CNN Brings Comfort and Aid to the Enemy

plan_D · 10-30-2006, 06:34 PM

Look at what the British paras did in Sierra Leone and all those other little weasel African countries, you aren't going to get better than that. The U.S is all about the budget and size due to that fact, the U.S infantry doesn't need to be as well trained as smaller forces like Britain, Denmark and Norway.

Fact of the matter remains, Britain and America are too different fighting styles which makes brilliant Allies. America will whoop your ***, and Britain will just sneak in a slit your throat.

No better couter-insurgency than Great Britain, we've got the experience. IRA are the best thought out and trained insurgency ever, if the Arab insurgents were as smart as the IRA we'd be havin' alot more trouble in Iraq. But Britain still put 'em down.

Man for man, the Royal Marines are better than the USMC. The U.S SEALs work with the Royal Marines (did so in Iraq), you'd never see the SAS workin' with the USMC.

mkloby · 10-30-2006, 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by plan_D

Look at what the British paras did in Sierra Leone and all those other little weasel African countries, you aren't going to get better than that. The U.S is all about the budget and size due to that fact, the U.S infantry doesn't need to be as well trained as smaller forces like Britain, Denmark and Norway.

Fact of the matter remains, Britain and America are too different fighting styles which makes brilliant Allies. America will whoop your ***, and Britain will just sneak in a slit your throat.

No better couter-insurgency than Great Britain, we've got the experience. IRA are the best thought out and trained insurgency ever, if the Arab insurgents were as smart as the IRA we'd be havin' alot more trouble in Iraq. But Britain still put 'em down.

Man for man, the Royal Marines are better than the USMC. The U.S SEALs work with the Royal Marines (did so in Iraq), you'd never see the SAS workin' with the USMC.

Don't talk about the US Mil if you don't know what you're saying there buddy. You're right US forces are all about bulk and no training.

It must be true, since brits can't compete w/ american manpower or equipment, so they must be much much better trained. The Marines have their own spec ops, which finally came online late 2005. You wouldn't know a force recon marine from a spec ops marine, from another marine. Where do these guys come up with this BS like "man for man RM are better than USMC." Lord have mercy plan d.

plan_D · 10-30-2006, 08:08 PM

Where did I say the U.S forces have no training? Man, someone's got a short fuse. Have I insulted your country and military? Awww.

I have met many American militarymen, I have met Adler in person, been on his base and have encountered the great men in the U.S Army. I have known Dan for quite some time through here and I, not for one second, will imply he's ill-trained as he has proven time and time again that his ability in combat is worth it's weight in gold. And he doesn't even need to SHOW me anything.

Fact of the matter remains, the British NEEDs to train it's troops harder because it's troops haven't got the obvious and blatant advantage of heavy support in all areas. Britain INVENTED special operations, we are the World Leaders in counter-insurgency while America has done a hell of a lot for the cause in general Britain has been fighting terrorism on a larger scale for longer - the IRA is the greatest example.

The British can't compete with American equipment and manpower, the U.S has 300,000,000 ...we have 60,000,000! America pays more to it's military than the next 20 nations combined.

You can't jump up and say "The USMC is the best" and refer collectively to it's ability to fight with machines, money and bulk. The RAF pilots used to run rings around USAF pilots (Where there's a US pilot flying low, there's a RAF one below him).

I notice how you didn't mention anything about Sierra Leone, look it up, buddy...learn something about the British military.

mkloby · 10-30-2006, 09:17 PM

I am referring to your ridiculous comment of "Man for man, the Royal Marines are better than the USMC. The U.S SEALs work with the Royal Marines (did so in Iraq), you'd never see the SAS workin' with the USMC." You have no basis for such a comment that british training is superior and their troops are superior. NONE - END OF STORY. Notice I made no comment on british training. I didn't go through it - We've had RM on our base, and I've commented that they are balls to the wall. So i'm not going to open my mouth for my foot by commenting on it on brit training - certainly not amking a foolish remark saying US training is superior.

My comments on the USMC were about it's ability to deploy an expeditionary unit anywhere - unmatched by anyone else in the world. I stand by that comment. I did not make a stupid remark such as USMC is the best.

I made no specifics of any particular op or engagement - so why would I bring up sierra leone? I think it's odd that you would think i would bring that up.

This is the 2nd post from a brit dismissing US training as inferior - and quite frankly - it pissed me off, hence the short fuse.

plan_D · 10-30-2006, 09:32 PM

Really should keep up with what you're saying, bud

You : [i]"USMC = finest looking force; finest fighting force"[i]

Why would the USMC standard Marine be trained to the standard of a Royal Marine ... ? The Royal Marine is a Commando unit, they will perform special operations. They are an élite force - the USMC ain't.

Fact of the matter remains when you stating the USMC can deploy an Exp force anyway which is unmatched is STUPID. Because the British military uses the arms for their own intention - the RAF does the air force, the Army does the ground work and the navy does the sea work.

If the Army wants deploy anywhere, there'll be the Royal Navy and the RAF attached to the operation in question. It's no different than the USMC deploying everything it's got. Why have so many different armies in one army? Pointless.

mkloby · 10-30-2006, 11:06 PM

Just as the Navy has SEALS, US Army has SF and delta, the Marines also have Spec ops capability. We also are capable of those types of ops. Seriously - before you start saying what my Corps is and is not - research or ask a Marine. You are just making facts up as you go along plan d. My point is that you're not in a place to comment on the training of regular marines, spec ops marines, etc, just as in I'm in no place to proclaim higher training over say RM commandos.

I know I said that we're the finest looking, finest fighting force.

As far as being an exp force - it's most definitely not stupid. It's mind numbing that you would say that. Being able to deploy in such force anywhere within days is a huge advatage - which apparently you disagree with. USMC can get there faster with more stuff than any other force. It's one of the greatest advantages that any fighting force can bring to the table. It's a fundamental tenant of armed conflict. The US army as a whole requires more time for deployment - but they can bring a lot more manpower to the table than we can (although they have their own units capable of more quick deployments).

I understand the argument of us being "Pointless." It comes up even in American political circles. however, our expeditionary capabilities cannot be replicated with such speed and power by any fighting force I know of - which is why I said finest fighting force.

ndicki · 10-31-2006, 04:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt308

Very good ndicki. You've easily extended this thread for days from your post alone.

Thank you.

And if you Yanks did admit the reality - I as you'd imagine agree with Plan D totally - you wouldn't be worth having around.

The only army I know where the Officers and SNCOs actually admit openly to people from outside, that all is not well are... French! And no, I don't want them alongside. As I said, if I can't have other Brits or cousins - Aussies, Kiwis or Canadians - alongside, I'd be glad to have the USMC. But there we are.

I'd love to see the Yanks up to their necks in sh*t on somewhere nice and welcoming like the Falklands! Or the places which made the Falklands possible, such as the Brecons or Dartmoor, in the middle of Winter! On foot.

And the USMC are not the finest looking fighting force - I expect the Queen's Colour Squadron, RAF Regiment are. They usually even beat the Guards at foot drill.

And if the Paras did so well in places like Sierra Leone, it's because the way they train now has a lot in common with the way I trained 20 years ago - you can always dumb it down and jump into the vehicles, but the acquistion of a high degree of fieldcraft and battlecraft skills cannot be done overnight.

mkloby · 10-31-2006, 07:40 AM

I guess this is just tail chasing like the one on support and leg grunts! But ndicki please understand - marine infantry do the vast majority of training on foot! Not dumbing it down on vehicles as you say. When it comes down to it, I don't expect you brits to admit anyone's superiority, you guys have pride and probably the richest military tradition, but please guys please try to understand us mil training and components instead of calling us sailors wearing green convincingly, or that the USMC's inferiority due to lack of spec ops capability, which is also false. As I said before - can't really comment on aspects of brit mil training and quality, just as the inaccuracies in capabilities and training you stated about my service's training revealed you guys shouldn't be commenting either.

lesofprimus · 10-31-2006, 07:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ndicki
Navy SEALS come second to SBS, easily.

Thats a typical British answer.... I worked with SBS guys in the past, as well as Royal Marines, and there is no way that the SBS guys were better than us, in training or Operational tempo.... They were constantly learning from us and even had a few of them on cross-training missions...

The Israeli Special Forces are regarded as the best of the best...

DerAdlerIstGelandet · 10-31-2006, 09:48 AM

mkloby I hear you. Anyone who think that the US Military is only a second rate trained military obviously does not a thing about the modern military.

The US military recieves training equal to the best that any country has to offer. I repeat an country has to offer including the British! In addition that...

The US military is the best equipped force.
The US military is the most capable force in all aspects because the support that it recieves from all the other services in the US Military.

And ndicki the US military is not just mobile forces. The US Army and the USMC have whole Divisions of Light Infantry that Hoof it around as you say. If you do not realize that you dont know a thing about the US Military and you are only making assumptions that carry no weight of there own!

DerAdlerIstGelandet · 10-31-2006, 09:50 AM

Also I think it is funny and I am not trying to insult anyone here because I have nothing against the British. I have had many friends who are British and happen to count pD as one of them and hope that we can visit again sometime especially at Rock Im Park next year again but I really have noticed something over the years and that is this:

The British think the US is very arrogant and full of themselves but you have to admit one thing and the British have there nose stuck up in the air even more than the US.

Sorry England but your **** stinks too...