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07-16-2006, 04:22 AM
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#166 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: UK
Posts: 3,502
Country:  | We've all seen the film B of B with the Phase "give us Spitfires" in reply to Goerings question . As far as I know it was a true occurance so I'll go with Garland he was there and new the score.
That said putting your fighter squadrons in the best attacking position using radar means the first pass will be all the more effective if you know where the enemy is coming from and he is unaware of your approach vector it must help alot. | 
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07-16-2006, 06:17 AM
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#167 | | Master of Ewes
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 19,959
Country:  | i believe he only said "a squadron of spitfires" in reply to Georing's question of what do you need to win the battle to annoy him didn't he?
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"Reminds me of the time I sank the Tirpitz" comments a Spitfire pilot, "One pass of course, old boy." | |
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07-16-2006, 06:53 AM
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#168 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: UK
Posts: 3,502
Country: | Possible Lanc but in the documentary world at war I seem to remember him saying that he believed the Spite to have the edge (I may be wrong as it's some years since I watched it) | |
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07-17-2006, 07:53 AM
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#169 | | Der Crewchief
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany
Posts: 29,456
Country:  | Quote: |
Originally Posted by loomaluftwaffe but not the same case with the 109F right? | What do you mean?
__________________  US Army Blackhawk Crewchief 2000-2006 Classic ww2aircraft.net quotes: fly boy said: "isn't that the first jet bomber? becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles" "wait what ok who made the b-2 crash come on people that messed up its a b-2" "ah yes the mistel those things are so annoying is games and in real life" | |
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07-17-2006, 07:56 AM
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#170 | | Master of Ewes
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 19,959
Country: | i think he means it's not the case with the -109F that the spit and hurricane out turn it i.e. the -109F can turn inside the hurricane and spit..............
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"Reminds me of the time I sank the Tirpitz" comments a Spitfire pilot, "One pass of course, old boy." | |
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07-17-2006, 08:30 AM
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#171 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,579
| The Bf-109F will turn with the Spitfire, but not the Hurricane.
__________________  We have built a total of about 1250 of this aircraft (Me-262), but only fifty were allowed to be used as fighters - as interceptors. And out of this fifty, there were never more than 25 operational. So we had only a very, very few.
- Adolf Galland | |
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07-17-2006, 10:03 AM
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#172 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 12,057
Country: | The Hurricane was a lot like the Zero. It could turn extremely well in a low-speed fight, and any German pilot would be foolish to put himself in that position against one. But it was a slow plane and was left standing in the turning fight at high speed.
__________________ "When you go home tomorrow, don't expect anyone to know what you have been through. Even if they did know, most people probably wouldn't care anyway. Some of you may get the medals you deserve, many more of you will not. But remember this, all of you are now members of the front-line club, and that is the most exclusive club in the world." - Lt. Col. Matthew Maer CO 1st Battalion, the Princess of Wale's Royal Regiment. Camp Abu Naji, Oct. 2004  To those in that club. | |
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07-17-2006, 12:38 PM
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#173 | | Der Crewchief
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany
Posts: 29,456
Country: | Thanks Lanc, Lomma very often thows out half sentinces or phrases like that and I dont understand what he is saying or trying to say.
__________________ US Army Blackhawk Crewchief 2000-2006 Classic ww2aircraft.net quotes: fly boy said: "isn't that the first jet bomber? becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles" "wait what ok who made the b-2 crash come on people that messed up its a b-2" "ah yes the mistel those things are so annoying is games and in real life" | |
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07-18-2006, 03:23 AM
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#174 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,848
Country:  | yep
__________________  "The German Luftwaffe always fought without any reserves. This is also the reason why we have pilots with extremely high numbers of victories."
- General der Jagdflieger Adolf Galland"  | |
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07-21-2006, 01:26 PM
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#175 | | Banned
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 10
Country: | If where talking about the Battle of Britain (1940) then there roughly the same. the 109 had better armerment (2 20mm cannon+2 MGs) than the Spitfire (4 Mg's) but the spitfire was more easyer to fly, comfortable and the engine was quiter than the german ones | |
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07-21-2006, 01:49 PM
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#176 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Royal Deeside/St Andrews, Scotland, UK
Posts: 11,223
Country: | Good points, although the Spitfire in the Battle of Britain carried 8 MG's not 4 (that was in one of the prototypes). At the time they were probably equal with the 109 being able to out dive the Spitfire because the negative G caused the Spitfire (and Hurricane) to stall.
__________________  "Success is not Final, Failure is not Fatal, it is the Courage to Continue that Counts"
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"To him the people of the world largely owe the Freedom and liberties they enjoy today"
Enscription on Hugh Dowding's (AOC Fighter Command 1936-40) statue in London
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07-22-2006, 02:27 AM
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#177 | | Master of Ewes
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 19,959
Country: | a problem that was later solved with the introduction of a better carburettor
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"Reminds me of the time I sank the Tirpitz" comments a Spitfire pilot, "One pass of course, old boy." | |
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07-22-2006, 02:32 AM
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#178 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,848
Country: | but wasn't solved till after the battle of britain... right?
and the 20mm cannons of the 109 werent really that good, they were slow and had low muzzle velocity, but what the heck... u have cannons
__________________ "The German Luftwaffe always fought without any reserves. This is also the reason why we have pilots with extremely high numbers of victories."
- General der Jagdflieger Adolf Galland" | |
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07-23-2006, 10:32 AM
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#179 | | Der Crewchief
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany
Posts: 29,456
Country: | Quote: |
Originally Posted by hellothere If where talking about the Battle of Britain (1940) then there roughly the same. the 109 had better armerment (2 20mm cannon+2 MGs) than the Spitfire (4 Mg's) but the spitfire was more easyer to fly, comfortable and the engine was quiter than the german ones | Not quite.
They were actually very equal at that point.
The armament was actually 8 MGs as many pointed out.
As for the Spitfire being easier to fly. Not really at that point of the War. The Spitfire did not start to take the lead in that point till later with the introduction of the Bf-109G when the 109 started to get heavier. Besides as others put out the 109 actually had a slight advantage in that it did not have to worry about the engine stalling out due to no fuel flow.
Spitfire more confortable. Yeah she was but then agian how confortable were all the small fighters of that time? 
__________________ US Army Blackhawk Crewchief 2000-2006 Classic ww2aircraft.net quotes: fly boy said: "isn't that the first jet bomber? becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles" "wait what ok who made the b-2 crash come on people that messed up its a b-2" "ah yes the mistel those things are so annoying is games and in real life" | |
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08-03-2006, 05:41 PM
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#180 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 580
| The Spit always had better visibility than the 109.
How would a Hurricane perform against a Zero? - Just out of interest.
Love that sig Gnomey, where'd you get it - if you don't mind me asking? - it's brilliant!
The 8 guns of the Spit gave a better spread, they were much easier to hit a target with, but caused much less damage.
Kinda like a shotgun or cluster-bomb works. The Hurricane and 109 had more devestating armament, but it was harder to hit a target with them.
When did the Tilly Shilling orifice see use? - IIRC it wa during the BoB?
The Bendix carbs came later and then there was another one. (Why not Weber's or Throttle bodies? ) Quote: |
Yeah she was but then again how confortable were all the small fighters of that time?
| You could lounge in a Spitfire. In the book 'Great Aircraft of WW2' it has a German pilots impression of the Spit and it mentions how comfortable the cockpit/controls and how quiet the engine was. Ergonomics I can guess are a big part, SAAB seems to think so. | |
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