The P-108/B-17/Lancaster Thread

[the lancaster kicks ass]

ok then we're sorry for saying you didn't know about our influence, but i'm glad you've admitted that most americans have no idea of our input..........

[cheddar cheese]

i reckon the british and the americans are a good team, the americans power and the british brains make for a superb fighting force, if we fought independently in wars, we wouldnt be as effective

[GermansRGeniuses]

America:A bit of quality and much quantity; respect for the manpower side
Britain:Lots more quality, not nearly as much quantity due to the economy; much respect for manpower side of the conflict
Russia:VERY RARE quality, nigh-unlimited quantity; NO RESPECT for the manpower
Germany:Quality is apparent in ALMOST everything, but the persistent spirit is sometimes a problem as in keeping things in use for too long, like the Stuka. Quantity is fairly ok, except for gas basically; respect for manpower, except at the end (Volkssturm:ALL men 16-60 REQUIRED to enlist, many WWI veterans)

This is my inference of WWII and the main powers. Please discuss.

[Lightning Guy]

Russia had no respect for manpower at all (including their own). I really think they should have been brought up on war crimes charges. I have heard that they marched condemned men across mine fields in order to clear them.

I think a word should also be said about Japan. They had reasonable quality at the early part of the war. Their quality control dropped off dramatically towards the end of the war causing good designs to be less than effective. It would seem obvious to state that they had little respect for people but I don't think that was so much the case as it was an eagerness to die. A fine point perhaps but one that exists nonetheless.

[plan_D]

America has contributed a lot to modern Britain, still, I do not believe the American people (90% of, that's not you) know of, or are grateful (that's the same for the American government) of the British contribution.
Thank you for realising this though.

Now; America was all for economy, their strength came from their economy. Large production was their winning factor, the majority of their planes were average but the few winning designs (B-24, P-38, B-29) all proved to be excellent and some of the best in the war, without British intervention. Late war, they were starting to get the idea in technology, even on the ground.
They were respectful of the lives of their troops, as much as you could be in war. Always willing to try new ideas, which is a brilliant stratergy (maybe Britain should take up that way of thinking)

Britain was always for technology, competing with Germany for years. Their economy was small in comparison to America, and made even smaller in the BoB. Their aircraft, and tanks (although few in number) were of mostly brilliant design. Some would argue they didn't care about their people (you should see, and read some of the missions people were sent on) but that attitude is still taken today, it is confidence in its own troops which makes them one of the best, if not the best force in the world. (No offence intended to the Americans but they always top the NATO ground force exercises)
Always trying to cut costs, during war and peace. Which results in keeping many designs for decades.

Russia; Russias doctrine was simplicity and numbers, which showed in their mass production runs and simple designs. It proved effective and with great loss of civil and military life by both them and their enemy. 16 hour working days for the factory workers, and suicidal missions for the army.
Shot by their own people as well. They didn't care for their people. Throwing out designs left, right and center but always needed Stalins approval. Helped greatly by the Christies suspension system (New Jersey, well done America)

Germany; Germany believed in greatness and supremecy, and they showed it. Technology was top notch, and many of the worlds modern technologies came from Nazi Germany, or from the Germans themselves working after the war. Even down to the finest touch they were about precision, and technological brilliance.
They cared about their people to an extent, and treat them well. A lot of internal rivarly prevented the German forces reaching their full pontential. Stopping projects that were quite clearly needed.

Japan; Good technology at the beginning of the war, but they were fighting a loss. Probably soon realised this after Midway. Their brainwashed people were willing to die for the cause, and the Emperor was willing to let this happen.
Out of the Jungle these the Japanese did not know how to fight, but served well in the seas, and air.

[cheddar cheese]

an epic post and highly accrurate, well done

[Lightning Guy]

The bit on the Germans might need to be qualified. The Germans had respect for the lives of the people who agreed with Hitler. Even success in war (Rommel and possibly Molders as examples) could not save you if you crossed him.

About the British, Plan_D, I assume you are referring to some of the commando raids? I have read about a few of those and, if there ever were suicide missions, those were them.

[cheddar cheese]

yup, theres a series on channel 5 been on recently about daring raids of WW2, some most certainly daring raids on it....

[GermansRGeniuses]

Here's my input: I prefer WWII America to now-a-days America and believe Britain or almost anywhere else in Europe would be the place for me.

[plan_D]

That's why I said to an extent Lightning Guy. You're very right though.

I've been recorded a lot of those 'Daring Raids of World War 2' shows. The St.Nazaire raid was on there last week, I've taped that one. I was mostly thinking of the Commando raids, yes, but also the SAS and LRDG missions.

[the lancaster kicks ass]

and the aimens (not sure if that's the right one) raid by the mossies, that was one hell of a feat to pull off................

[plan_D]

The Amiens Prison Raid (Operation Jericho) was a daring raid, and was featured in one of the shows. I also taped that one. It was a great feat, and achieved its main objective which was to allow enough partisans to escape to let the communication and spy network of the French Resistance be reestablished.

[the lancaster kicks ass]

i doubt any other plane could have done it.......................

[Lightning Guy]

Didn't that raid end up killing several of the prisoners though?

I think that the Mosquito raid on the Gestapo headquarters in Holland was equally impressive.

And I think other planes could have pulled it off, the A-26 for example.

[the lancaster kicks ass]

Didn't that raid end up killing several of the prisoners though?

i wouldn't have thought it'd kill that many

and i personally don't think a A-26 could have done it.................