Your top 10 modern fighters

[ozumn]

Are we forgetting that the AWACS would have picked up that Grippen long before the Grippen locked in ANY American aircraft, let alone the F-18 with a superior radar set...
Have u ever heard of something called Aircraft Carriers and Cruise Missles???

A war with Sweden would end very quickly pal....

we hace AWACS akso and the cruise missiles would be taken care off by BAMSE http://www.army-technology.com/projects/bamse/ and the carriers can the sub take out dont think it woukd be a walk in the park we are not some Arab nations but yeah US would easy win if it was a suprise attack and offcurse i think US would win in the long run but it would not be easy as you would think well thats what i think and have to think, and now im off to invade US playing Canada in Doomsday hehe.

[FLYBOYJ]

we hace AWACS akso and the cruise missiles would be taken care off by BAMSE http://www.army-technology.com/projects/bamse/ and the carriers can the sub take out dont think it woukd be a walk in the park we are not some Arab nations but yeah US would easy win if it was a suprise attack and offcurse i think US would win in the long run but it would not be easy as you would think well thats what i think and have to think, and now im off to invade US playing Canada in Doomsday hehe.

Sweden doesn't have AWACS aircraft the size and capability of E-6s or ES-3Bs that could "blind" almost all of Europe with only 3 or 4 aircraft - Fighting Sweden wouldn't be a walk in a park - Sweden has a very well trained military designed to fight for a limited amount of time and then conduct guerrilla operations. It's whole military doctrine is to make an invasion painful for anyone who might try....

[ozumn]

No we dont have the size but still have AWACS, dont have any stats on them so i dont know if they suck or are great.

[ozumn]

We are sending Gripen to Alaska this summer for some exercise, seems to alot of nations going there, any one have some inside info on that?

Pretty cool to go to Alaska with so short range.

[FLYBOYJ]

No we dont have the size but still have AWACS, dont have any stats on them so i dont know if they suck or are great.

The Swedish AF only has one SAAB 340B available to do AWACS work, hardly enough to stop a sizeable force but probably capable enough to impede a localized intrusion. SAAB developed the SAAB 2000 ERIEYE AWE&C system, which seems to be a great short range platform but i think the airframe size would limit it electronic capability and it seems this system is being exported at this time, but looking at the Boeing E-3 you're probably looking at triple the price and four times the capability. Again I think you're in a same situation with the Gripen vs. the F-16 or Mirage 2000 - mission & costs determining requirement...

[ozumn]

we have 6 S 100B Argus and 2 S 102B Korpen not saying thay are UBER or so just saying we have them.

[pbfoot]

We are sending Gripen to Alaska this summer for some exercise, seems to alot of nations going there, any one have some inside info on that?

Pretty cool to go to Alaska with so short range.

well as you already stated the last time they crossed the pond they took the same route all light aircraft use when crossing more then likely Prestwick or Shannon to Keflivik then Narsasaquac or Bluie west in Greenland then Goose Bay or Gander that is the same route as any light shortranged a/c has used since crossing the Atlantic was commonplace even seen a Bearcat F8F use that route as well as Helicopters

[ozumn]

oh Bearcat thats a nice plane btw.

[Henk]

Well talking of war, the thing is that the US have the man power, the Navy, the airforce and the technology, but I think that on the ground the US can kicks a**, but it depends on the will of the guys you are up against and the tactics used against the invader that will be the turning point of a war.

Lets take a example that I know very well. The Anglo Boer war. The UK had the most superior army and technology of that time, but they still got nowhere. They did take over Pretoria and most ground of the Boer nations, but still could not win the war man to man. They had more men than the Boers and still could not win.

To fight on the ground in a other country is not a easy thing. You can learn the maps and still it would not budge. Guruala war fare is the thing you can not crack or get controle of. Today the US would bomb South Africa into little peaces and burn the airfields and docks, but on the ground it can turn nasty.

South Africa developed most of their systems themselfs, has one of the best artillery in the world, the G-5 and the G-6. The Rooivalk attack helicopter can whip a** and so can our airforce. The thing of SA is that airfields is not easy to get to, but can be destroyed. We do not have any bombers like the US nor Aircraft Carriers, but our coast is a sun of a b**ch.

The way I see it that the US can take over much ground, but against Gorilla war fare they are not so good. The thing in Iraq is that those stupid sun of a bitches that is fighting against the US forces now, suck, that is not Gorilla war fare that is terrorism at its best.

Your guys must really have the will to fight and must be hard a** sun of a bitches that you wont leave near your daughter. Take the Bush war in Angola, the South African Army fought against more superior enemy and airforce, but they still did not get the South African Army or Airforce to go down on their knees, but who won at the end, the communists, because the South African forces pulled back.

The way it looks to me that the guys in Iraq that fight in the US Army does not really want to fight there. They do not have the will anymore for that bullshit.

You may have the technology and man power, but it still does not mean that you will win the war.

Henk

[FLYBOYJ]

The way it looks to me that the guys in Iraq that fight in the US Army does not really want to fight there. They do not have the will anymore for that bullshit.

Now I don't know where your hearing or reading that - Adler was there and he'll tell you different. The guys that have gone to Iraq ARE NOT conscripts - they joined the military freely and there are many who have done 2 and 3 tours. My brother is a 2 tour Vietnam Vet, 56 years old and is still waiting orders to go to Iraq - he views himself as a professional soldier and will fight anywhere when called upon, there are many serving in the US military with the same sense of duty and dedication. As usual I think you're only hearing the negative press. Currently 125,000 soldiers are trying to police 7 million Iraqis.

[Henk]

Yes, I understand what you are saying , but are they not sick of it and want to go home and not be left with that mess?

The worst thing of war is that some guys come back totally mad and does not recover from it other have nightmares and sociological problems. Some of the guys who came back from Angola also never came back human, they changed for the worst.

What I meant is that do they fight with the spirit that they started with under the influence that there is weapons of mass destruction. Now it has turned into a war against real nasty terrorists.

What is the morale of the men there for real, no bullshit guys I mean do they really want to come home or still fight?

Henk

[pbfoot]

Henk your artillery was built in South Africa but designed by a guy called Gerald Bull who was not South African but the probably the best ballistic engineer you should read up on him and see what he did with the 16" guns from the US Navy

[FLYBOYJ]

Yes, I understand what you are saying , but are they not sick of it and want to go home and not be left with that mess?

many of those there don't consider it a mess...

The worst thing of war is that some guys come back totally mad and does not recover from it other have nightmares and sociological problems. Some of the guys who came back from Angola also never came back human, they changed for the worst.

My brother did 2 tours in Nam - was never the same..

What I meant is that do they fight with the spirit that they started with under the influence that there is weapons of mass destruction. Now it has turned into a war against real nasty terrorists.

What is the morale of the men there for real, no bullshit guys I mean do they really want to come home or still fight?

Henk

Many of the ones I've met (they were from Fort Carson) are proud of what they did and have stated that the media doesn't give a good account of what goes on there. One guy I met said the ones he really enjoyed seeing killed are the non-Iraqis, terrorists from other countries that wanted to go there to fight. I was told that they make up about 10% of the combatants.

No soldier wants to be detached from family but it seems most of the US soldiers in Iraq still have high morale and there are still many stateside willing to go over there.....

[davparlr]

Yes, I understand what you are saying , but are they not sick of it and want to go home and not be left with that mess?

The worst thing of war is that some guys come back totally mad and does not recover from it other have nightmares and sociological problems. Some of the guys who came back from Angola also never came back human, they changed for the worst.

What I meant is that do they fight with the spirit that they started with under the influence that there is weapons of mass destruction. Now it has turned into a war against real nasty terrorists.

What is the morale of the men there for real, no bullshit guys I mean do they really want to come home or still fight?

Henk

You have been listening to some slanted info. Almost all soldiers want to come home from war. Who wants to be shot at compared to sitting with a loved one around a home fire? And there will always be someone to complain and always a news man willing to listen to that one complain. In truth, I think the forces in Iraq are highly motivated and believe that they are offering the Iraqis an opportuny to have democratic government. Gee, what a evil objective to have. They also believe that that government will make a more stable middle east, and therefore, help stablize the most volatile and troublesome area of the world. This is different than Vietnam, which I am a veteran. There, many soldiers were drafted and morale was low. They still stayed and fought and won every battle, only to be withdrawn by polititians, who lost the war. Still they fought for 10 years, the longest war in American history. Nobody who knows our troops in Iraq think that they are angry, if they are, its against lousy news reporting that deceives the public of what they are doing.

You are right about guerrilla warfare. It is a dangerous war, even with powerful forces. Especially if one is too civilized to use the brutal techniques of the Nazis. I do believe the American armed forces are strongest military the world has ever seen, but warfare in the jungle or mountains against a determined, well supported guerrilla group would be deadly. However, with the new weapons available, supplies will be severely limited to the terrorist. The terrorist in Iraq are not supported by the majority of Iraqis.

To answer you question, they want to come home, but they believe in winning and they will fight!

[Henk]

Henk your artillery was built in South Africa but designed by a guy called Gerald Bull who was not South African but the probably the best ballistic engineer you should read up on him and see what he did with the 16" guns from the US Navy

I know about him. He made that mother of a gun from the barrels of 16 inch guns and later were killed by the Israelis because he was building this big gun for Iraq. He tried to smuggle it into Iraq making as if the parts of the barrel was for oil pipes and almost succeeded. He was also jailed for solding the specs to the South African Government during the Apartheid era and the Angola war.

He sold the plans or specs of the 155mm Howitzer guns that was later used in the G-5 and G-6. The G-5 is a towed artillery and has the best pin point shot you will ever get from that kind of artillery. The G-6 is a mobile artillery with the 155mm Howitzer. I have seen one of the G-6 at the Joburg Military Museum and it is a monster of a war machine. The G-6 is a 6X6.

The G-6:










She is lovely.

That is actually great to hear that the guys in Iraq still have great moral.

Henk