Real Or Fake? - Aircraft of World War II

Pisis · 09-15-2006, 08:14 AM

What do you think this video is a real or a fake?
YouTube - Battle of Britain

FLYBOYJ · 09-15-2006, 08:55 AM

It looks lika a real video made with Spits and Hispano HA-1112s.

Gnomey · 09-15-2006, 09:02 AM

Looks like a real video but it is not of the Battle of Britain. I would agree with Joe in that it is post war footage HA-1112s.

Pisis · 09-15-2006, 09:27 AM

Yeah, I did mean it's real for sure but if from the BoB or not. so not you say. I thought so...

FLYBOYJ · 09-15-2006, 11:00 AM

Fake, not from WW2.

Pisis · 09-15-2006, 12:48 PM

But still cool.

Gnomey · 09-15-2006, 12:59 PM

Yep but it isn't WW2 footage. Few things make it obvious.
1) Colour video wasn't really around especially not of that quality
2) No tracer
3) Ha-1112's

the lancaster kicks ass · 09-15-2006, 01:41 PM

no way that's WWII, it's all far too convenient........

Matt308 · 09-15-2006, 03:09 PM

Sorry gents. You all have it wrong. While exceptionally cool, it is computer generated. Here is my arguments, some strong, some weak.

1) While very well done indeed, the first person perspective from the wingman is too staged. The tactics are piss poor by both sides. The 109s break late for a non-firing head on pass and the Spits attempt no counter-break maneuver. C'mon. And did the Brits like the US use two man formations in 1939? I didn't think they did.

2) 109 bursts of fire produce no hits on the surf during low altitude and diving profile.

3) The graphics are great, but just slightly amiss. Lots of detail, but still looking like polygon generation to me.

4) The sound is obviously fake. In addition to having a color camera mounted externally outside of the prop circle with no perceptible airframe/mount shake during high G/(firing?) maneuvers, the audio would have required synchronization and two channel area mic and taps from the audio control panel to capture air-to-air comm.

5) PTT initiation does not result in spikes of background noise. Cannon/MG noises are definitely fake and did not originate from "recording" aircraft. Even in a modern day transport aircraft, the cockpit noise levels are significant. In a 109, at WEP, at 300+ mph, even a cannon/MG burst recorded from behind and say 100+ft away would not come thru so clear. Those who have been to a range will know what I'm talking about.

6) Pilot banter is certainly calm for such an adrenaline rush.

7) While perhaps a nit, I have read more than one recollection of FOD damage caused by expended cannon and MG casing ejections while in mid-air. Some of these resulting in loss of the damaged aircraft. Note the Spit makes a "suprise?" jump with a long burst directly from above and then in front of the 109 wingman. Not any indication (pilot maneuver or otherwise) of a expended case hit. Oversight? Or perhaps just lucky. Not really conclusively supportive. You have to admit though that it is awfully staged looking when the wingman then ignores the second Spit which has broken yet again and follows his wingman like any good director would instruct his camera man.

But it is really cool.

cheddar cheese · 09-15-2006, 03:13 PM

I agree, looks CGI to me too.

Hunter368 · 09-15-2006, 03:24 PM

Joe you should be able to answer this one better than most people here. Trailing plane is very close and right behind the first fighter. Right?

What about prop wash on that trailing plane would that not have screwed up the back plane? He is flying soo close I would of thought the prop wash would of screwed him up bad. If it was actually real planes flying.

What do you think Joe?

Joe did you notice my new sig? I was thinking about your sig when I did it. I was trying to find a Sabre in crosshairs but I could not. lol

Pisis · 09-15-2006, 03:41 PM

No way CGI... The question remains if is it WW2 or later.

PS: Hunter, nice Mig, there. Can you pls send me the original picture?

FLYBOYJ · 09-15-2006, 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hunter368

Joe you should be able to answer this one better than most people here. Trailing plane is very close and right behind the first fighter. Right?

What about prop wash on that trailing plane would that not have screwed up the back plane? He is flying soo close I would of thought the prop wash would of screwed him up bad. If it was actually real planes flying.

What do you think Joe?

Joe did you notice my new sig? I was thinking about your sig when I did it. I was trying to find a Sabre in crosshairs but I could not. lol

Great Sig - I was going to comment on it!!

To answer your question though, propwash will be below and to one side of the front aircraft, so if the chasing aircraft stayed right behind the front aircraft, at or above his tail he should be alright. Additionally I don't think the propwash off the lead plane would be that bad since both planes are about the same size and producing about the same horse power although it would be a little bumpy if one got behind the lead aircraft....

Hunter368 · 09-15-2006, 03:47 PM

I like your's also Pisis, for whatever reason I love the Mig-21 and older Migs. Here you go:

Yahoo! Image Detail for www.fredsboringpictures.com/images/Chino%2005/images/1141968%20MiG-15.jpg

Hunter368 · 09-15-2006, 03:48 PM

Ok thanks Joe, I knew you would know.

View Poll Results: Real Or Fake?
Real	1	12.50%
Fake	7	87.50%
Voters: 8. You may not vote on this poll

09-15-2006, 08:14 AM	#1
Pisis Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Praga Mater Urbium Posts: 5,859	Real Or Fake? What do you think this video is a real or a fake? YouTube - Battle of Britain __________________ "He's a menace to himself and everything else in the air... yes, birds too." - Airplane! Memory of Nation Why Did Hitler Want Czechoslovakia WW2 Was A War That Had To Be Fought! What Really Happened in Israel? Children of Hamas

09-15-2006, 08:55 AM	#2
FLYBOYJ IP/Mech THE GREAT GAZOO Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado, USA Posts: 16,051	It looks lika a real video made with Spits and Hispano HA-1112s. __________________ "IF ITS RED OR DUSTY, DON'T TOUCH IT"

09-15-2006, 09:02 AM	#3
Gnomey "World Traveller" Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Royal Deeside/St Andrews, Scotland, UK Posts: 15,224	Looks like a real video but it is not of the Battle of Britain. I would agree with Joe in that it is post war footage HA-1112s. __________________ "Success is not Final, Failure is not Fatal, it is the Courage to Continue that Counts" Sir Winston Churchill "To him the People of the World Largely owe the Freedom and Liberties they Enjoy Today" Enscription on Hugh Dowding's (AOC Fighter Command 1936-40) statue in London WW2 Talk: A WW2 Discussion Forum My Photo Collections on Flickr

09-15-2006, 09:27 AM	#4
Pisis Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Praga Mater Urbium Posts: 5,859	Yeah, I did mean it's real for sure but if from the BoB or not. so not you say. I thought so... __________________ "He's a menace to himself and everything else in the air... yes, birds too." - Airplane! Memory of Nation Why Did Hitler Want Czechoslovakia WW2 Was A War That Had To Be Fought! What Really Happened in Israel? Children of Hamas

09-15-2006, 11:00 AM	#5
FLYBOYJ IP/Mech THE GREAT GAZOO Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado, USA Posts: 16,051	Fake, not from WW2. __________________ "IF ITS RED OR DUSTY, DON'T TOUCH IT"

09-15-2006, 12:48 PM	#6
Pisis Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Praga Mater Urbium Posts: 5,859	But still cool. __________________ "He's a menace to himself and everything else in the air... yes, birds too." - Airplane! Memory of Nation Why Did Hitler Want Czechoslovakia WW2 Was A War That Had To Be Fought! What Really Happened in Israel? Children of Hamas

09-15-2006, 12:59 PM	#7
Gnomey "World Traveller" Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Royal Deeside/St Andrews, Scotland, UK Posts: 15,224	Yep but it isn't WW2 footage. Few things make it obvious. 1) Colour video wasn't really around especially not of that quality 2) No tracer 3) Ha-1112's __________________ "Success is not Final, Failure is not Fatal, it is the Courage to Continue that Counts" Sir Winston Churchill "To him the People of the World Largely owe the Freedom and Liberties they Enjoy Today" Enscription on Hugh Dowding's (AOC Fighter Command 1936-40) statue in London WW2 Talk: A WW2 Discussion Forum My Photo Collections on Flickr

09-15-2006, 01:41 PM	#8
the lancaster kicks ass Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 19,945	no way that's WWII, it's all far too convenient........ __________________ "Reminds me of the time I sank the Tirpitz" comments a Spitfire pilot, "One pass of course, old boy."

09-15-2006, 03:09 PM	#9
Matt308 aka Dickcheese Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Washington State Posts: 13,386	Sorry gents. You all have it wrong. While exceptionally cool, it is computer generated. Here is my arguments, some strong, some weak. 1) While very well done indeed, the first person perspective from the wingman is too staged. The tactics are piss poor by both sides. The 109s break late for a non-firing head on pass and the Spits attempt no counter-break maneuver. C'mon. And did the Brits like the US use two man formations in 1939? I didn't think they did. 2) 109 bursts of fire produce no hits on the surf during low altitude and diving profile. 3) The graphics are great, but just slightly amiss. Lots of detail, but still looking like polygon generation to me. 4) The sound is obviously fake. In addition to having a color camera mounted externally outside of the prop circle with no perceptible airframe/mount shake during high G/(firing?) maneuvers, the audio would have required synchronization and two channel area mic and taps from the audio control panel to capture air-to-air comm. 5) PTT initiation does not result in spikes of background noise. Cannon/MG noises are definitely fake and did not originate from "recording" aircraft. Even in a modern day transport aircraft, the cockpit noise levels are significant. In a 109, at WEP, at 300+ mph, even a cannon/MG burst recorded from behind and say 100+ft away would not come thru so clear. Those who have been to a range will know what I'm talking about. 6) Pilot banter is certainly calm for such an adrenaline rush. 7) While perhaps a nit, I have read more than one recollection of FOD damage caused by expended cannon and MG casing ejections while in mid-air. Some of these resulting in loss of the damaged aircraft. Note the Spit makes a "suprise?" jump with a long burst directly from above and then in front of the 109 wingman. Not any indication (pilot maneuver or otherwise) of a expended case hit. Oversight? Or perhaps just lucky. Not really conclusively supportive. You have to admit though that it is awfully staged looking when the wingman then ignores the second Spit which has broken yet again and follows his wingman like any good director would instruct his camera man. But it is really cool. __________________ "Some people spend an entire lifetime wondering if they made a difference in the world. But, the [U.S.] Marines don't have that problem." -- Ronald Reagan Master of Duplicate Posts

09-15-2006, 03:13 PM	#10
cheddar cheese Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: WSM, England Posts: 20,387	I agree, looks CGI to me too.

09-15-2006, 03:24 PM	#11
Hunter368 Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Winnipeg Posts: 2,240	Joe you should be able to answer this one better than most people here. Trailing plane is very close and right behind the first fighter. Right? What about prop wash on that trailing plane would that not have screwed up the back plane? He is flying soo close I would of thought the prop wash would of screwed him up bad. If it was actually real planes flying. What do you think Joe? Joe did you notice my new sig? I was thinking about your sig when I did it. I was trying to find a Sabre in crosshairs but I could not. lol __________________ "Ivan the Terrible or Russian Achilles" Ivan Kozhedub - Hero of the USSR (x3), Order of Lenin (x2), Order of Red Banner (x7), Order of Alexander Nevsky, Order of the Great Patriotic War (x2), Order of the Red Star (x2), 62 kills during 1943-1945 Last edited by Hunter368; 09-15-2006 at 03:27 PM.

09-15-2006, 03:41 PM	#12
Pisis Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Praga Mater Urbium Posts: 5,859	No way CGI... The question remains if is it WW2 or later. PS: Hunter, nice Mig, there. Can you pls send me the original picture? __________________ "He's a menace to himself and everything else in the air... yes, birds too." - Airplane! Memory of Nation Why Did Hitler Want Czechoslovakia WW2 Was A War That Had To Be Fought! What Really Happened in Israel? Children of Hamas

09-15-2006, 03:47 PM	#14
Hunter368 Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Winnipeg Posts: 2,240	I like your's also Pisis, for whatever reason I love the Mig-21 and older Migs. Here you go: Yahoo! Image Detail for www.fredsboringpictures.com/images/Chino%2005/images/1141968%20MiG-15.jpg __________________ "Ivan the Terrible or Russian Achilles" Ivan Kozhedub - Hero of the USSR (x3), Order of Lenin (x2), Order of Red Banner (x7), Order of Alexander Nevsky, Order of the Great Patriotic War (x2), Order of the Red Star (x2), 62 kills during 1943-1945

09-15-2006, 03:48 PM	#15
Hunter368 Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Winnipeg Posts: 2,240	Ok thanks Joe, I knew you would know. __________________ "Ivan the Terrible or Russian Achilles" Ivan Kozhedub - Hero of the USSR (x3), Order of Lenin (x2), Order of Red Banner (x7), Order of Alexander Nevsky, Order of the Great Patriotic War (x2), Order of the Red Star (x2), 62 kills during 1943-1945

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
UFOs : REAL or BS?	RonRyan85	OFF-Topic / Misc.	26	08-15-2006 04:22 PM
Veteran planes, replicas and CGI	Twitch	Stories	6	08-03-2006 03:33 PM
getting to know the real cute corporal...	cute corporal	OFF-Topic / Misc.	457	06-20-2005 04:40 PM

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode