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| Polls Polls and discussion on their results. |
| View Poll Results: The Best Ace??? | |||
| Ivan Kozhedub |     | 29 | 11.93% |
| Erich Hartmann |    | 175 | 72.02% |
| Constantine Cantacuzine |    | 12 | 4.94% |
| Richard Bong |    | 27 | 11.11% |
| Voters: 243. You may not vote on this poll | |||
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07-30-2004, 12:57 AM
| #1 |
| Minister of Whoopass   Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Long Island Native in Mississippi
Posts: 18,464
| The Greatest Fighter Pilot in WW II??? There are many many names that can be included here... What is the criteria for this list??? Kills??? Ability??? Reputation??? Tactical Pioneers??? Calibre of Enemy??? Ivan Kozhedub Alexandr Pokryshkin David McCampbell Richard Bong Francis Gabreski Thomas McGuire Greg Boyington James Johnson Brendan Finucane Marmaduke Pattle Adolph Malan Tetsuzo Iwamoto Hiroyoshi Nishizawa Shoichi Sugita Eino Juutilainen Hans Wind Prince Constantine Cantacuzine Erich Hartmann Gerhard Barkhorn Guenther Rall Otto Kittel Those are just some of the names i can think of... There may be others u guys have in mind... The 4 that stand out for me are Ivan Kozhedub, Prince Constantine Cantacuzine, Erich Hartmann, and Richard Bong... The Best??? Probably Kozhedub... Tough call...
__________________  My IL2 Video Tribute to My Grandfather: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HtzN5RuNNJk My 1/32nd Rendition of His Corsair: http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/2-p...3-a-20416.html |
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07-30-2004, 07:34 AM
| #2 |
| Minister of Whoopass Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Long Island Native in Mississippi
Posts: 18,464
| Russian Ace of WW11, Ivan Kozhedub (62 Confirmed Kills )was the leading Soviet and Allied Ace of WWII. Flying mainly the Lavochkin La-7 fighter aircraft, he carried out 330 sorries, was involved in 120 aerial combats and was credited with 62 confirmed victories. Earning the nickname "Ivan the Terrible", he was the only Soviet pilot to shoot down a Messerschmitt Me-262 jet fighter. Ivan was one of only two Soviet fighter pilots to be awarded the Gold Star(Hero of the Soviet Union) three times during World War II... It is particularly noteworthy that he required only 27 encounters to pile up his kills during the course of 146 sorties, 90 of which were escorts, 39 ground force cover, 9 armed reconnaissance and 8 scrambles... On September 22 he took off with Lejtenant Sharapov on a patrol and engaged two gaggles of Fw 190 fighter-bombers comprising of 4-8 aircraft each and shot down two of them in quick succession opening fire at 150 meters. He added another of these on January 16, 1945 while victory number 50 came on February 10... On this day Kozhedub was carrying out a free hunt with Major Titarenko as his number two in the vicinity of the Oder River, two German fighters being seen, and Kozhedub shot down one of these. The enemy pilot made a forced landing in his crippled aircraft in a pasture and became a prisoner. It was discovered that he was an ace with eight victories but his identity has unfortunately not been established. Two days later he was off on another free hunt with Lejtenant Gromakovskij flying wing to him and while sweeping over the Konitz area they spotted 18 Fw 190s fighter bombers flying at 400 meters. They immediately swept down and Kozhedub opened fire on "tail end Charlie," seeing hits exploding all over him and pieces flying off in all directions whereupon he spun into the ground in a solid sheet of flame. He then destroyed two more in quick succession which crashed 10-12 km southwest of Konitz. Gromakovskij shot another off Kozhedub's tail for his second kill of the day... Kozhedub is believed to have shot down one of the first Messerschmitt Me-262 jets to be encountered on Eastern Front during February but the date for this remains dubious. The date given by Kozhedub himself is the 19th while others are suggesting the 15th or 24th of February....
__________________ My IL2 Video Tribute to My Grandfather: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HtzN5RuNNJk My 1/32nd Rendition of His Corsair: http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/2-p...3-a-20416.html |
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07-30-2004, 11:01 AM
| #3 |
| Senior Member  Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 11,978
  | I'm going to go with Erich Hartmann, for kills alone.
__________________ "When you go home tomorrow, don't expect anyone to know what you have been through. Even if they did know, most people probably wouldn't care anyway. Some of you may get the medals you deserve, many more of you will not. But remember this, all of you are now members of the front-line club, and that is the most exclusive club in the world." - Lt. Col. Matthew Maer CO 1st Battalion, the Princess of Wale's Royal Regiment. Camp Abu Naji, Oct. 2004  To those in that club. |
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07-30-2004, 11:25 AM
| #4 |
| Member Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 76
| That's my vote as well. 352 and you don't have to say any more. |
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07-30-2004, 12:11 PM
| #5 |
| Senior Member  Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 19,945
| but as was said, you might not look for kills when looking for a great pilot................
__________________  "Reminds me of the time I sank the Tirpitz" comments a Spitfire pilot, "One pass of course, old boy." |
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07-30-2004, 12:25 PM
| #6 |
| Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 11,978
| But I am, over 300 is amazing. Just to have the mental durability to go through that alone is enough for me to call him the best pilot.
__________________ "When you go home tomorrow, don't expect anyone to know what you have been through. Even if they did know, most people probably wouldn't care anyway. Some of you may get the medals you deserve, many more of you will not. But remember this, all of you are now members of the front-line club, and that is the most exclusive club in the world." - Lt. Col. Matthew Maer CO 1st Battalion, the Princess of Wale's Royal Regiment. Camp Abu Naji, Oct. 2004 To those in that club. |
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07-30-2004, 12:27 PM
| #7 |
| Member Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 76
| Does a "not-great" pilot could score more than 300? |
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07-30-2004, 12:30 PM
| #8 |
| Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 11,978
| He was a crap pilot, he just scored 350+ by complete luck. 
__________________ "When you go home tomorrow, don't expect anyone to know what you have been through. Even if they did know, most people probably wouldn't care anyway. Some of you may get the medals you deserve, many more of you will not. But remember this, all of you are now members of the front-line club, and that is the most exclusive club in the world." - Lt. Col. Matthew Maer CO 1st Battalion, the Princess of Wale's Royal Regiment. Camp Abu Naji, Oct. 2004 To those in that club. |
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07-30-2004, 12:33 PM
| #9 |
| Member Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 76
| And survived the war with luck only? Quite unbelievable, isn't it? |
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07-30-2004, 12:47 PM
| #10 |
| Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 19,945
| did i say that 300+ kills doesn't make you a good pilot??
__________________ "Reminds me of the time I sank the Tirpitz" comments a Spitfire pilot, "One pass of course, old boy." |
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07-30-2004, 01:01 PM
| #11 |
| Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 11,978
| You nearly did.
__________________ "When you go home tomorrow, don't expect anyone to know what you have been through. Even if they did know, most people probably wouldn't care anyway. Some of you may get the medals you deserve, many more of you will not. But remember this, all of you are now members of the front-line club, and that is the most exclusive club in the world." - Lt. Col. Matthew Maer CO 1st Battalion, the Princess of Wale's Royal Regiment. Camp Abu Naji, Oct. 2004 To those in that club. |
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07-30-2004, 01:11 PM
| #12 |
| Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 2,512
| No one has mentioned the best. Hans-Joachim Marseille, the Star of Africa. 158 kills - all against the Western Allies (considerably tougher than the Russian opponents Hartmann faced) and the highest of any pilot against the Western Allies. 154 of those kills were against fighter aircraft. At the time of his death, Erich Hartmann had exactly 0 kills. How many would this guy have ended up with if his 'chute had openned?
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07-30-2004, 01:43 PM
| #13 |
| Member Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 76
| Marseille was a very good pilot. He took all these Tomahawks, Hurricanes & Spitfires out of these so easily! |
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07-30-2004, 05:50 PM
| #14 |
| Minister of Whoopass Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Long Island Native in Mississippi
Posts: 18,464
| LG that was some great info that I was not aware of, and that does not happen very often.. Very good post my man...
__________________ My IL2 Video Tribute to My Grandfather: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HtzN5RuNNJk My 1/32nd Rendition of His Corsair: http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/2-p...3-a-20416.html |
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07-30-2004, 10:44 PM
| #15 |
| Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 2,512
| Here's some more interesting facts about Marseille. He once scored 17 victories in one day (3 missions scoring 4, 8, and 5 kills). One time he managed to shot down 6 fighters in a mere 7 minutes. Perhaps most impressive, on one mission his cannon jammed on the opening burst. He went on to down 5 fighters with just the two machine guns (he was flying a 109F meaning two 7.92mm weapons). Upon returning to base, his armorers found must of the ammo unused. This guy could shoot!
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