A new revolution in the USA?

[Oreo]

I accidently-- ok, imprudently-- began this topic while replying to an unrelated thread about the original American Revolution.

There are a growing number of people who believe, and some who even call for, a new revolution in the USA. This talk takes many forms, but I am most familiar with the conservative, original documents crowd who believe the United States is yearly straying farther and farther away from the original intentions of the founding fathers and founding documents of our nation. There are many who say today that the excessive intrusions against the rights of the citizens today equal or exceed the intrusions that sparked the original revolution when the states, united in their cause, separated from England. This is a thread for anyone who would like to discuss this topic.

[Njaco]

As far as a physical confrontation, it will never happen as the Armed Forces are usually solidly behind the US. Maybe drastic change through the Constitution if we had enough politicians with backbone but I don't see that happening.

[Torch]

Interesting and tempting thought, Something needs to happen with the gutless politicians we keep electing..

[Oreo]

Originally Posted by Njaco

As far as a physical confrontation, it will never happen

You may be right, however even that could change.

as the Armed Forces are usually solidly behind the US.

Pretty much, but many leave the service dissatisfied, and many vets and current personnel look with anxiety on the days ahead. A large percentage of the revolutionary types I have met are vets, and some have been current enlistees at the time.

Originally Posted by Njaco

Maybe drastic change through the Constitution if we had enough politicians with backbone but I don't see that happening.

Never say never. That would be the ideal solution to the whole mess.

[Oreo]

Originally Posted by Torch

Interesting and tempting thought, Something needs to happen with the gutless politicians we keep electing..

Nice to meet you, Torch, I'm relatively new to this site, don't think I've met you before.

[syscom3]

I dont think the armed forces has the willpower to use force on the civil population, if it remains relatively peacefull.

I do forsee regional blocks of states deciding their own domestic affairs and collectively thumbing their noses at the USSC. Sort of like if the southern states decide to ban abortion, speed up the execution of murderers. There is no way the military is going to enforce those laws, and the US Marshalls service will simply laugh at doing enforcement, especially if they might get shot doing it.

[Maestro]

Hmmm... An interresting thread there, Oreo.

I don't know much about the US politics except for the nationalist-socialist propaganda that are constantly broadcasted throughout Canadian/Québeker medias and the pieces of info I get from American satellite radio. However, here are my two cents...

IF there is a revolution in the US, there can be two options : a political revolution (which is not very likely due to the fact that 90% of American politicians (just like all other politicians around the world) seems to be corrupted) or a military revolution.

IF it is a military revolution, once again there is three options :

1 - All of the states will unifies against the current power. (Which is not likely due to the fact that US Forces are solidly behind the US, as stated earlier.)

2 - The more "different" states (i.e. the Southern states like Texas, Florida, Louisiana...) will unifies together and fight against the more... erhm... "liberal" states (i.e. New-York, Maryland...).

3 - Every states feeling "screwed up by the central power in Washington D.C." will simply elect a government that will secede their state from the rest of the US... I think there is already a movement like that in Vermont. But as I understand it from the US, the state of Vermont is being seen as *the* redneck state in the US.

Anyway, it was only the point of view from a damned foreigner.

[The Basket]

Can you put more ideas out here Oreo?

What are they fighting for and what are they fighting against?

I suppose fighting a foreign power is different from fighting your own government.

[Oreo]

Originally Posted by Maestro

Hmmm... An interresting thread there, Oreo.

I don't know much about the US politics except for the nationalist-socialist propaganda that are constantly broadcasted throughout Canadian/Québeker medias and the pieces of info I get from American satellite radio. However, here are my two cents...

IF there is a revolution in the US, there can be two options : a political revolution (which is not very likely due to the fact that 90% of American politicians (just like all other politicians around the world) seems to be corrupted) or a military revolution.

IF it is a military revolution, once again there is three options :

1 - All of the states will unifies against the current power. (Which is not likely due to the fact that US Forces are solidly behind the US, as stated earlier.)

2 - The more "different" states (i.e. the Southern states like Texas, Florida, Louisiana...) will unifies together and fight against the more... erhm... "liberal" states (i.e. New-York, Maryland...).

3 - Every states feeling "screwed up by the central power in Washington D.C." will simply elect a government that will secede their state from the rest of the US... I think there is already a movement like that in Vermont. But as I understand it from the US, the state of Vermont is being seen as *the* redneck state in the US.

Anyway, it was only the point of view from a damned foreigner.

Thank you for your view, Maestro. It is always good to have an honest opinion from outside, and I appreciate it. Often times people from other nations, even Canada, just spew hatred toward us rather than honest assessments.

One thing about Vermont: Vermont is kind of a weird state in a lot of ways. It is highly polarized politically, because a little over half the voters are liberals, and liberalism is highly rampant there. They have a lot of very aggressive liberals. (they would say progressive, I say aggressive!) However, the other slightly less than half of the population are quite conservative, and have a very tight independent streak in them, not willing for anyone to trample on their freedoms.

To make matters more interesting, Vermont is a tiny state, in terms of population (about 5-600,000) and land area. They also are kind of tucked up there in the mountains and woods off the beaten path from anywhere else.

As for them being a red-neck state-- they are one of many. The so-called elites "don't recognize much in between New York and L.A." My state I grew up in, Maine, is another Canadian border state and another redneck state. The other ones readily touted are probably: West Virginia, Kentucky, Tennessee, South Carolina (where I live now), Georgia (but not Atlanta), Alabama, Mississippi, Louisiana, Arkansas, and Missouri. Out west, Montana, Wyoming, and Idaho have a similar but not so degraded opinion held of them.

The enlightened states are Massachusetts, New York, Connecticut, New Jersey, Virginia, Florida, Illinois, Minnesota (maybe!), Indiana (maybe), Pennsylvania (maybe), California, Hawaii, Arizona, Colorado, and Washington. Rogue states are Texas, Georgia, New Hampshire, South Carolina, Tennessee, Alabama, Vermont, Montana, Oklahoma, Missouri, Idaho, Nevada, and Alaska. You see the lists overlap some.

South Carolina was one of the pivotal states in the first revolution, and the first to secede and first to see fighting action during the second revolution (1861-65). South Carolina and Texas are two of the big hotbed states. Texas was once a totally independent country.

[Oreo]

Originally Posted by The Basket

Can you put more ideas out here Oreo?

What are they fighting for and what are they fighting against?

I suppose fighting a foreign power is different from fighting your own government.

Fighting your own government is very different from fighting a foreign power.

The people who are considering revolution are fighting against many things, but they are primarily fighting FOR one thing in particular: a return to a strict interpretation of the Constitution of the United States.

For those of you who are natives of other nations, I suggest you read the text of the Declaration of Independence, which can be found on Wikipedia, and many other sites. A little deeper to read is the Constitution, which came several years after the states, united, won the Revolutionary War.

Some of the big issues that conservative patriots are concerned with these days are: Fiscal responsibility, corruption in government, abortion (oppose its legality), parents' rights, property rights, taxation, bad fiscal foreign policy, especially with China, the homosexual agenda (oppose it), independence from foreign energy, and globalism at the expense of national sovereignty.

Perhaps the biggest one now, though, is illegal immigration. We have approximately 20 million illegal immigrants in our country now, and no one really knows the true numbers. They are keeping the wage pool artificially low, and they are causing many problems socially. Perhaps the biggest issue is that our government basically refuses to crack down on the problem and seeks to "normalize" these law-breakers, at the same time cracking down on a few here and there, mainly for show. Here in South Carolina, one can hardly walk down the street without tripping over people who (by doing a little quick profiling) are here from foreign countries and don't seem to be with the program. U.S. citizens "enable" these people by actually hiring them to do work. This is a very bad practice, in my opinion, and in the opinion of the people who hate to see their jobs, neighborhoods, safety, and culture taken over by people who sneaked in under cover of darkness, and pledge no loyalty to our nation other than to look for the next way to make $100.

Opponents, that is those who embrace the illegal immigrants and want to keep them here, respond by calling those who dare stand up for principal "bigots, racist, narrow-minded, reactionary, or intolerant."

There is also the belief my some and the suspicion by others that our nation is being semi-secretly delivered up to be united with Mexico and Canada as a "North American Union" mirroring the European Union, with a single currency, and a central government, and close diplomatic ties to the E.U. Such a thing would compromise the sovereignty of the United States and could result in much loss of freedom and equity by its people.

A website I recommend for keeping up with daily events from a conservative viewpoint is WorldNetDaily - A Free Press for a Free People which provides articles daily on a wide variety of news topics from a conservative, free viewpoint. I'm not saying everything on there is 100% accurate, but compared to th accuracy and relevancy of most of the news sources out there, it is magnificently better. (watch out for the "special offer" sections, though, some of those are duds!)

Cheers, all. Thanks for your interest.