Following Iraq's bioweapons trail

[Hunter368]

Chill down dude, I wasn't insulting your intelligence. I said I wouldn't recognize a WMD either! You need to be an expert to recognize it as a WMD, and you said you saw it yourself. You didn't mention any experts around you...


No ... but I do know what Atropine injectors are. If I really was insulting your intelligence, I would say you can't even say it right...

So Chris, what was found and where? Perhaps you'll find it mentioned in the Survey Report. Only 700 pages to browse through...
Iraq Survey Group Final Report

Except for two members, all I've heard from you guys is how the media tricks us and that the truth is hidden ... isn't that convenient? You can prove anything by that. And what about right-wing media then? How come they don't provide proof?
And note that I'm not using any media sources, I'm using official reports. Like I said before, the guys at the Pentagon and the CIA would sell their mothers to find WMDs in Iraq.

Kris

Careful kris,

You said to Chris "So now you're also a scientist and expert on WMDs?"

That is rude and insulting.

Then you are being a smartazz by making fun of him on a spelling error.



You have an agruement with WMD but don't lose it by turning this into an arguement with a Mod. Stay on course and be respectful.

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Chill down dude, I wasn't insulting your intelligence. I said I wouldn't recognize a WMD either! You need to be an expert to recognize it as a WMD, and you said you saw it yourself. You didn't mention any experts around you...

I said I saw the site myself and walked though the site...

Go back and read the post, if you dont understand what I am saying then please ask and I will tell you but dont tell me what I mean by my words.

2nd if something that I saw with my own 2 eyes was identified by Chem experts then yes I have seen it with my own 2 eyes. That is more than you have ever seen on the subject.

No ... but I do know what Atropine injectors are. If I really was insulting your intelligence, I would say you can't even say it right...

Simple typo, you make them too...

So Chris, what was found and where? Perhaps you'll find it mentioned in the Survey Report. Only 700 pages to browse through...
Iraq Survey Group Final Report

I dont give a damn what that report says. I know what has been seen and what was reported as found by our units. If it does not make into a report sounds to me like there is a cover up going on...

Sorry Civ but I was there, I know what I saw and what others have seen. I know that I am wrong though, because a citizen of Belgium knows more about what is going on a US (and her allies) military conflict than the people that were there.

Civettone if you read on a piece of paper that the color of the roof at 15 Street was Red and I went to 15 Street and saw the roof was Blue you would tell me that I am wrong. I was there I saw the roof, you have only read about it, but you are wrong.

Except for two members, all I've heard from you guys is how the media tricks us and that the truth is hidden ... isn't that convenient? You can prove anything by that. And what about right-wing media then? How come they don't provide proof?
And note that I'm not using any media sources, I'm using official reports. Like I said before, the guys at the Pentagon and the CIA would sell their mothers to find WMDs in Iraq.

Kris

Then you again are proving that you are not reading a single thing that I post or you have selective reading of my posts because I have given you many instances of what I have seen and what other things have been found. Our unit reported finds when we were there. If they do not make it into a report well then I dont know what to tell you, but questioning my honor and integrity like that sure is pretty piss poor in my opinion.

[Civettone]

I said I saw the site myself and walked though the site...
Go back and read the post, if you dont understand what I am saying then please ask and I will tell you but dont tell me what I mean by my words.

Don't pull that one on me again. You didn't say anything about experts. You need to be an expert to know what a WMD is. (Or why were those experts there.) So then I asked, are you an expert? No, you're not. I also said I wasn't an expert either, so I don't see what you could find insulting about that.

Simple typo, you make them too...

More than I'm aware of. If I wanted to ridicule you, I would have used that typo to my advantage, saying you don't even know how they are called, so how...

I dont give a damn what that report says. I know what has been seen and what was reported as found by our units. If it does not make into a report sounds to me like there is a cover up going on...

Well, if you want I can give you some other examples where the US Military claimed that WMDs were found, and that a team of specialists later found they weren't WMDs or no longer active.
So again, where was it and what was it?

Then you again are proving that you are not reading a single thing

I do read your post but you systematically say EVERYTHING is wrong except for what you've seen with your own eyes. I disagree with that. And I've already explained why I disagree with that. I've made analogies with WW2 eye witness accounts. "I've shot down a He 113 and I don't care if you tell me there never was one. Who was there? You or I??"

I do respect you Chris, more than you know, but I don't believe everything you say even though I believe you're being truthful about what you've seen.

Kris

[Matt308]

ZZzzzzzz.....

[Hunter368]

Kris you say you respect him but.....you post like you don't. Don't pay lip service to anyone here. You say one thing then you post sarcastic post the next second. You can disagree with the Mods here, god knows I have, but do it in a respectful way. You can just say " lets agree to disagree on this". Believe me I know the message you are trying to get across.....just do it without getting banned.

I will say again:

Careful kris,

You said to Chris "So now you're also a scientist and expert on WMDs?"

That is rude and insulting.

Then you are being a smartazz by making fun of him on a spelling error.

You have an agruement with WMD but don't lose it by turning this into an arguement with a Mod. Stay on course and be respectful.

Just drop the whole thing with Chris.

Stay on subject here.....you will not win any arguement with a Mod.

[Civettone]

I disagree. Hunter, you are not impartial either, are you?

One needs to be an expert to correctly identify WMDs. Chris is not. So I asked "Are you a scientist and expert on WMD?"

I did not want to insult Chris. If I gave that impression, I apologize.

But now I would like to continue the discussion. And I can also do without Matt's sarcastic comments and his habit of making claims without backing them up.

Kris

[Matt308]

If you don't like my sarcasm, you have come to the wrong place Civ. My sarcasm defines my 5000 posts. So get used to it.

[Hunter368]

If you don't like my sarcasm, you have come to the wrong place Civ. My sarcasm defines my 5000 posts. So get used to it.

LOL We love you (in purely manly sort of way, burp!) Matt even if some do not.

[Matt308]

Thanks, Hunter.

[Hunter368]

I disagree. Hunter, you are not impartial either, are you?

One needs to be an expert to correctly identify WMDs. Chris is not. So I asked "Are you a scientist and expert on WMD?"

I did not want to insult Chris. If I gave that impression, I apologize.

But now I would like to continue the discussion. And I can also do without Matt's sarcastic comments and his habit of making claims without backing them up.

Kris

You are back peddeling.....You said to Chris "So now you're also a scientist and expert on WMDs?"

That is sarcasim and rude, don't think your little changing of the words can get you out of it. Just say sorry without making excuses or changing what you said. Then get back on the subject.

Please explain how I am not impartial on this subject. I am trying to help before you go to far and start a huge war with Chris (which you would not win).

[Civettone]

You are back peddeling.....You said to Chris "So now you're also a scientist and expert on WMDs?"

That is sarcasim and rude, don't think your little changing of the words can get you out of it. Just say sorry without making excuses or changing what you said. Then get back on the subject.

What? So the word 'also' is what makes it an insult?

Please explain how I am not impartial on this subject.

You agree with Chris on the war in Iraq and WMDs. As such you'll be more perceptive to criticism on him than you would be on me, as you clearly didn't notice some of the accusation I've had to take this last days.
Now I'm ok with all of that, and no one is unbiased, just pointing out that I don't see it the way you do.

I am trying to help before you go to far and start a huge war with Chris (which you would not win).

You were the one who started talking about a war between Chris and I. I was shocked when I read it.
Adler and I have had several heated discussions before, so I fail to see what is so different about this one. And if Chris has a problem with my post, he should say so in his role as moderator. Or another moderator should step in. Hunter, I like you but you're not a mod.

And now I would like to go on with the discussion.
Kris

[Njaco]

Can someone please enlighten me and tell me how many years of schooling, college, tech school and such that I would need to recognize a bomb?

[Matt308]

28 years

[Civettone]

They call in experts to identify WMDs. That makes me conclude that you need to be an expert to identify WMDs.
Njaco, you may very well be an expert. I don't know as I don't know a single thing about you. I know Chris is a military helicopter pilot, and I bet a damn good one too.

And again, he didn't mention he flew in experts. Had I had known this, I wouldn't have made the comment. He said he saw it with his own eyes.
Kris

[mkloby]

Matt's sarcasm brings mad flava(I sincerely apologize for that) to the forum. I misunderstood him at first too.

no one is unbiased

Now that's the kind of stuff I like to hear!

Civettone brings up a good question - if NBCs were found in Iraq, then why is are official gov't reports stating the opposite. I honestly have legitimate answer to this. However, "facts" released to the public are different from what is not released...

Adler's experience is not isolated, nor is he incorrect in what he saw. Obviously I was not there, but his story is not uncommon. The Army has NBC guys attached to every unit that deal with these threats. Now, it goes without saying that NBCs found in Iraq were substantially less than the US gov't expected to find. However, that is not the same as meaning that they did not exist. With scatterings as such found, it seems intuitive to believe that there are MANY that have not been found. You would not develop a sparse sprinkling of token NBCs, that just does not make sense in reality... at least not to me. I'd be like the USMC procuring 1 and a half Ospreys...

Chris was a Crew Chief - don't insult him by calling him a nasty pilot.