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08-13-2008, 07:49 AM
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#1066 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: South Jersey, United States
Posts: 7,175
Country:  | I'm a government worker. And a Union shop steward. 
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"If you can read this, thank a teacher. If it's English, thank a soldier!" | 
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08-13-2008, 03:03 PM
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#1067 | | Der Crewchief
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany
Posts: 30,270
Country:  | I am a government worker as well.
Fear me Amsel! 
__________________  US Army Blackhawk Crewchief 2000-2006 Classic ww2aircraft.net quotes: fly boy said: "isn't that the first jet bomber? becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles" "wait what ok who made the b-2 crash come on people that messed up its a b-2" "ah yes the mistel those things are so annoying is games and in real life" | |
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08-13-2008, 04:46 PM
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#1068 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: South Jersey, United States
Posts: 7,175
Country: |
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"If you can read this, thank a teacher. If it's English, thank a soldier!" | |
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08-13-2008, 04:56 PM
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#1069 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: British Columbia
Posts: 1,880
Country:  | Quote:
Originally Posted by Njaco  I'm a government worker. And a Union shop steward. | Which is why you can hang around on the forum all day.... 
Seriously though, I can take Amsel's point, we have to be honest & critical of the leaders, even in our own "side", and not just parrot blind support, ie - All Democrats/Liberals are bad, and all Republicans/Conservatives can do no wrong.
The conservative movement will have to re-group and be very careful to pick it's next leader {at 72 yr old McCain will be more like a caretaker if elected}.
The movement will have to have good ideas & policys to appeal to the center, not just rely on ultra-conservatives & religious right to eke out a narrow victory.
And this means being honest about past screw-ups too.
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08-13-2008, 05:50 PM
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#1070 | | Der Crewchief
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany
Posts: 30,270
Country: | Quote:
Originally Posted by freebird we have to be honest & critical of the leaders. | I agree with you. I was just teasing him.
__________________ US Army Blackhawk Crewchief 2000-2006 Classic ww2aircraft.net quotes: fly boy said: "isn't that the first jet bomber? becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles" "wait what ok who made the b-2 crash come on people that messed up its a b-2" "ah yes the mistel those things are so annoying is games and in real life" | |
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08-13-2008, 06:23 PM
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#1071 | | the old Sage
Join Date: May 2004 Location: Platonic Sphere
Posts: 9,511
Country: | present man in office - worthless
future man of 2008 November election - worthless | |
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08-13-2008, 06:41 PM
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#1072 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: British Columbia
Posts: 1,880
Country: | Quote:
Originally Posted by DerAdlerIstGelandet I agree with you. I was just teasing him. | I figured that.
The conservatives will have alot of soul-searching & re-building if Obama wins....
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08-13-2008, 09:20 PM
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#1073 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: South Jersey, United States
Posts: 7,175
Country: | And getting our passports in order!
I agree, Free, I voted lukewarm - some things just didn't do it for me with Bush. But I still believe in the cause.
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"If you can read this, thank a teacher. If it's English, thank a soldier!" | |
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08-15-2008, 06:04 PM
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#1074 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Montrose, Colorado
Posts: 2,280
Country: | Amsel, you make some good points. Honest men should fear for their liberties at all times but when our country is threatened, liberties often are threatened also. In this debate about President Bush, it is interesting to reflect on past presidents that are considered by "authorities" as good presidents. As I have mentioned ad infinitum Truman's approval rating was much lower than Bush's-23% to 30%. Truman is now considered a good president. JFK is revered by many but almost got us into a shooting war with the USSR, failed to follow through with the Bay of Pigs which was a fiasco and got us started in Viet Nam. LBJ is considered by most dimocrats as a great president yet his Great Society Program was a failure and much of it has been repealed and he really got us mired in Viet Nam with a no win policy. Go figure! | |
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08-15-2008, 06:50 PM
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#1075 | | Junior Member
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 2
Country: | Wow- my compliments to the Admins here for such a progressive thread where folks can say what's on their mind on such a potentially divisive topic
Not intending for such a thread to be my first post here, but I recognize a name or two- Hello, btw, I've been on the UbiZoo, ACWoS and other sights.
Bush isn't my fav, but I am generally sceptical of most politicos. I don't think any US President put it any more succinctly than Dwight D. Eisenhower: Beware the Military Industrial Complex.
~S~
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08-15-2008, 06:58 PM
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#1076 | | IP/Mech THE GREAT GAZOO
Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado, USA
Posts: 13,583
Country: | Quote:
Originally Posted by Triad773 Beware the Military Industrial Complex. | And just who or what is that?????
__________________ "IF ITS RED OR DUSTY, DON'T TOUCH IT"  | |
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08-16-2008, 12:37 AM
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#1077 | | Banned
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 11
Country: | Quote:
Originally Posted by FLYBOYJ And just who or what is that????? | Another way to refer to the Military Industrial Complex that President Eisenhower referred to is as the private agencies with controlling interests in energy and military racketeering. The same people making the money off war are pushing the legislative envelope towards nuclear deregulation within the home country and imperial oversight (based on faith and dogma instead of facts and evidence) for the rest of the world. | |
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08-16-2008, 12:41 AM
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#1078 | | IP/Mech THE GREAT GAZOO
Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado, USA
Posts: 13,583
Country: | Quote:
Originally Posted by toiditm Another way to refer to the Military Industrial Complex that President Eisenhower referred to is as the private agencies with controlling interests in energy and military racketeering. The same people making the money off war are pushing the legislative envelope towards nuclear deregulation within the home country and imperial oversight (based on faith and dogma instead of facts and evidence) for the rest of the world. | And again, name them.
__________________ "IF ITS RED OR DUSTY, DON'T TOUCH IT" | |
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08-16-2008, 02:50 AM
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#1079 | | Banned
Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Northern Va.
Posts: 53
Country: | Love lukewarm & hate....
Hmmmm
Well I can't apply any of those terms... I am sorry I voted for the man.. but not ashamed to admit it.. probably the only time I have ever regretted voting considering the sacrifices made by so many so that I could vote...
He & his cronies have done more to hurt this country in the long run than any administration in my memory... including the Carter administration... He has squandered our reputation, our credibility, that was already in a slide... but he trashed it... trillions of dollars... and even more importantly thousands of lives... and given OJT to several terrorist organizations with his ill concieved and poorly executed "war on terror" that of course was launched on out right lies and fabrications... and don't get me started on the press & congress.. which just rolled over and spread for him while he and his buddies, most notably Dick "So what" Cheny and Don "I don't do quagmires" Rumsfeld greased up to stick it to the country.... and don't get me started on the way they pimped the taxpayers out to corporate America with their no bid contracts and blank checks..
Under his administration the constitution took a beating like a redheaded stepchild, and even though much of the groundwork for this was laid in previous administrations... including Clinton's, the Bush administration took it to a whole different level.
I don't know what the future holds.... but I know that the Republican party had an ideal opportunity to show the American people that they were on the side of "every American.." and not just the "rich ones" and they blew it big time. Instead of at least trying to act like they gave a damn they actually sucked on the taxpayer teat like frat boys on a beer keg at a toga party.... I cant speak for anyone else... but I'll grow another head before I ever vote republican again... and frankly, the dems aren't much better.. they just use more grease.. but in the end it is the taxpayer who "Takes it in the rear...... in the rear.... in the rear...." to quote Jay Billington Bulworth
The main reason I vote now is because so many people thought it was worth being jailed, beaten, and even killed.... so that I and the rest of their children could exercise that right.... My faith in the system is not very strong at the moment.... and Obama... while I am impressed... will at the most get what.... 8 years? Even if he walks on water.... turns the country around and makes everybody do group hugs.... he's got what..... 8 years.... then it's all up for grabs again..... | |
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08-16-2008, 07:19 AM
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#1080 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: British Columbia
Posts: 1,880
Country: | Quote:
Originally Posted by Njaco I agree, Free, I voted lukewarm - some things just didn't do it for me with Bush. But I still believe in the cause. | Yep, the right needs to work on getting a solid conservative for next time... Quote:
Originally Posted by Triad773 Wow- my compliments to the Admins here for such a progressive thread where folks can say what's on their mind on such a potentially divisive topic | Welcome Triad! Quote:
Originally Posted by Bearcat
I don't know what the future holds.... but I know that the Republican party had an ideal opportunity to show the American people that they were on the side of "every American.." and they blew it big time....
| That is a very good post. They had a chance to really bring a solid conservative government, but lost the chance.
Now looking at the possibility of an inexperieced radical Illinois Senator in the White House...
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