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02-18-2007, 03:17 PM
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#31 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Fresno, CA
Posts: 2,254
Country:  | Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcel  Were they? Maybe I'm misinformed, but I thought the western allies didn't see a lot from the Luftwaffe after Normandy until the battle of the Bulge. And after that there I thought was even less activity. | Yes, they were largely decimated but pound for pound, in a tactical sense they were still a threat... except for the depletion in experienced pilots | 
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02-18-2007, 04:03 PM
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#32 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Orange County, CA
Posts: 8,095
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Originally Posted by bigZ .... The BOB forever broken the back of the Luftwaffe. | Incorrect. The Luftwaffe wasnt "broken" untill the fighters went on the offensive throughout Germnay in 1944. Quote: |
What am trying to say is it took the combined effort of all the allies to turn the war around. The RAF couldn't have done it on its own, but equally USSR couldnt have been supplied if GB fell or the USAF wouldnt have waged its superb bombing campaign without GB bases.
| by 1944, when the US aircraft industry hit its speed, the training programs were sending out thousands of pilots that had a good chance to succede, then it can honestly be said the USAAF became the most powerfull air force in the world. Everything from well designed planes, good training and tactics, good leadership and industrial suprememcy. Quote: |
Talking of training dosn't the expression "One a day in Tampa Bay" refer to the horrendous B29 losses due to poor training?
| It was the B26 that had issues. And once the pilots were shown how to fly on single engines, the loss rate went way down. In fact, the B26 turned out to have one of the most solidly constructed airframes of the war, giving its aircrews the lowest loss rate of any type.
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02-18-2007, 04:06 PM
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#33 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Fresno, CA
Posts: 2,254
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Originally Posted by syscom3 It was the B26 that had issues. And once the pilots were shown how to fly on single engines, the loss rate went way down. In fact, the B26 turned out to have one of the most solidly constructed airframes of the war, giving its aircrews the lowest loss rate of any type. | "Flak Bait" Flak Bait - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia | |
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02-18-2007, 04:09 PM
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#34 | | Der Crewchief
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany
Posts: 29,455
Country:  | Everyone it really is stupid to say that one country "won" the war. It was an allied effort. All of them played there role and part and together they defeated Germany and Japan.
It is safe to say though that the US production capacity is what sped up the end of the war. Without the war most certainly would have dragged on longer.
__________________  US Army Blackhawk Crewchief 2000-2006 Classic ww2aircraft.net quotes: fly boy said: "isn't that the first jet bomber? becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles" "wait what ok who made the b-2 crash come on people that messed up its a b-2" "ah yes the mistel those things are so annoying is games and in real life" | |
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02-18-2007, 04:11 PM
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#35 | | IP/Mech THE GREAT GAZOO
Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado, USA
Posts: 12,969
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Originally Posted by DerAdlerIstGelandet Everyone it really is stupid to say that one country "won" the war. It was an allied effort. All of them played there role and part and together they defeated Germany and Japan.
It is safe to say though that the US production capacity is what sped up the end of the war. Without the war most certainly would have dragged on longer. | Yep!
__________________ "IF ITS RED OR DUSTY, DON'T TOUCH IT"  | |
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02-18-2007, 04:25 PM
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#36 | | He who does not skim
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Halifax, Nova Scotia
Posts: 8,957
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Originally Posted by Desert Fox Good point, but I believe that the RAF was the best, considering they beat back the German onslaught during the Battle of Britain, outnumbered enormously | Too true, but then you'd have to include members of the RCAF, RAAF, and RNZAF, along with Free French and Polish Air Force survivors in the mix as well. Particularly the Poles. They were downright vicious. | |
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02-18-2007, 04:27 PM
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#37 | | Der Crewchief
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany
Posts: 29,455
Country: | Dont forget about the Czech pilots who flew in the RAF.
__________________ US Army Blackhawk Crewchief 2000-2006 Classic ww2aircraft.net quotes: fly boy said: "isn't that the first jet bomber? becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles" "wait what ok who made the b-2 crash come on people that messed up its a b-2" "ah yes the mistel those things are so annoying is games and in real life" | |
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02-18-2007, 04:28 PM
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#38 | | He who does not skim
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Halifax, Nova Scotia
Posts: 8,957
Country: | Good point. You beat me to my edit. 
The Norwegians too for that matter. | |
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02-18-2007, 04:30 PM
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#39 | | Der Crewchief
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany
Posts: 29,455
Country: | And the Dutch and Belgium pilots as well.
__________________ US Army Blackhawk Crewchief 2000-2006 Classic ww2aircraft.net quotes: fly boy said: "isn't that the first jet bomber? becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles" "wait what ok who made the b-2 crash come on people that messed up its a b-2" "ah yes the mistel those things are so annoying is games and in real life" | |
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02-18-2007, 04:32 PM
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#40 | | He who does not skim
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Halifax, Nova Scotia
Posts: 8,957
Country: | And if you wanted to get really technical, a few Americans as well. | |
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02-18-2007, 04:35 PM
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#41 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Orange County, CA
Posts: 8,095
| Were talking about the best AF in the war, not whether it won the war single handidly or not.
The USAAF turned into the most powerfull by the summer of 1944, and by early 1945, it was a few magnitudes better than the 2nd place AF.
And just think how much more powerfull it would have been if the USN didn't require its share of material and pilots to build their own massive air force.
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02-18-2007, 04:39 PM
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#42 | | Der Crewchief
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany
Posts: 29,455
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Originally Posted by syscom3 Were talking about the best AF in the war, not whether it won the war single handidly or not. | No it got way off topic and people started discussing who won the war by themselves.
__________________ US Army Blackhawk Crewchief 2000-2006 Classic ww2aircraft.net quotes: fly boy said: "isn't that the first jet bomber? becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles" "wait what ok who made the b-2 crash come on people that messed up its a b-2" "ah yes the mistel those things are so annoying is games and in real life" | |
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02-18-2007, 04:43 PM
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#43 | | He who does not skim
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Halifax, Nova Scotia
Posts: 8,957
Country: | All things being considered, I'm with sys and pb here. The USAAF was the best all round air force of WWII, from about mid war onward. Size, supply, production, training, tactics, overall quality, decent leadership...They had it all, and as was said, dominated practically every theatre of the air war by the end. Pretty hard to knock that.
The air arms of the USN and USMC didn't exactly suck either. 
Last edited by Nonskimmer : 02-18-2007 at 04:45 PM.
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02-18-2007, 04:45 PM
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#44 | | Der Crewchief
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany
Posts: 29,455
Country: | I agree too, that is why I voted for the USAAF.
__________________ US Army Blackhawk Crewchief 2000-2006 Classic ww2aircraft.net quotes: fly boy said: "isn't that the first jet bomber? becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles" "wait what ok who made the b-2 crash come on people that messed up its a b-2" "ah yes the mistel those things are so annoying is games and in real life" | |
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02-18-2007, 05:04 PM
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#45 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Great Southern Land
Posts: 428
Country:  | Yes, I shouldve put the Finnish Air Force in, they did do some extraordinary things, even though they were vastly outnumbered. But remember, if it wasnt for the RAF (yes, im including the polish, aussies, kiwis, belgians etc in there as well) winning the Battle of Britain, then Europe would have been lost to the Germans. The US, strong as they were, could not have beaten the Germans by themselves, even with the help of Resistance and Partisans
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