Luftwaffe to fly over Britain for 70th anniversary - Aircraft of World War II

Colin1 · 10-30-2009, 07:38 PM

Messerschmitts and Spitfires to share the skies

By Richard Alleyne
Daily Telegraph Friday October 30th 2009

RAF Spitfires and Luftwaffe Messerschmitts are to share the skies above Britain for the first time since the Second World War.

The German Air Force has been invited to bring its historic fighters to the Battle of Britain 70th anniversary celebrations at the RAF International Tattoo next July.
Joining the Messerschmitts, which fought countless dogfights with Spitfires and Hurricanes, will be historic planes from the Italian Air Force, which flew alongside their German allies.
It is the first time the German and Italian Air Forces have been asked to take part in the International Air Tattoo at RAF Fairford, Gloucester - the biggest annual celebration of military aircraft in the world.

Organisers visited the German and Italian Embassies in London earlier this month to invite their air forces to join the displays in the Battle of Britain Memorial Flight.

Tim Prince, the Tattoo's director, said it was important to recognise the bravery and honour the fallen of both sides of the conflict. "The Air Tattoo is renowned the world over for being a place where nations come together in a spirit of friendship to share their passion for aviation" he said.

"The German military has been a great supporter of the Air Tattoo for many years and we're delighted it will be taking part in this important anniversary."

He said the Tattoo would celebrate not just the roles of the principal players in the Battle of Britain - the Germans, British and Italians - but all 17 countries that were involved.

The invitation to air forces that were once Britain's sworn enemies was welcomed by war veterans and military associations.

Pat Beard, a former RAF officer from Tewkesbury, Gloucester said enough time has passed for old hostilities to be forgotten and the historic event celebrated by all concerned.
"It is a war long gone and we have all joined hands now to work together" he said.
"Everyone who fought in the war was an airman regardless of which side he was on and I think there was a feeling of great comradeship between them all."

A spokesman for the Cheltenham branch of the British Legion said "We see nothing wrong with the Germans and Italians coming to the Tattoo to take part in this commemoration at all. We are all friends now. There is no way this should be a problem for anyone."

Robert Lee, national spokesman for the Royal British Legion said "The fact is that today the Germans and Italians are our allies in Afghanistan. We are now in the middle of a Poppy Appeal here and our theme is about supporting the wounded and bereaved as a result of what is happening in the Afghan conflict."

Dubbed Britain's finest hour by Winston Churchill, the Battle of Britain in 1940 was the prelude to Hitler's planned Operation Sea Lion, the invasion of Britain. The Luftwaffe's failure to establish air superiority over the outnumbered RAF meant that plans for the invasion were shelved.

Lasting less than four months, it was the first major campaign fought entirely by air forces.

vikingBerserker · 10-30-2009, 07:51 PM

Gees, I would love to see that!

DerAdlerIstGelandet · 10-30-2009, 08:30 PM

Very cool. I might have to make a trip over there. I have been to the Air Tattoo back in 1997 and it really was a great time. Probably the best airshow I have ever been to.

However the information above is not true. The German and Italian Air Forces have taken part in the Air Tattoo before. I am looking at the Air Tattoo guide that I bought back in 1997, and it lists all the participants.

From the German Air Force:
C-160D Transall (LTG 63)
Mig-29 (JG 73)
Tornado (AkG 51)
Tornado ECR (JbG 52)

From the German Navy:
Atlantic
Dornier Do 28D Skyservant
Dornier Do 228
Sea King MK41
Tornado
Lynk Mk88

From the Italian Air Force:
AMX (32 Stormo)
Atlantic (30 Stormo)
P180 Avanti (RSV)
BD808GE (14 Stormo)
TF-104G Starfighter (9 Stormo)
Tornado ADV (53 Stormo)

Of course I could have misunderstood the information and they are talking about WW2 German and Italian aircraft.

Njaco · 10-30-2009, 08:34 PM

Does anybody know how many vintage aircraft from each country are flying? I didn't think there were that many Bf 109s flyable.

Colin1 · 10-30-2009, 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DerAdlerIstGelandet

However the information above is not true. The German and Italian Air Forces have taken part in the Air Tattoo before. I am looking at the Air Tattoo guide that I bought back in 1997, and it lists all the participants.

Of course I could have misunderstood the information and they are talking about WW2 German and Italian aircraft.

I'm not gunning for this guy - he's a journalist, he's quite likely to have got it wrong himself
but yes, I think he's implying that it's for WWII German and Italian aircraft

vikingBerserker · 10-30-2009, 08:36 PM

WOW, I had no idea Germany flew the Mig-29. Found a pic, beautiful!

Colin1 · 10-30-2009, 08:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vikingBerserker

WOW, I had no idea Germany flew the Mig-29. Found a pic, beautiful!

I think they were a left-over from the collapse of the Soviet Union (East Germany).

vikingBerserker · 10-30-2009, 08:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Colin1

I think they were a left-over from the collapse of the Soviet Union (East Germany).

Wow, all I ever get is left-over meatloaf.

I wonder if the Messerschmitts are 108's of the Spanish built 109's.

Njaco · 10-30-2009, 08:51 PM

probably HA's

DerAdlerIstGelandet · 10-30-2009, 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Colin1

I'm not gunning for this guy - he's a journalist, he's quite likely to have got it wrong himself
but yes, I think he's implying that it's for WWII German and Italian aircraft

Actually I think I did just misunderstood him. The very first line says "Messerschmitts and Spitfire"....

It's late, I need to get to bed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by vikingBerserker

WOW, I had no idea Germany flew the Mig-29. Found a pic, beautiful!

When East Germany fell, the former West Germany took over a lot of the former Eastern Block's equipment.

Maximowitz · 10-30-2009, 09:30 PM

Great! I'll be there.

GrauGeist · 10-30-2009, 09:54 PM

Sure hope you guys can get some photos...that looks like it's going to be an awesome show!

seesul · 10-30-2009, 10:00 PM

Hope this one will be there YouTube - BF109 and Flugwerk as well YouTube - Flug Werk FW 190
But I guess it´s just a wish...

DerAdlerIstGelandet · 10-30-2009, 10:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Njaco

Does anybody know how many vintage aircraft from each country are flying? I didn't think there were that many Bf 109s flyable.

I got to see one of the flying Bf 109s a few months ago. Very very cool.

Here is a list of flyable Luftwaffe aircraft that I know of.
Bf 109E-7 Werk Nr. 3579 (Canada)
Bf 109G-10 Werk Nr. 151591 (Germany)
Do 24T-3 (TT) Werk Nr. 5345 (Philippines)
Fw 190A? Werk Nr. ? (It is a Flugwerk Fw 190, I am not sure if it is original or new built. I saw it fly a few months ago)
Ju 52/3m Werk Nr. 5489 (Germany)
Ju 52/3m Werk Nr. 6580 (Switzerland)
Ju 52/3m Werk Nr. 6595 (Switzerland)
Ju 52/3m Werk Nr. 6610 (Switzerland)
CASA 352L (Ju 52/3m) Werk Nr. 67 (Spain)
CASA 352L (Ju 52/3m) Werk Nr. 96 (Switzerland)
CASA 352L (Ju 52/3m) Werk Nr. 102 (Spain)
Ju 52/3m Werk Nr. 24 (France)
CASA 352L (Ju 52/3m) Werk Nr. 164 (South Africa)

Spanish Bf 109s (HA-1112s) that are already flying as Bf 109s with DB 605 engines.
HA-1112-M1L Werk Nr. 139 (Germany) (rebuilt as a Bf 109G-4)
HA-1112-M1L (Werk Nr. 156) (Germany) (rebuilt as a Bf 109G-6)

Spanish Bf 109s (HA-1112s) being rebuilt to flying condition with DB 605 engines as Bf 109G's.
HA-1112-M1L Werk Nr. 133 (Germany) (Being built to a Bf 109G-6)

Currently being restored to flying status.
Bf 109E-7 Werk Nr. 1983 (England)
Bf 109E-7 Werk Nr. 2023 (USA)
Bf 109E-1/B Werk Nr. 4034 (England)
Bf 109F-1 Werk Nr. ? (France)
Bf 109F-4 Werk Nr. 8347 (Russia)
Bf 109F-4 Werk Nr. 8461 (USA)
Bf 109F-4 Werk Nr. 8993 (Germany)
Bf 109F-4 Werk Nr. 10144 (USA)
Bf 109F-4 Werk Nr. 10256 (USA)
Fw 189A-2 Werk Nr. 0112100 (Germany)
Fw 190F-8 Werk Nr. 5415 (England)
Fw 190A-3 Werk Nr. 5467 (USA)
Fw 190A-5 Werk Nr. 0151227 (USA)
Fw 190A-8 Werk Nr. 173056 (USA)
Fw 190A-6 Werk Nr. 55047 (USA)
Fw 190F-8 Werk Nr. 931862 (USA)
He 111P-2 Werk Nr. 5883 (Austria)
CASA-2.111B (He 111) Werk Nr. 152 (USA)
Junkers A 50 Werk Nr. 3517 (Germany)
Bf 110C-4 Werk Nr. 3577 (Italy)

Quote:

Originally Posted by seesul

Hope this one will be there YouTube - BF109 and Flugwerk as well YouTube - Flug Werk FW 190
But I guess it´s just a wish...

I was fortunate enough to see that very same Bf 109 fly at an airshow here in Germany last month. I think that is the same Fw 190 that I saw flying at the airshow as well.

Here is a few pics and vids that I took:

Vids:

Njaco · 10-30-2009, 11:56 PM

Thanks Chris!

Quote:

Bf 109E-7 Werk Nr. 3579 (Canada)

That may be the one pbfoot is associated with.

10-30-2009, 07:38 PM	#1
Colin1 Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 1,766	Luftwaffe to fly over Britain for 70th anniversary Messerschmitts and Spitfires to share the skies By Richard Alleyne Daily Telegraph Friday October 30th 2009 RAF Spitfires and Luftwaffe Messerschmitts are to share the skies above Britain for the first time since the Second World War. The German Air Force has been invited to bring its historic fighters to the Battle of Britain 70th anniversary celebrations at the RAF International Tattoo next July. Joining the Messerschmitts, which fought countless dogfights with Spitfires and Hurricanes, will be historic planes from the Italian Air Force, which flew alongside their German allies. It is the first time the German and Italian Air Forces have been asked to take part in the International Air Tattoo at RAF Fairford, Gloucester - the biggest annual celebration of military aircraft in the world. Organisers visited the German and Italian Embassies in London earlier this month to invite their air forces to join the displays in the Battle of Britain Memorial Flight. Tim Prince, the Tattoo's director, said it was important to recognise the bravery and honour the fallen of both sides of the conflict. "The Air Tattoo is renowned the world over for being a place where nations come together in a spirit of friendship to share their passion for aviation" he said. "The German military has been a great supporter of the Air Tattoo for many years and we're delighted it will be taking part in this important anniversary." He said the Tattoo would celebrate not just the roles of the principal players in the Battle of Britain - the Germans, British and Italians - but all 17 countries that were involved. The invitation to air forces that were once Britain's sworn enemies was welcomed by war veterans and military associations. Pat Beard, a former RAF officer from Tewkesbury, Gloucester said enough time has passed for old hostilities to be forgotten and the historic event celebrated by all concerned. "It is a war long gone and we have all joined hands now to work together" he said. "Everyone who fought in the war was an airman regardless of which side he was on and I think there was a feeling of great comradeship between them all." A spokesman for the Cheltenham branch of the British Legion said "We see nothing wrong with the Germans and Italians coming to the Tattoo to take part in this commemoration at all. We are all friends now. There is no way this should be a problem for anyone." Robert Lee, national spokesman for the Royal British Legion said "The fact is that today the Germans and Italians are our allies in Afghanistan. We are now in the middle of a Poppy Appeal here and our theme is about supporting the wounded and bereaved as a result of what is happening in the Afghan conflict." Dubbed Britain's finest hour by Winston Churchill, the Battle of Britain in 1940 was the prelude to Hitler's planned Operation Sea Lion, the invasion of Britain. The Luftwaffe's failure to establish air superiority over the outnumbered RAF meant that plans for the invasion were shelved. Lasting less than four months, it was the first major campaign fought entirely by air forces.

10-30-2009, 07:51 PM	#2
vikingBerserker Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: South Carolina Posts: 3,768	Gees, I would love to see that! __________________ "Those who forget the past are condemned to repeat it" "Those who dwell in the past, condemn the future"

10-30-2009, 08:30 PM	#3
DerAdlerIstGelandet Der Crewchief Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany Posts: 33,152	Very cool. I might have to make a trip over there. I have been to the Air Tattoo back in 1997 and it really was a great time. Probably the best airshow I have ever been to. However the information above is not true. The German and Italian Air Forces have taken part in the Air Tattoo before. I am looking at the Air Tattoo guide that I bought back in 1997, and it lists all the participants. From the German Air Force: C-160D Transall (LTG 63) Mig-29 (JG 73) Tornado (AkG 51) Tornado ECR (JbG 52) From the German Navy: Atlantic Dornier Do 28D Skyservant Dornier Do 228 Sea King MK41 Tornado Lynk Mk88 From the Italian Air Force: AMX (32 Stormo) Atlantic (30 Stormo) P180 Avanti (RSV) BD808GE (14 Stormo) TF-104G Starfighter (9 Stormo) Tornado ADV (53 Stormo) Of course I could have misunderstood the information and they are talking about WW2 German and Italian aircraft. __________________ fly boy:"isnt that the first jet bomber becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles"[/I]

10-30-2009, 08:34 PM	#4
Njaco The Pop-Tart Whisperer Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: South Jersey, United States Posts: 10,237	Does anybody know how many vintage aircraft from each country are flying? I didn't think there were that many Bf 109s flyable. __________________ "If you can read this, thank a teacher. If it's English, thank a soldier!" http://www.njcacoa.org/

10-30-2009, 08:36 PM	#6
vikingBerserker Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: South Carolina Posts: 3,768	WOW, I had no idea Germany flew the Mig-29. Found a pic, beautiful! __________________ "Those who forget the past are condemned to repeat it" "Those who dwell in the past, condemn the future"

10-30-2009, 08:51 PM	#9
Njaco The Pop-Tart Whisperer Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: South Jersey, United States Posts: 10,237	probably HA's __________________ "If you can read this, thank a teacher. If it's English, thank a soldier!" http://www.njcacoa.org/

10-30-2009, 09:30 PM	#11
Maximowitz Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: London, England. Posts: 839	Great! I'll be there. __________________

10-30-2009, 09:54 PM	#12
GrauGeist Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Redding, California Posts: 3,357	Sure hope you guys can get some photos...that looks like it's going to be an awesome show! __________________ "Look back over the past, with its changing empires that rose and fell, and you can foresee the future." - Marcus Aurelius, Emperor of Rome > I Support Doug Gillis <

10-30-2009, 10:00 PM	#13
seesul Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Zlin, Czech Republic Posts: 2,489	Hope this one will be there YouTube - BF109 and Flugwerk as well YouTube - Flug Werk FW 190 But I guess it´s just a wish... __________________ Roman Susil Zlin, Czech Republic ...a friend of Joe Owsianik,So. Plainfield, NJ, a former left waist gunner from B-17G ''Tail End Charlie" from 2ndBG,20th Sqdn who was forced to bail out on Aug. 29th, 1944 over my country.

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