Kosovo Independence-- Good thing or a bad thing?

[Matt308]

I don't know Adler. It was a joke, but it is steeped in truth. Should we support the balkinization of any country? That is why I too was a little disappointed with our State Dept position being issued so quickly. It tends to make things quickly polarized.

I'm deeply conflicted with this action. And not smart enough to understand nor predict the repercussions.

But don't eff with the US embassy. That should be met with swift and severe punishment irrespective of the Aholes who are committing the affront.

[pbfoot]

Originally Posted by Matt308

I don't know Adler. It was a joke, but it is steeped in truth. Should we support the balkinization of any country? That is why I too was a little disappointed with our State Dept position being issued so quickly. It tends to make things quickly polarized.

I'm deeply conflicted with this action. And not smart enough to understand nor predict the repercussions.

But don't eff with the US embassy. That should be met with swift and severe punishment irrespective of the Aholes who are committing the affront.

I agree in full I don't believe we have recogonized it yet

[pbfoot]

Originally Posted by Matt308

I don't know Adler. It was a joke, but it is steeped in truth. Should we support the balkinization of any country? That is why I too was a little disappointed with our State Dept position being issued so quickly. It tends to make things quickly polarized.

I'm deeply conflicted with this action. And not smart enough to understand nor predict the repercussions.

But don't eff with the US embassy. That should be met with swift and severe punishment irrespective of the Aholes who are committing the affront.

I agree in full. I don't believe we up north have have recogonized it yet

[Matt308]

Keep off my turf Pb.

[freebird]

Originally Posted by Matt308

I don't know Adler. It was a joke, but it is steeped in truth. Should we support the balkinization of any country?

Good post Matt, yes I was joking but the reality is a lttle difficult to figure out. Suppose one of the US states really did vote for independance, and a hude majority supported it?

For example, Hillary is the new Prez and pushes a total amnesty through congress, so 75% of Texans vote to break away & re-form
"The Republic of Texas" {and accepting Tough Ombre & a few other "refugees" from the USA }

Could the US government argue that a state can't break away because it forms an "integral part" of the US? {the same argument made by Serbia & others} How could they disregard the "will of the people"

[evangilder]

California and Texas started out as republics. Yes, they are states, but look at the California flag. It says "California Republic". The state of Texas was part of Mexico at one time that broke away to become a republic, later part of the United States. Gee, sounds familiar, doesn't it?

California was formed by also breaking away from Mexico after General John Fremont and thirty three others started open revolt against Mexico. It was not known at the time in California that War against Mexico was already declared.

So the two biggest states of the Continental United states were formed by breakaway republics from Mexico who later joined into the United States.

[Arsenal VG-33]

About 3 years ago, there was an unveiling of a small plaque on a building in Paris which stated that during the short years that Texas was an independent republic, it's embassy was located in that building.

[freebird]

Originally Posted by evangilder

California and Texas started out as republics. Yes, they are states, but look at the California flag. It says "California Republic". The state of Texas was part of Mexico at one time that broke away to become a republic, later part of the United States. Gee, sounds familiar, doesn't it?

California was formed by also breaking away from Mexico after General John Fremont and thirty three others started open revolt against Mexico. It was not known at the time in California that War against Mexico was already declared.

So the two biggest states of the Continental United states were formed by breakaway republics from Mexico who later joined into the United States.

Quite true, Eric. To be honest, I was a little disappointed in the US administration statements about the "Kurdistan" question. IIRC, they gave an assurance to Turkey that independance for the Turkish Kurds was off the table, yet they are in almost the same position as the Kosovo people. Both were held together against their will as part of a larger country that had conquered the territory in the past. I really didn't like Bush's statement that the aknowledgement of the {WWI} war-crimes by Turkey against Kurds & Armenians is unhelpful "at this time". After 90 odd years, what exactly would be a good time? The truth should not be supressed, no matter what the consequences.

[Matt308]

Bush didn't issue the statement about the "Turkish War Crimes". It was a resolution by the Democratic majority Congress. And a dumbf#uck one at that. The liberal contingent of Congress did it for no other reason than to undermine Bush's successful efforts in the "surge". And it only accomplished to polarize US voters, alienate our allies overseas and destroy a successful relationship with Turkey. Now that is liberal leadership at its best. It's not about your nation, but rather how emotionally it makes you feel. Good job Pelosi/Heide. Effing losers.

[freebird]

Originally Posted by Matt308

Bush didn't issue the statement about the "Turkish War Crimes". It was a resolution by the Democratic majority Congress. And a dumbf#uck one at that. The liberal contingent of Congress did it for no other reason than to undermine Bush's successful efforts in the "surge". And it only accomplished to polarize US voters, alienate our allies overseas and destroy a successful relationship with Turkey. Now that is liberal leadership at its best. It's not about your nation, but rather how emotionally it makes you feel. Good job Pelosi/Heide. Effing losers.

So do we have to "pretend" that there was no genocide in Turkey to keep them as Allies? And if a President of Germany demanded that we accept holocaust denial as the price for their '"alliance" would we "pretend" that no Jews died in WWII?

Come on Matt, if that was a Republican motion that was denounced by President Hill, would you complain? I think that Allies that can't own up to their own sh!t aren't the type you really want.

[Matt308]

Freebird you are a naive chicklet in the world of politics. If any demonstrably powerful nation took such an altruistic position with every nation state relationship, they would quickly be ostracized, marginalized with respect to garnering international support by indigenous populacde and minimalized as a world power.

Think about it Freebird from your little social knothole that you live in and it's less than meaningful contributions to world good (don't be offended, we are all there). Are you 100% honest with your work relationships, customers, and management? Wife or girlfriend perhaps? Please. I don't wish to be flippant but your statement is bordering upon something less complimentary than naive.

[Emac44]

I have been watching this Independance of Kosvo for some time on Australian News Broadcast. As some one has already mentioned the Balkan States are the PowderKeg of Europe. Now I pray that the transition for Self Rule and Independnace goes smoothly in Kosvo and her Serbian Neighbours settle down and begin to realise that continuing roits and warlike stance will gain nothing for either Serbians or Kosvorans. But I feel that this is a vain hope. If any one remembers the post I did some time ago Can the EU keep peace in Europe? This is one of the areas that concerned me when I wrote and posted that posting over a year ago. As you all know with the Arch Duke Ferdinard being assasinated in Sarajevo Bosnia being in the region. Would Kosvo be another match to the flame to kick of another World War in Europe? (I corrected my error and rewrote the sentence. Thank you Milos for your correction)

To make myself clear I support Kosvo and her independance. But what worries me particularly can the EU or NATO prevent further spiralling bloodshed in this new Nation or near the New Nation of Kosvo if the Serbians or even Russia decide to take it further. The same players keep cropping up in this little scenerio concerning Kosvo. 1 Serbians and Russians 2 and the Nations of the European Union albiet different military treaties as for example NATO. Maybe I am overstating this but I do feel quiet uneasy about what is playing out in the Balkans at the moment

[Milos Sijacki]

Archduke Ferdinand was assassinated in Sarajevo, Bosnia, which was part of the Austro-Hungarian Empire back then, not in Kosovo.

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Originally Posted by Milos Sijacki

Archduke Ferdinand was assassinated in Sarajevo, Bosnia, which was part of the Austro-Hungarian Empire back then, not in Kosovo.

His point was that the whole region (The Former Yugoslavia) is hot bed of violence in Europe. One of the worst wars in history was started in this very region.

His worries are valid...

[timshatz]

Originally Posted by Emac44

The same players keep cropping up in this little scenerio concerning Kosvo. 1 Serbians and Russians 2 and the Nations of the European Union albiet different military treaties as for example NATO. Maybe I am overstating this but I do feel quiet uneasy about what is playing out in the Balkans at the moment

I think he nailed it. This thing has been going on for a long time and shows no signs of slowing down. Even with Kosovo a relatively independent state, recognized by other powers, it doesn't mean the Serbs accept the event and will go along quietly. My understanding is they (the Serbs) regard it as something of a homeland. A similar event would be the State of New York declaring independence and the rest of the world accepting it. Would the US say "Ok"? Puerto Rico, maybe yes. But one of the 50, it is doubtful.

My worry is you add in an economic crisis (as we're heading into now) and an unhappy populace (as the Serbs seem to be heading) with a big brother looking to strut it's stuff (Russia) coupled with a Europe that is essentially demilitarized and things could get hairy fast.

The fact that the EU, with 330 Million inhabitants, could not handle the Balkan Conflict in the 90s and had to turn to the US, with 300 million inhabitants, to help them out is not good.