Britons tire of cruel, vulgar US: poll

DerAdlerIstGelandet · 07-04-2006, 08:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpitfireKing

In answer to other questions, a majority of the Britons questions described Americans as uncaring, divided by class, awash in violent crime, vulgar, preoccupied with money, ignorant of the outside world, racially divided, uncultured and in the most overwhelming result (90 percent of respondents) dominated by big business."

That is not just what England thinks, that is what the majority of the world thinks.

Dont take me wrong though. I am a German with US citizenship and serve in the US Army and I dont agree with all of that, but many US citizens bring this upon themselves by the way they act in other countries. I see so many US Soldiers over here that give the US a bad name by the way they act and present themselves.

DerAdlerIstGelandet · 07-04-2006, 08:37 AM

From what I tell, by speaking with Germans here on a daily basis is this. They have nothing against Americans or the American People but they do not like Bush. Believe it or not also, they are very friendly to Americans over here (with the exception of the turds that act like assholes) but they will tell you that they do not like Bush.

Nonskimmer · 07-04-2006, 08:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DerAdlerIstGelandet

That is not just what England thinks, that is what the majority of the world thinks.

Too true I'm afraid. Yet it's been my experience that an awful lot of those doing the bitching and moaning are exactly the same way. Like syscom says, it's a form of "group think". People are sheep, and too often don't really have a clue about what they're complaining for.

Quote:

Originally Posted by syscom3

I was dumbfounded on how so many people were brain washed by their govt media to hate Bush. Yet noone could say really why. It reminded me of the right wing idiots who hated Clinton in the 90's. Really weird. Group think taken to an extreme.

Sure sounds a lot like this place, except you can basically replace Bush with the US in general in that statement. The thing is, Canadians and Americans are practically the same people. The differences are superficial at best. More often than not it's merely a case of different terminology. Provinces vice states, we're metric and they're not, and that sort of thing. I think in our case the bad mouthing stems more from a desperate need to differentiate ourselves from our American bros, and we often take it a bit far in my opinion. It seems that we'll often do the opposite simply for the sake thereof, whether it makes any sense to do so or not. At least that's been my observation over the years. I dunno. It's a form of deep rooted insecurity that's infected people on a national scale. I think it's utterly foolish.

trackend · 07-04-2006, 09:23 AM

I take as I find what nationality they are has no bearing on it at all a prat is a prat the US is at the moment the dominant power and as such as with all past powers they will tend to do things that favour their own well being either economicly or militairly it would barmy to shoot yourself in the foot when you can shoot someone elses.
On the whole I think the US has been very restrained in most of world affairs
perhaps having huge buisiness interests all around the globe means treading a tad more carefully than past powers did " Sir the indians are revolting! ". "You're telling me, blow the crap out of them at once and nick all their tea".
I am not a Bush lover (at least not that sort of bush) I keep getting the "look at me daddy" feeling, although our own John Prescott is not exactly an interlectual giant.

syscom3 · 07-04-2006, 10:45 AM

One thing I've observed about the European intelligencia is they believe that a successfull politician must be well educated from one of a few large internationally respected universities, and have a long resume of qualifications.

They hated Reagan because he was not college educated (even though a govenor of the largest state in the union and a labor union leader)

They thought Bush 1 as being tolerable as he did have the "credentials".

They loved Clinton as he was an Oxford graduate (and really nothing else) and he understood that US interests must be subordinated to what the UN wanted.

Now they dispise Bush 2 because he has no credentials, other than an MBA from Harvard.

Generally, these Eusropeans dont understand that in America, anyone can be president. And that gives them fits, jealous rages and irrational self-defeating comments and actions. They deep down, secretly dont like democracy.

davparlr · 07-04-2006, 12:12 PM

A few comments on this thread. First, the comments about Bush's intelligence. Foolish people judge intelligence by fluent speech (or fluent writing, as I have witnessed on this site, including my own). I have known may silver tongued orators with lead (the metal) brains. Take for instance, the Hollywood crowd who like to boast fluently about their knowledge when they don't have enough combined education, or brains, to fill a bucket. On the other hand, I have known brilliant people who could hardly put two words together. George Bush scored higher on the IQ test administered by the military than John Kerry (no big deal however). George Bush has an MBA which is probably more education than 99% of his critics who says he is not smart. George Bush flew F-102s in the Air Force. You have to be quick witted and make sound decisions to fly a high performance aircraft. These traits are regularly tested in-depth by the military. In 1969 (one year after Bush), when I applied to the Air Force for pilot training, I was told that, because of the quantity of applications for pilot training during draft years, the Air Force only took applicants in the top 5% of IQ test scores. Top 5% of college graduates! While Bush entered pilot training through the National Guard, the standards were still quite high and he still had to compete with the regular Air Force inductees. As president, after we were brutally attacked, he looked at the data that was presented to him by the world, and arrived at a blatantly obvious (I can but won't expand on) conclusion that happened to be against the political mainstream ostrich society (keep your head in the sand). As for Iraq, yes, there were many mistakes. Only idiots think that wars don't generate mistakes by the most brilliant leaders. I could probably argue that Bush and his team have generated fewer mistakes in a war as complex as this one, than any other leader in a war in the last 200 years (remember that mistakes by winners are soon erased). And, Iraq still has the possibility of turning out to be one of the most significant positive events in the 21st century. He is a man who sticks by his friends, makes decisions and sticks to them as long as they make sense to him and he does what he says, a rarity for politicians. I suspect there are few great leader who have not had these characteristics. The left leaning media in our country and across the world do not like his conservative, value-base leadership and conscientiously makes every effort to put him in a bad light.

As for the polls.

Polls, like statistics, tend to reflect the opinon of those doing the polling and statistical analysis.

I have no defence for loud mouth Americans. They are indeed spoiled and disgraceful.

From my experience and what I have heard, Europeans have been very friendly to Americans, even the French. Hopefully, that attitude is returned.

I'll try not to stereotype. England is a great place full of great people. The kind of people that can be depended upon. We are fortunate to have them as friends. And we would be wise to nourish that friendship.

As for the EU (not including England). To me they seem leaderless with no direction. They would perfer to ignore problems than address them. They also are willing to let the US lead in facing the threats to society, but with lots of complaints. They ARE NOT willing to spend the money necessary to provide a defense that would allow them to lead. In essence, they complain about the US, but don't want to make the sacrifices necessary for the US to reduce its military influence in the world. And it appears that some had dirty hands when it came to dealing with Saddam.

Economically, they complain that the US is materialistic, but, they sure do like the fact we buy their products and would complain if we didn't.

They complain about our violence (very bad indeed, but a mixture of diverse cultures and significant individual freedoms can tend to allow violence) and our self-centered dispicable society (we probably give more aid than most nations per capita, but we certainly use too much oil), but if the world suddenly opened all the borders to free immigration, who would dare honestly answer where the vast majority would go (probably the same place they are trying to go now)??

While I think Bush's forgein policy on terror is outstanding (Iraq is like a protected knight on the opponents side of the board which effectively prevents his offense-for those of you who play chess) I am unhappy about our border security and lack of a strong program to terminate oil imports, which I believe is our biggest security risk.

We all have to remember that we all want the same thing, freedom and protection from those who would harm us in order to force their way of life on us. We may have different ideas about how to do that, but we should not lose sight of who our enemy is.

Sorry for the novel. I just had a few things to say. I think Bush has gotten a bum rap from the media and a lot of people have bought into it.

Erich · 07-04-2006, 01:02 PM

appreciate your honest candor.

let me make something clear which I think can be honored and agreed upon in this paged thread. the Media is controlling and will way your decision making, it did the time of Vietnam and ever more so now. Do not be delusional, make the decisions based on what you know is right in your heart ......

E ♫

FLYBOYJ · 07-04-2006, 01:09 PM

Great post davparlr!!! Like I told an acquaintance - in 1968 you had a flight training slot available. Would you take it or just wait for your number to come up???? And to those bone heads who think his old man pull strings for him, well maybe, but not when it comes to earning those wings. All the money in the world doesn't buy you military aviator's wings, and if it did the recipient wouldn't live to see 100 hours flight time wearing them....

syscom3 · 07-04-2006, 02:32 PM

Its amazing that while the EU champions "human rights", only are those rights truely enshrined in our constitution and guarented by "God".

The state supported media in Europe reflects what the govt wants the people to know, whether by plan or not. I can look back at the 70's and only wish we had an internet and fox news that was capable of carrying an alternative view.

If there is one sterotype I have of Europeans in general, is they are so condesending know it all's that think all Americans are dumb. I've had a few lively debates in HK, Jakarta, Moscow, Martinique, Mexico City and Singapore to conform my suspicions.

davparlr · 07-04-2006, 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FLYBOYJ

Great post davparlr!!! Like I told an acquaintance - in 1968 you had a flight training slot available. Would you take it or just wait for your number to come up???? And to those bone heads who think his old man pull strings for him, well maybe, but not when it comes to earning those wings. All the money in the world doesn't buy you military aviator's wings, and if it did the recipient wouldn't live to see 100 hours flight time wearing them....

There were several National Guard in our Flight Training class. Most of us felt that they, because the Guard at that time was hard to get into, knew someone. Well, that's life, isn't it. We didn't care as long as they performed and I can assure you they weren't coddled. They knew what planes they would get. Some were good, F-106s, some not so good, KC-97. They were all part of the team. The only student I saw coddled was an Afganistani whos father was the chief of the Royal Afganistan AF. It took him two years (nomal is one year) to get through. They had to let him fly a round robin solo so they put an instruction solo ahead of him and one behind and escorted him around the flight patch. He finally graduated and went on to fly.......F-104s!!!! He probably ended up in a whole somewhere.

FLYBOYJ · 07-04-2006, 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by davparlr

There were several National Guard in our Flight Training class. Most of us felt that they, because the Guard at that time was hard to get into, knew someone. Well, that's life, isn't it. We didn't care as long as they performed and I can assure you they weren't coddled. They knew what planes they would get. Some were good, F-106s, some not so good, KC-97. They were all part of the team. The only student I saw coddled was an Afganistani whos father was the chief of the Royal Afganistan AF. It took him two years (nomal is one year) to get through. They had to let him fly a round robin solo so they put an instruction solo ahead of him and one behind and escorted him around the flight patch. He finally graduated and went on to fly.......F-104s!!!! He probably ended up in a whole somewhere.

It's funny, when I was in the Naval Reserve I had to work harder and better than the Regs because they thought I was some kind of burger flipper in my full time job. Sometimes I had 2x the experience of my maintenance chiefs...