F4F Wildcat versus P-40E Tomahawk

[kool kitty89]

That's what I was refferring to, including the cooling system of the inline.

Though taking out the oil cooler on any of these engines will kill it fast. (though, in the P-40, if the oil cooler gets hit, chances are the radiator has as well due to the location, not that it woud matter too much as the engine is going out either way)

[HoHun]

Hi Koolkitty,

>That's what I was refferring to, including the cooling system of the inline.

Roger that, but as I said - often claimed, never proven. If it's a worthwhile advantage, it shouldn't be so hard to find numbers to verify it ...

Regards,

Henning (HoHun)

[cobra18]

To all from a newbie, after reading all posts and my own references regarding this question, it seems that although the P40 seems to have an advantage on paper, in real combat it actually came down to the pilot & his knowledge of both the advantages & weakness of his arcraft

[Soundbreaker Welch?]

Good point, and welcome to the forum!

[Th!rdeye]

Hmm. To add my $.02 about this.

The F4F was the underdog of the two, thats obvious. I personally like the P-40 better for its superior ammo arrangement (more of it and tighter gun config) and its a sexy aircraft, P-40B/C esspecially. Both made a HUGE impact on the pacific theatre, the P-40 even took on BF109s and Italian planes in the MTO. The F4F had a slightly bigger impact with its use with Carriers. Like others said it comes down to the pilot, you can put a newbie pilot in a Me262 and Erich Hartmann in a P-11 and Bubi will prolly win 98% of the time. The Wildcat fought against the Many zeros and oscars and still came out on top most of the time.

Sum it up. The P-40 is a better aircraft, and better looking. But the F4f had a bigger impact on the war.

[kool kitty89]

Actually (as I demonstrated earlier) the 4x gunned F4F (and FM) had more ammo than the 6x gunned P-40, but not by a whole lot. (but the F4F was certainly better in almost every case with the 4x arangement than the 6 as I discussed earlier)

I don't know about the 4x .50 armed P-40D (which may have had a larger capacity). Though the later 4x gunned models (lightend versions, mostly the early P-40N, and modified Sovied a/c) had the smaller capacity of 282 rpg.

[Bigxiko]

I believe the the F4F-3 Wildcat was a better plane
and i little bit faster

[FLYBOYJ]

Originally Posted by Bigxiko

I believe the the F4F-3 Wildcat was a better plane
and i little bit faster

You sure about that????

[drgondog]

Originally Posted by Th!rdeye

Hmm. To add my $.02 about this.

Sum it up. The P-40 is a better aircraft, and better looking. But the F4f had a bigger impact on the war.

I would tend to disagree - the P-40 flew for all the Allied Air Forces through 1944 and did a pretty good job. My perspective is that the F4F was huge in 1942 in context of Midway, Guadalcanal and Santa Cruz so it was crucial to Naval and USMC in 1942.. it also performed well early on in ETO/MTO naval ops at the same thime the P-40 was in the same area..

but the P-40 was fighting in China, Russia, North Africa/MTO, PTO (until P-38s started replacing for USAAF-but still in RAAF and RNZAF) and still in front line service in early to mid 1944 when all the F4F's were long out of active USN combat ops.

The P-40 might have been the only USAAF with the only air to air ratio less than 1:1 against both the LW and IJN Zeros. I haven't been able to prove it was less than 1:1 against the Zero but I believe JoeB has a good perspective on it.

It clearly was not as good as the Fw 190 or Me 109 either and when they were fighting each other in 1942-1943, the LW had a huge edge in experience.

[renrich]

The P40 and F4F in many ways may be for the US the two most underappreciated major players as far as fighters are concerned in WW2. They both took losses on the first day of the war for the US(the F4F by 'friendly" fire) and they were both still operational on the last day, I think.

[MacArther]

mid 1944 when all the F4F's were long out of active USN combat ops.

Nope, the FM-2s and FM-1s were still carrying on the F4F's legacy all the way until VJ day...

[drgondog]

Originally Posted by MacArther

Nope, the FM-2s and FM-1s were still carrying on the F4F's legacy all the way until VJ day...

I stand corrected - I forgot about the escort carriers..having said that, do you have any significant examples of F4F air battles from early 1944 forward?

Could we say that the F4F/FM1 and 2 'left the mainstream as an air superiority fighter in 1944?' when it was replaced by F6F?

Ditto the P-40 when replaced by P-47 (primarily) for all US units and continued through the end of the war with various Allied AF?

[MacArther]

having said that, do you have any significant examples of F4F air battles from early 1944 forward?

Could we say that the F4F/FM1 and 2 'left the mainstream as an air superiority fighter in 1944?' when it was replaced by F6F?

No air battles from me, because I lack the information on battles in the pacific for the most part. I am good with technical stuff, not so much the battles.

Yeah, not mainstream, but don't tell that to the guys using it on the Escort and some light carriers. Also, if I remember correctly, the FM series had a better cruising and top speed, so it was better equipped to fight the later Japanese planes. I think there's a "Dogfight" episode dealing with Kamikazes where one FM2 breaks up a much larger formation of Vals, but I'm not positive.

[renrich]

Bill, it seems like I remember the FM2s engaging kamikazes off of jeep carriers late in the war and they were also in use for anti sub work off of CVEs. In fact, I was surprised when I saw the number of air to air kills the FM2 had. The F4F type had 1408 kills in the Pacific which was surprising with the P38 having 1700 and the P47 having 697.

[kool kitty89]

HoHun, could you post a comparson with the F4F-3's performance chart as well? (like you did in the Spit/Seafire Vs. Zero thread)