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05-27-2006, 07:44 PM
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#16 | | | Quote: |
Originally Posted by Wildcat Lets not forget the Buffalo had a 2:1 kill ratio over the Japs at Singapore and Malaya when flown by the inexperianced pilots of the RAF, RAAF, RNZAF and NEIAF. Not a bad effort in my books! | Where on earth did you get that outrageous figure from? Is it based on claims? In actual fact the F2A suffered a loss rate of 1:1.7 overall, and a 1:3 against the Japanese fighters Ki-27 and Ki-43. | |
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05-28-2006, 12:06 AM
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#17 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Adelaide
Posts: 3,178
Country:  | From the book Buffaloes Over Singapore which includeds a list of enemy aircraft claims and credits as well as Buffalo loses. Plus I believe more Buffaloes were lost due to accidents and general inexperiance by the pilots then due to actual combat. Could you tell me where you got your figures from? This subject interests me and would love to find out more.
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05-28-2006, 06:01 PM
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#18 | | | I thought it may have been either Buffaloes or Bloody Shambles.
Either book are a good source for Buffaloe losses, but then need to be balanced against the loss list contained in the back of Hata and Izawa's 'Japanese Army Air Force Fighter Units'.
By the by if you are a lover of the Vultee Vengeance you should get your hands on the book 'Vengeance', by Peter C Smith (if you ahven't already done so). It cover it's history very well, including the RAFF units. | |
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05-28-2006, 08:51 PM
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#19 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Adelaide
Posts: 3,178
Country: | Yeah I'am aware of the Vengeance book and hopefully will be getting my hands on it soon. Thanks for the added info.
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07-20-2006, 04:31 PM
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#20 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Colorado, USA
Posts: 1,414
Country:  |
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"His motor's conked out!"
"What's the differance, they're all Nazis!"
"Luke, shut up!"
"Fear the hook!"
"Oh.....I wanna fly."
"You mean the kind that go under water and fly up the stairs?"
"What you doing? Oh Nooooo!"
Last edited by Soundbreaker Welch? : 07-20-2006 at 04:52 PM.
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07-20-2006, 04:58 PM
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#21 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Winnipeg
Posts: 2,199
Country:  | While I have read a couple different bio's from Jap aces they said their most favored opponents they loved to see was the P-39 (b/c it was easy to kill in their minds) I would have to say that I would take a P-39 over a Buff any day.
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In the ocean of the military, reflective of all distinguished pilots, an honored Buddhist person. | |
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07-22-2006, 04:50 PM
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#22 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Colorado, USA
Posts: 1,414
Country: | It had a tough time shooting down high flying bombers.
__________________
"His motor's conked out!"
"What's the differance, they're all Nazis!"
"Luke, shut up!"
"Fear the hook!"
"Oh.....I wanna fly."
"You mean the kind that go under water and fly up the stairs?"
"What you doing? Oh Nooooo!" | |
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07-22-2006, 04:57 PM
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#23 | | Member
Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: mineral wells texas
Posts: 42
| 39 anytime over the buff
Just what i have read from the subro saki is the buff is helpless
yet that might have been because of the pilots in the buffs.
And for ground support the 39 is for sure the best between the two.
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love the history and the debate | |
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07-23-2006, 04:30 AM
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#24 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Colorado, USA
Posts: 1,414
Country: | yet that might have been because of the pilots in the buffs.
And also perhaps, because the Zero was a very remarkable plane. It wasn't until the P-38 came along that the Allies had something that was a good match for the Zero.
__________________
"His motor's conked out!"
"What's the differance, they're all Nazis!"
"Luke, shut up!"
"Fear the hook!"
"Oh.....I wanna fly."
"You mean the kind that go under water and fly up the stairs?"
"What you doing? Oh Nooooo!" | |
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07-23-2006, 09:52 AM
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#25 | | IP/Mech THE GREAT GAZOO
Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado, USA
Posts: 12,537
Country: | Posted this before...
In the late Summer of 42' the 39th FS was flying P-39s and doing quite well, at that point the USAAF had about a 1.5 to 1 kill ratio over the Japanese while flying the P-39 (and P-40) some of the great Pacific P-38 aces (Danny Roberts, Buzz Wagner, Tommy Lynch) did well in the P-39. When the P-38 entered the scene, the 39th (and other units) started an effective slaughter of the Japanese in the South Pacific.
__________________ "IF ITS RED OR DUSTY, DON'T TOUCH IT"  | |
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07-24-2006, 04:04 PM
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#26 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Colorado, USA
Posts: 1,414
Country: | So did George Welch. But he preffered the P-38 to the P-39 for it's long range.
__________________
"His motor's conked out!"
"What's the differance, they're all Nazis!"
"Luke, shut up!"
"Fear the hook!"
"Oh.....I wanna fly."
"You mean the kind that go under water and fly up the stairs?"
"What you doing? Oh Nooooo!" | |
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07-28-2006, 10:14 AM
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#27 | | Member
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 31
Country: | The 2 Aircraft were in slightly different time frames, the Buffalo entering Service testing by the USN in 1938 and squadron service in mid 1939.
The P-39 was only ordered by the USAAC in mid 1939 and production started in August 1939 so the P-39 had the benifit of the rapidly evolving technology and engines.
I think the Buffalo was a better Fighter, until wieghed down with extra armour and the 50cal replaced by .303.
But if you wanted a Fighter Bomber, the P-39 was the better machine. | |
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07-28-2006, 01:38 PM
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#28 | | Junior Member
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 29
Country: | I'd take a P-39.
But only with the turbocharged engine that was never implemented. :P
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"...Miracle of miracles, the big old P-38 actually turned inside that nimble little Oscar. I was on the deck, in a vertical bank, and the yoke was bucking and shuddering in my hands. That turn was nothing more nor less than a controlled stall." -- John A. Tilley, USAAC, 457th FG. | |
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07-28-2006, 02:23 PM
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#29 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Phila, Pa
Posts: 2,153
Country: | P39. If you can't win the fight, at least you can survive it. With the engine behind the pilot, your odds are better. Plus, if all else fails just shove the nose down, throw the throttle against the wall and run like hell!
Don't think the buff could run away from a fight. | |
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08-03-2006, 07:42 PM
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#30 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Saco, MAINE!!!!
Posts: 894
Country: | I would have to take the P-39 
The Russians used it quite nicely. I tink that the Jap pilots in the beginning were capable of taking on any aircft put against them.
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