The Fall of the United States

Erich · 01-12-2006, 02:25 PM

evolve into what though ? no one knows for sure...... it is not surprising what happens when some goof gets into power. look at the mideast right now

cls12vg30 · 01-12-2006, 02:43 PM

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Originally Posted by marconi

It is obvious that nothing can last forever but why do you think that the USA can only disappear because of some revolution, crisis or any other bad scenario? Maybe humanity will create some global government and there wont be any need in separate countries.

I don't see this as feasible, at least not in this century. People and cultures are just too different in different parts of the world for one government to govern them all, unless it is with an iron fist. If there ever is a global government, I think it's likely it will be a global tyranny, but unless every human being on the planet were disarmed and their will to resist broken, such a government could not last long even if it did manage to gain power in the first place.

Of course, I'm pretty much a Libertarian less-government-is-better-government type, so the very thought of a huge global government makes me want to start burying rifles and ammo in my backyard and bulldoze the UN building into Turtle Bay.

Delusional · 01-12-2006, 06:20 PM

Mr. Clinton isn't nearly as bad as his Mrs. I pray that she will not be elected, but I'm also quite confident that she won't. I'm also confident that Condoleeza Rice will not be elected President, and she will not get the Republican nomination either. The United States is not ready for a woman of any race to rule.

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Like all things, including nations, the U.S. as we know it will eventually end, either suddenly or gradually. Barring a sudden catastrophe, then assaults on our freedom, whether they come from the Right or the Left, will likely eventually take their toll on productivity, innovation, and the economy at large.

Who's to say that the "assaults on our freedom" will continue? It's only been quite recently that I've heard this much on this particular subject. Perhaps our government will retrace its steps, and we will regain some of former liberties. Besides, is it really that bad as it is?

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The end result of our current path is the eventual loss of personal freedom, and likely massive poverty after that.

What exactly is "our current path" that is leading to an end result of the fall of the U.S. and massive poverty?

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But I think it likely that before all that came to pass, there would be another revolution, either peaceful or violent, possibly involving secession of one or more states.

What? Why on earth would any of the states secede? What would this revolution be about?

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But why would they leave ? That's an other question.

Yes, and a good question too, because I do not think that they would ever want to leave. Why separate yourself from the most powerful nation in the world? Besides, as you admitted, you seem to know little about which states are rich and which are not. The fact of that matter is that many of the states in the U.S. are quite wealthy, and they are not all concentrated in any particular area, meaning that they have relatively few similar interests, again leading to my opinion that a separation of the states, at least in this sense, would never happen.
Also, the U.S. may not be the most patriotic country in all of the world or anything, but Americans do have some pride, and I do not see a majority of the people in any state agreeing to leave the Union.

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What is happening is the world is integrating into hemispherical trading blocks. The US empire will evolve into a pan North American trading and political block.

As though the United States could survive without Europe? The U.S. will never be this isolated, because we do not have the industrial and economic means to do so (or rather, the North American continent does not have these means). More integration is possible, yes, but complete integration, in my opinion, will never be seen.

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I don't see this as feasible, at least not in this century. People and cultures are just too different in different parts of the world for one government to govern them all, unless it is with an iron fist. If there ever is a global government, I think it's likely it will be a global tyranny, but unless every human being on the planet were disarmed and their will to resist broken, such a government could not last long even if it did manage to gain power in the first place.

I agree completely.

Erich · 01-12-2006, 06:29 PM

funny did you know that northern California and southern Oregon where I reside have tried to form it's own state for the past 25 years ? the glorious state of Jefferson. in fact some of the prominent locals have actually referred literally and seriously that that is where they live.........

there is an interesting and quite impressive bronzed ribbed cow that presides on the northern side of Interstate 5 just south of Yreka, easily viewed from motor transportation inviting everyone to the state of Jefferson. that thing in all it's naked glory suspended with Christmas decorations during December must have cost the owner quite a bundle to make his personal thoughts known to the world. Crazy .......yes, autonomous ......... A most definate and resounding YES

Delusional · 01-12-2006, 06:41 PM

Tried being the key word. And for twenty-five years at that. That says nothing. Considering I didn't know (meaning relatively few people outside of your area know, or at the very least, relatively few people in my area know), that says to me that these attempts have been nowhere near successful. Not even worth mentioning on the news. Who cares about your little area in the grander scheme of things? And who cares about the person who lit up that cow? When I see it happen, then I'll care. And what do you mean by try? A nut lighting up cows is trying? Unless he's a member of your state government or the federal government...well, who gives a flying squirrel?

Erich · 01-12-2006, 07:03 PM

edited

CharlesBronson · 01-12-2006, 07:26 PM

Honestly, if there is a "Downfall" in the U.S that will be caused more for his excesive multiculturalism that crippled the sence of a nationalist feelings.

The Armed Forces seems to be the only solution to integrate the people that come as far as India , Guatemala, etc.

Erich · 01-12-2006, 07:36 PM

CB if you are talking about Bush then blame the liberal deceiving media. the downfall will not happen during his course as presidante' I don;t give a care what anyone thinks if two women are able enough to have reprentaive positions in our US govt. then they sure can run against each other representing their own political parties. Frankly I will not be here to vote for either one of them .......

CharlesBronson · 01-12-2006, 07:54 PM

I was talking in general not about the Bush administration in particular.

And the women for president...well it seems very fashionable around the world, even right here the firts lady want to run for president in 2007.

I have nothing against women But I think that there have inferiors minds and inteligence, cannot compite with the men not even in your dreams.....no, no....just kidding

Delusional · 01-12-2006, 08:01 PM

Well, I'd hope I didn't have anything against women, considering I am one, but I still do not think that either will win the Presidential election in 2008. And I will be here to vote for one of them, if it comes to that. Actually, I don't think I'd vote at all if it came to that...
Erich, although I didn't mean to offend you earlier, again, you caring (or your whole area caring, really, which I'm sure isn't the case) means nothing.

Erich · 01-12-2006, 08:10 PM

Del or whomever you are, yes it means quite a bit. mis-representation of southern Oregon/Northern California ever since I have been to high school, Nam and returned working for the big guy. that is one way how things get started not on the right footnote. I have seen a lot of BS over the world especially the mid-east, one reason I did not further whom I am to you or anyone on this forum. A couple of the vets here have just an inkling of what I have done and possibly what I am still doing.

anything is possible and anarchy can happen at any time. for my small area of the world we have a huge survivalist group that has actually retreated into the dense pine woods, a scary brutal group in reality. It would not surprise me at all that our county/city seat could be taken over and even though we are a "no-nothing who cares about you" berg, if and when this ever happens you can easily imagine what may be tried at a higher level.

with that I leave this thread becaue it is a huge what-if

evangilder · 01-12-2006, 10:42 PM

But you raised a good point, E. There was a contingent of Islamic militants trying to build a training camp not far from where Erich lives. Not alot of people have heard about it, but you sure as hell better be concerned about it.

102first_hussars · 01-13-2006, 02:06 AM

As arrogant as this may sound I think the U.S. will fall when it tries to invade Canada, mostly because I can imagine alot of European countries coming to our aid.

Maestro · 01-13-2006, 02:10 AM

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Originally Posted by 102first_hussars

As arrogant as this may sound I think the U.S. will fall when it tries to invade Canada, mostly because I can imagine alot of European countries coming to our aid.

You're right... That's arrogant.

Nonskimmer · 01-13-2006, 04:29 AM

Name one.