Does anyone remember... - Aircraft of World War II

Graeme · 09-26-2007, 06:24 AM

...a Swiss project called the ALR Piranha, a lightweight 'affordable' supersonic combat aircraft. Swiss 'scientists' started work on the design somewhere around 1977. The project persisted for something like ten years. Obviously never built/flown, but I have no idea the reason for it's ultimate demise.

Graeme · 09-26-2007, 06:50 AM

...a single-seat, advanced-technology, low cost, STOL fighter/attack design from NEW ZEALAND called the ADDAX-1, from around 1983.

SoD Stitch · 09-26-2007, 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Graeme

...a Swiss project called the ALR Piranha, a lightweight 'affordable' supersonic combat aircraft. Swiss 'scientists' started work on the design somewhere around 1977. The project persisted for something like ten years. Obviously never built/flown, but I have no idea the reason for it's ultimate demise.

I vaguely remember reading something about this; looks like many features of the Piranha were incoporated into Sweden's Gripen. I wonder how many engineers were involved in both projects? Interesting . . .

As for it's ultimate demise, it was probably the same reason so many other projects never reach fruituion: money. Why develop your own fighter, when you can spend half (?) as much money and buy one off-the-shelf from another country?

DerAdlerIstGelandet · 09-26-2007, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Graeme

...a Swiss project called the ALR Piranha, a lightweight 'affordable' supersonic combat aircraft. Swiss 'scientists' started work on the design somewhere around 1977. The project persisted for something like ten years. Obviously never built/flown, but I have no idea the reason for it's ultimate demise.

I can tell you why it did not.

By the time this thing really started to get going, they bought the F/A-18 Hornet.

Matt308 · 09-26-2007, 01:44 PM

And interest rates were almost 20%

Matt308 · 09-26-2007, 01:45 PM

[QUOTE=SoD Stitch;277893]I vaguely remember reading something about this; looks like many features of the Piranha were incoporated into Sweden's Gripen. [QUOTE]

...and that's the right answer.

Graeme · 09-26-2007, 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoD Stitch

Why develop your own fighter, when you can spend half (?) as much money and buy one off-the-shelf from another country?

Interestingly the Swiss had produced an earlier 'fighter/ground attack' aircraft-the P-16. However it never went into production. So they did have experience. Less money than Sweden?

Graeme · 01-09-2008, 03:25 AM

Came across a November 1992 edition of Air International. According to the author the project depended financially on successfully negotiating licensed production of the Piranha with "Middle East countries." Negotiations broke down and the project became too expensive for the Swiss to fund by themselves.

Interestingly a "major United States aircraft manufacturer" provided an "impartial assessment" on the project and concluded (in a report dated 1982) that its "performance in terms of sustained turn rate, rate of climb and acceleration will match the capability of the F-16A and exceed that of the F-5G/-20."

Matt308 · 01-09-2008, 05:03 PM

That I can believe. Look at the size of that thing! It likely weighed about 5000kg and had a HUGE thrust-to-weight ratio.

Soundbreaker Welch? · 01-14-2008, 04:04 AM

I wonder how strong it was? Was it a blower upper, like the Zero?

HealzDevo · 05-01-2008, 05:55 AM

It looks like it belongs in a Sci-Fi Movie, Book or Picture the ALR Pirana and even the name sounds Sci-Fi planeish. But then perhaps that is just me...

Matt308 · 05-02-2008, 06:52 PM

Yeah. Just you...

pbfoot · 05-02-2008, 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Graeme

Interestingly the Swiss had produced an earlier 'fighter/ground attack' aircraft-the P-16. However it never went into production. So they did have experience. Less money than Sweden?

That thing ended up as the first Lear Jet or at least the wings

09-26-2007, 06:24 AM	#1
Graeme Senior Member Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 2,080	Does anyone remember... ...a Swiss project called the ALR Piranha, a lightweight 'affordable' supersonic combat aircraft. Swiss 'scientists' started work on the design somewhere around 1977. The project persisted for something like ten years. Obviously never built/flown, but I have no idea the reason for it's ultimate demise. Last edited by Graeme; 01-09-2008 at 03:04 AM. Reason: improved image

09-26-2007, 06:50 AM	#2
Graeme Senior Member Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 2,080	...a single-seat, advanced-technology, low cost, STOL fighter/attack design from NEW ZEALAND called the ADDAX-1, from around 1983. Last edited by Graeme; 01-09-2008 at 03:06 AM. Reason: improved image

09-26-2007, 01:44 PM	#5
Matt308 aka Dickcheese Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Washington State Posts: 14,700	And interest rates were almost 20% __________________ "Some people spend an entire lifetime wondering if they made a difference in the world. But, the [U.S.] Marines don't have that problem." -- Ronald Reagan Master of Duplicate Posts

09-26-2007, 01:45 PM	#6
Matt308 aka Dickcheese Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Washington State Posts: 14,700	[QUOTE=SoD Stitch;277893]I vaguely remember reading something about this; looks like many features of the Piranha were incoporated into Sweden's Gripen. [QUOTE] ...and that's the right answer. __________________ "Some people spend an entire lifetime wondering if they made a difference in the world. But, the [U.S.] Marines don't have that problem." -- Ronald Reagan Master of Duplicate Posts

01-09-2008, 05:03 PM	#9
Matt308 aka Dickcheese Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Washington State Posts: 14,700	That I can believe. Look at the size of that thing! It likely weighed about 5000kg and had a HUGE thrust-to-weight ratio. __________________ "Some people spend an entire lifetime wondering if they made a difference in the world. But, the [U.S.] Marines don't have that problem." -- Ronald Reagan Master of Duplicate Posts

01-09-2008, 03:25 AM	#8
Graeme Senior Member Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 2,080	Came across a November 1992 edition of Air International. According to the author the project depended financially on successfully negotiating licensed production of the Piranha with "Middle East countries." Negotiations broke down and the project became too expensive for the Swiss to fund by themselves. Interestingly a "major United States aircraft manufacturer" provided an "impartial assessment" on the project and concluded (in a report dated 1982) that its "performance in terms of sustained turn rate, rate of climb and acceleration will match the capability of the F-16A and exceed that of the F-5G/-20."

01-14-2008, 04:04 AM	#10
Soundbreaker Welch? Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Colorado, USA Posts: 1,897	I wonder how strong it was? Was it a blower upper, like the Zero? __________________ "His motor's conked out!" "What's the differance, they're all Nazis!" "Luke, shut up!" "Fear the hook!" "Oh.....I wanna fly." "You mean the kind that go under water and fly up the stairs?" "What you doing? Oh Nooooo!"

05-01-2008, 05:55 AM	#11
HealzDevo Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Queensland Posts: 1,252	It looks like it belongs in a Sci-Fi Movie, Book or Picture the ALR Pirana and even the name sounds Sci-Fi planeish. But then perhaps that is just me... __________________ http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/alb...500&ppuser=671 Link To My Picture Gallery

05-02-2008, 06:52 PM	#12
Matt308 aka Dickcheese Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Washington State Posts: 14,700	Yeah. Just you... __________________ "Some people spend an entire lifetime wondering if they made a difference in the world. But, the [U.S.] Marines don't have that problem." -- Ronald Reagan Master of Duplicate Posts

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