'm not sure about the reason, some of it might be an artifact of the possibly slightly inaccurate German power graph.

The results are not definite yet, but generally I'm quite happy with them. Better source data might still allow improvements.

A power graph for the V-107A would be welcome as it would allow the inclusion of the Yak-9U! :-)

Regards,

Henning (HoHun)
Attached Images
File Type: png Yak_Speed_Comparison.png (8.7 KB, 118 views)
HoHun is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Spurl this Post!Reddit! Wong this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 03-25-2009, 08:25 PM   #2
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,765
Climb rate ...
Attached Images
File Type: png Yak_Climb_Comparison.png (8.5 KB, 111 views)
HoHun is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Spurl this Post!Reddit! Wong this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 03-25-2009, 08:26 PM   #3
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,765
Turn rate ...
Attached Images
File Type: png Yak_Turn_Comparison.png (7.7 KB, 112 views)
HoHun is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Spurl this Post!Reddit! Wong this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 03-25-2009, 08:42 PM   #4
Senior Member
 
Clay_Allison's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 923
I love the Yaks, myself. Really clean, really simple lines.
__________________
It's always easy to find reasons why something shouldn't be done, the trick is to find ways to get it done. -- claidemore
Clay_Allison is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Spurl this Post!Reddit! Wong this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2009, 02:52 AM   #5
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 1
Some info on soviet engines

From book "Yak fighters in WW2 time period", author - A.T.Stepanets (chief engineer of "KB Yakovlev")
Attached Images
File Type: gif 218.GIF (260.3 KB, 114 views)
Geshvader is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Spurl this Post!Reddit! Wong this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2009, 06:01 AM   #6
Senior Member
 
tomo pauk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 576
Nice graphs, gentlemen

My Yak bird is the -3, but it was pretty late in game unfortunately.
__________________
tomo pauk is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Spurl this Post!Reddit! Wong this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2009, 11:27 AM   #7
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 94
This is how the Yak-3 and Yak-9U are modelled in IL2 (AFAIK they did not have emergency boost, so I don't know how to interpret "100%" and "MAX"):


And "official" speed curves:
Timppa is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Spurl this Post!Reddit! Wong this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2009, 12:01 PM   #8
Senior Member
 
claidemore's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: British Columbia, Canada
Posts: 496
A few websites:
Russian Aviation Museum
WW2 Warbirds: the Yakovlev Yak-1 - Frans Bonn
Yak-1
Yak Piston Fighters

and the best online perf comparison I've seen on Yaks.
Yak piston fighters
__________________
claidemore is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Spurl this Post!Reddit! Wong this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2009, 12:29 PM   #9
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,765
Hi Geshvader,

>From book "Yak fighters in WW2 time period", author - A.T.Stepanets (chief engineer of "KB Yakovlev")

Thanks a lot! This shows different power graphs than the ones I used before, showing that the sequence M-105PA -> PF -> PF2 basically were identical engines with increased boost pressure in the newer types.

I have re-done the entire analysis, selecting slightly different aircraft than the first time around since I'm not more confident that the critical altitude and power figures are accurate (so some of the data points in Gordon/Khazanov didn't appear realistic, thus my switch to others).

Still, the Stepanets power graphs seem to give slightly too low power values at low altitude for my analysis to work, making it difficult to match sea level speed and especially turn rate data, while they are certainly too high at high altitude. The latter is an effect well-known for WW2 power graphs calculated according to the then-standard method, so I'm ignoring it for now.

For the graphs, see below :-)

Some remaining questions:

- How did the M-105P differ from the M-105PA?
- Which types had combined exhausts, and which had single exhausts?
- What were the propeller diameter and the reduction gear ratio used with the VK-107A?
- Which engine did the production Yak-3U actually use? Some sites say it was the VK-107A, others say it was the M-105PF.

Regards,

Henning (HoHun)
Attached Images
File Type: png Yak_Speed_Comparison.png (8.6 KB, 108 views)
File Type: png Yak_Climb_Comparison.png (9.0 KB, 108 views)
File Type: png Yak_Turn_Comparison.png (8.2 KB, 108 views)
HoHun is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Spurl this Post!Reddit! Wong this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2009, 02:40 PM   #10
Senior Member
 
claidemore's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: British Columbia, Canada
Posts: 496
Quote:
Originally Posted by HoHun View Post
Hi Geshvader,

>From book "Yak fighters in WW2 time period", author - A.T.Stepanets (chief engineer of "KB Yakovlev")


Some remaining questions:

- How did the M-105P differ from the M-105PA?
- Which types had combined exhausts, and which had single exhausts?
- What were the propeller diameter and the reduction gear ratio used with the VK-107A?
- Which engine did the production Yak-3U actually use? Some sites say it was the VK-107A, others say it was the M-105PF.

Regards,

Henning (HoHun)
Difference between 105P and PA:
Quote:
In 1941 new engine of M-105P family M-105PA was installed on Yak-1. It had new carburetor, improved boost and rate controls, new shaft bearing design.
and:
Quote:
Beginning in the summer of 1941, Yak-1s were also fitted with the improved Klimov M-105PA engine, which was more reliable than the M-105P, if still not entirely satisfactory, and could operate in inverted flight and negative-gee maneuvers.
AFAIK the Yak-3s which saw combat had the 105PF2 and the Yak-3U had the ASh82FN radial. Basically, the VK107 ones were 1946 models. I've read that there were 100 Yak 3's with the VK107 which were produced and used during hostilities, but there's no seperate model designation for them that I know of.
__________________
claidemore is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Spurl this Post!Reddit! Wong this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2009, 05:53 PM   #11
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,765
Hi Claidemore,

>Difference between 105P and PA:

Ah, thanks! Doesn't sound like there was a difference in the supercharger gear ratio then.

>AFAIK the Yak-3s which saw combat had the 105PF2 and the Yak-3U had the ASh82FN radial.

Oops, I meant to ask for the engine of the Yak-9U, not the -3U!

Below the German information sheet on the M-105 and VK-107 I used for the first analysis ...

Regards,

Henning (HoHun)
Attached Images
File Type: gif P105.gif (78.5 KB, 111 views)
HoHun is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Spurl this Post!Reddit! Wong this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2009, 05:54 PM   #12
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,765
Below the German information sheet on the M-105 and VK-107 I used for the first analysis, second page ...
Attached Images
File Type: gif P105_2.gif (59.9 KB, 109 views)
HoHun is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Spurl this Post!Reddit! Wong this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2009, 07:26 PM   #13
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,765
Hi again,

>Still, the Stepanets power graphs seem to give slightly too low power values at low altitude for my analysis to work, making it difficult to match sea level speed and especially turn rate data, while they are certainly too high at high altitude. The latter is an effect well-known for WW2 power graphs calculated according to the then-standard method, so I'm ignoring it for now.

Here is a graph showing the effect of modifying the Stepanets power graphs above high gear full throttle height to a power value proportional to ambient air pressure. This is only a rule of thumb, but it seems to give good results.

In fact, the German power graph I posted above seems to be calculated following exactly the same rule.

(Note that Gordon/Khazanov give a ceiling of 9.1 km for the Yak-9D, which the modified graph misses relatively narrowly, while the original Stepanets graph yields a rather exaggerated high-altitude performance. This is a useful sanity check for the "ambient pressure" rule.)

Regards,

Henning (HoHun)
Attached Images
File Type: png Yak-9D_Climb_Comparison.png (7.4 KB, 107 views)
HoHun is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Spurl this Post!Reddit! Wong this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2009, 09:39 PM   #14
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,765
Hi again,

I just found an interesting subtype in Gordon/Khasanov's list: The 1944 Yak-9PD with a high-altitude engine, 1 m wingspan extension (adding 0.5 m^2 of wing area), and a flying weight of just 2500 kg. This is less than the Yak-3, so I guess it was a stripped-down "racer" like the high-altitude Spitfire V modifications!

Due to its low weight, manoeuvrability and climb rate are quite impressive ...

(The calculations based on power graphs modified according to the "atmospheric pressure" rule of thumb as described above.)

Regards,

Henning (HoHun)
Attached Images
File Type: png Yak-9PD_Speed_Comparison.png (7.7 KB, 106 views)
File Type: png Yak-9PD_Climb_Comparison.png (8.4 KB, 105 views)
File Type: png Yak-9PD_Turn_Comparison.png (8.2 KB, 106 views)

Last edited by HoHun; 03-27-2009 at 10:29 AM. Reason: (Turn rate Yak-9D corrected - accidentally showed data from a different version)
HoHun is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Spurl this Post!Reddit! Wong this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2009, 11:41 AM   #15
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,765
Hi Claidemore,

>A few websites

Thanks, interesting stuff up there!

Even Stepanets' book can be found online following your links:

Stepanets. Yak Fighters in WWII

In Russian, of course :-/

Regards,

Henning (HoHun)
HoHun is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Spurl this Post!Reddit! Wong this Post!
Reply With Quote
Reply


« Russian Fighters | - »
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:49 AM.
Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2009, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0
Ad Management plugin by RedTyger
Design by HTWoRKS


1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118