Jingoistic America

[comiso90]

I need some opinions. Why are so many Americans nationalistic to the point they disparage any other country?

Options:
Many nations claim supremacy. Japan is famously ethnocentristic. The translation for China is "Chung Quo".. the middle kingdom... all others orbit. Perhaps Americans are just held to a higher standard of scrutiny.

America is the "Big kid on the block and therefore a target".

Americans blossomed at the right time ... 15 minutes of fame

Geographic isolation breeds an air of superiority

Americans are good at entertainment and we believe our own entertainment.

My mother was 19 at the start of WW2 and to this day, she thinks WW2 was "Americas' War". The Eastern front was a minor side show. This makes me sick.

Did propaganda build the beast?

[evangilder]

I think that depends on what part of the country you are in.It also depends on if the folks that you come in contact with have ever spent any time overseas. There is nothing wrong with a little nationalism, one should take pride in where they are from.

[Soundbreaker Welch?]

I think having America being the most powerful nation on the continent gives me a sense of security and sense of Freedom to be "Great." I do feel bad sometimes how the world resents our superiority, and maybe we use our power in harmful ways at times. I think that we do have things to be proud of in our history, such as our helping out the other "good guys" in WWII.

I really don't know why your mother thinks WWII wasn't a big fault of Hitler? Was it the harsh terms we gave after WWI?

Japan was a bit mad at us because we opposed them before Pearl Harbor when they attacked China and after that didn't give them lots of American products. But we didn't provoke them by an act of violence, unless it was because the Flying Tigers were shooting down Japanese planes and that was an act of war between the USA and Japan.

Hitler and Stalin's Huge War really had nothing to do with us, and was not our fault, I agree with you there.

[mkloby]

I think eric is right - it totally depends upon your life experiences. WWII to America will conjure up images of Pearl Harbor, D-Day, Iwo, and other high profile events. Just the same, in Russia it will evoke images relating to their experience - maybe winter '41, Stalingrad, Leningrad, Berlin etc. and I'm just guessing because I'm not a Russian.

Nations as a whole, just like individuals, see things from unique perspectives based on national experiences. Do you think the Iwo flag raising is a marked event to Russians? To Italians?

I think you're generalizing, and I would believe that even though most Americans may not be familiar w/ intimate detail regarding the Eastern front in Europe - they do know it was a vast killing field, with much higher casualties than we experienced.

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

I dont think it is as bad as you say.

All nations have nationalism. You think Americans are bad at this, you should go to France or England. Is it a bad thing. No, pride in your nation is a good thing.

I wish other nations had more pride in there country. Germans have allways been afraid to show too much nationalism since WW2. I was so happy and proud for the Germans during the World Cup last year to see there nationalism come out. They flew there nations flag finally again and it was an amazing moment.

As for the US's views to WW2, there are many Americans who think that the US won the war all on there own. You see it quite a bit on this site sometimes. I just see it as they need to be educated in what really happened in WW2. I dont fault them, let them learn by the people here.

[Udet]

Recently I heard of some polls made by some kind of international agency regarding national pride.

They reported that the 2 nations with the lower sense of national pride were -to my amazement- the Germans and the Japanese.

Does anyone know of that poll?

[mkloby]

Originally Posted by DerAdlerIstGelandet

I dont think it is as bad as you say.

All nations have nationalism. You think Americans are bad at this, you should go to France or England. Is it a bad thing. No, pride in your nation is a good thing.

I wish other nations had more pride in there country. Germans have allways been afraid to show too much nationalism since WW2. I was so happy and proud for the Germans during the World Cup last year to see there nationalism come out. They flew there nations flag finally again and it was an amazing moment.

As for the US's views to WW2, there are many Americans who think that the US won the war all on there own. You see it quite a bit on this site sometimes. I just see it as they need to be educated in what really happened in WW2. I dont fault them, let them learn by the people here.

That fear of nationalism in Germany has supposedly had quite an effect on German politics, from the reading that I have done.

I don't think it's so much thinking the US won the war on their own; I have said the Sherman helped US win the war, and also I say hurricane helped Britain win the war, etc... neither is incorrect depending on the condition used. Of course, too, the allies prevailed if you're looking at the total picture.

[comiso90]

I lived in Europe for 2 years. I was on the island of Malta during the World Cup in the early '90s when Italy and England were in the finals... THAT was an exercise in Nationalism BUT....

It seems to me that vast majority of Americans believe that the USA is the best at everything (even beer, bread and coffee!- which is just wrong).

Few Americans are interested in watching "Cross of Iron" or "Stalingrad"; they want to watch "Sands of Iwo" 50 times. Where are the American movies about Dunkirk, Dieppe, Kursk, Battle of Berlin? I want to see Tom Hanks in a T-34 and Matt Damon in a flaming Stuka. They are great stories that most Americans aren't interested in hearing.

I was in Montréal for New Years last year and I heard two groups of Yank teens were chanting "F**K" Canada". (I was really ashamed but I used it as an ice breaker to pick up chicks later in the night).

I was in an Italian restaurant in Solerno when an American customer berated the waiter because the portions are too small (The ignorant bastard didn't realize that pasta is a side dish in Italy)

And then there were the American Backpackers in Scotland incessantly complaining at high volume about the accommodations in the Edinburgh Youth Hostel...(it was $2 a night!)

I can go on and on.....

Certainly Americans don't have a monopoly on rudeness or ignorance but where do confidence and patriotism stop and mindless arrogance start?

I'm sure that fewer than 10% of Americans can name the President of Mexico or the Prime Minister of Canada. Most Americans just don't care about the rest of the world.

There is a difference between patriotism and self-righteous myopic jingoism.

I guess that is testimony to our perceived security.

For those of you outside the US, please tell me that you have found most Americans to be polite and respectful!

[mkloby]

comiso - your posts are extreme generalizations, and I find your attitude regarding "american self righteous myopic jingoism" itself to be rather obnoxious. There's no NATIONAL CONNECTION of Americans to stalingrad, hence there would be a weaker market for such a product when compared to D-Day or Iwo. It's that simple. Hollywood can make the crappiest movie of all time about something sentimental to American culture and heritage, and it would stand a fair chance at doing decently.

Here you are yourself putting down America as a whole on this forum. I find that to be mindless ignorance, but that's just me. Sure, some Americans are rude. Some people from EVERYWHERE are rude.

If Americans can't name the pres of Mexico and other worldly leaders, maybe it's not due to this self-righteousness. Maybe it's due to the fact that they wake up, go to work and earn a living, come home care for their family, and repeat the process. Maybe they do not have massive amounts of time for reading papers because on weekends they spend time at their son's baseball games?

Your comment about coffee, beer, and bread is ridiculous. What someone thinks is "best" is just a personal preference, there's no right and wrong.

Please hop off the high-horse and bashing Americans based on your perceptions.

[comiso90]

My observations are not generalizations... I have seen this attitude many times. I am trying to figure it out. I've traveled extensively in both the US and Europe. It has been my experience that visitors to our Country are more polite. The worst I've seen is Japanese tourists that refuse to wait in line. Obviously, if we had to spend time in the Tokyo subway we wouldn't want to wait in line either.

I did nothing more than relate experiences that I observed first hand. I find it humorous that you take it personally. I'm not bashing anyone. I want other opinions. I guess it's better to ignore facts then to look for answers?


Who cares if there is a national connection to a story as important Kursk? Are you going to tell me that Canadians aren’t interested in watching “Midway”?

Were you that American Backpacker cussing at the clerk in the Scottish Hostel or perhaps part of the mob shouting F**K Canada?

LOL

[mkloby]

Originally Posted by comiso90

My observations are not generalizations... I have seen this attitude many times. I am trying to figure it out. I've traveled extensively in both the US and Europe. It has been my experience that visitors to our Country are more polite. The worst I've seen is Japanese tourists that refuse to wait in line. Obviously, if we had to spend time in the Tokyo subway we wouldn't want to wait in line either.

I did nothing more than relate experiences that I observed first hand. I find it humorous that you take it personally. I'm not bashing anyone. I want other opinions. I guess it's better to ignore facts then to look for answers?


Who cares if there is a national connection to a story as important Kursk? Are you going to tell me that Canadians aren’t interested in watching “Midway”?

Were you that American Backpacker cussing at the clerk in the Scottish Hostel or perhaps part of the mob shouting F**K Canada?

LOL

Cosimo, may I ask how old you are? You're posts are exceedingly juvenile. You completely missed my point. I have witnessed rude Germans in the US, and rude Americans in Germany. Rude Mexicans in the US, and... you get the point. You experience is your experience, and that is fine. Do my experiences mean that an opinion I've formed of Germans, Mexicans, Austrians, etc from my travels are Gospel? No - it's merely my impressions from my experiences - not fact. But just as you are generalizing Americans into this bunch of myopic jingoistic zealots, people may take offense to your generalizations. It has nothing to do w/ ignoring facts and burying your head in the sand.

Think business and marketing for a second. If there is a strong national connection to something, say 6 Jun 1944, then a movie about it has an incredible marketing appeal that a movie about Kursk, Leningrad, or Stalingrad could never have, and will likely do better than an epic about such a battle. I never said our brothers to the north aren't interested in Midway.

It seems this site is attracting more and more members that join up proceed to bash Americans.

[comiso90]

Blah, Blah!

Next?

[Medvedya]

I think what people forget in other countries is that the States is so huge and that individual states are like little countries in many ways.

In Britain for example, you only have to cross 20 miles of water to find yourself in a totally different culture with a totally different language ect ect.

This isn't the case if you live somewhere like in the mid west of the States - the nearest non-English speaking country is nearly a thousand miles to the south!

So in European terms, that's comparable to the same distance from Northern England to the south of Italy. That being so, I don't see it as unreasonable to cut Americans a little slack on the fact that many people there (and in no way all) don't know much about other countries - whereas it's dead easy and cheap for Europeans to travel abroad, it's very difficult and expensive for most Americans.

[Emac44]

Gentlemen you get rude people every where no matter the nationality. even i am rude when i am pissed of or some one has annoyed me enough. what do i think persoanlly of Americans. I like them. course you get the occasional wombat like any where when a good wallop to the back of the head would bring them into line but you get rude Aussies to that need the same treatment. but thankfuly the Americans i have met personally are very polite and want to learn as much as they can about others and other countries, which i find very refreshing. i think though and this is my opinion only some are just niave about what occurs outside the US and being niave brings about a belief in ones superiority. you hear it in terms like if it wasn't for America England or Australia would be speaking German or Japanese respectfuly. I would say that comes from lack of knowledge of 1 history and 2 education with a little of ignorance and arrogance sprinkled in there some where. but get passed that and most Americans i have found are geniune people like any where else in the world that i have been fortunate to visit. what i am trying to say. i am glad you are our allies not our enemy and as such our friends across the pacific who we can rely on us our friends. not just in war but in peace time. i remember aussie fire fighters going to montana to help put out forest fires in one particular incident. you made a call we responded to help and that is what good friends and neighbours do. we help each other in good times and in bad times. i must admit i do get tired of the US best place in world bit nothing is better than the US etc. but i can forgive that because some boof heads speak through their collective arses. i look for the good in people and i see lots of good in most Americans.

[Emac44]

Originally Posted by Medvedya

I think what people forget in other countries is that the States is so huge and that individual states are like little countries in many ways.

In Britain for example, you only have to cross 20 miles of water to find yourself in a totally different culture with a totally different language ect ect.

This isn't the case if you live somewhere like in the mid west of the States - the nearest non-English speaking country is nearly a thousand miles to the south!

So in European terms, that's comparable to the same distance from Northern England to the south of Italy. That being so, I don't see it as unreasonable to cut Americans a little slack on the fact that many people there (and in no way all) don't know much about other countries - whereas it's dead easy and cheap for Europeans to travel abroad, it's very difficult and expensive for most Americans.

i agree with most of what you said, but Aussie is a huge place to. know plenty of wombats who have never stepped outside their own state let alone overseas. so can not score the Americans too badly. as i said the Americans i have met i have liked them. people are people no matter the nationality. in other words why judge the lot on a few nit wits who waste time and effort on breathing let alone commenting on other places. i have american friends and they are my friends and i treasure them as my friends. and as such i leave it at that