Me262 vs. P-80 (5 Viewers)

P-80 v Me-262?


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Well, I may admit that there might be another possibility, too:
The engine was testbenched, overrewd and it blasted away. Our records don´t confirm this version (since we have proof that V-1 and V-2 were lost during bombing raids) but it is possible, yes.
Technically, the BMW-018 was well able to exceed 7.000 lbs of static thrust (diameter: 1250 mm, compression rate 7 to one, 12 stage axial compressor, three stage turbine combined with a very high airflow could well result in 3.500 Kp at 6.000 rpm), the Spitfire, however, was unable to exceed 1000 mp/h, we don´t need a proof here.The Nene was testbenched in october 44 and our records confirm that it eventually exceeded 5.000 lbs of thrust in early 45 on the testbench.
 
I must say it shouldn´t play any role here, since the BMW-018 was unable to be fitted into a Me-262 airframe.
I checked out the max speed of ww2 variants once more.
The Me-262 C1a was about 975 Km/h ~ 608 mp/h
Me-262 C-2b was 950 + Km/h, 593+ mp/h
Me-262 C3 -unknown, prototype did not fly
It would be helpful to duoblecheck the performances with other sources, so any help would be fine.
(source: J. Dressel/M. Griehl: Die deutschen Raketenflugzeuge 1939-1945 (Augsburg 1995), page 101.)
 
That is pretty much the info I have. However I believe the Me-262C's could only achieve that high speed with the Walter Rocket that was installed in the tail. The design was meant to recieve an extraordinary climb rate so as to reach the bombers. It was a point defence interceptor.
 
That´s my understanding, too. There was enough fuel to operate for around 20-26 min in case of the -C1a with a max climb of 2,2 min to 10.000m altitude. In the end that´s more than the Me-163 B had but too less to be used for anything except point defense as you said.
 
Yes. 20 min is the maximum flight time for full power (jet engines) at sea level. The rocket fuel was burned out after a max of 4-6 min. So it could be used to climb and accelerate. I always disliked that mixture of high volatile rocket fuel and jet fuel. Fast climbing, rocket-jet propelled interceptors did got out of use after the wide distribution of jet engines with afterburner.
A Me-262 with Jumo-004-E or F would be more wise.
 
In case of the Me-163 B I would say no (probably).
The fuselage was too short and the shift of cg with an over 1000 lbs
heavier engine would render the airframe uncontrollable.
The lack of a useful landing gear is also problematic.
A stretched airframe (Me-163 C/D/Me-263) is more reasonable.
Actually were have been several projects by Dr. Lippisch to
replace the rocket egnine with a BMW-003 or Jumo-004. In the end he transformed the Me-263 and He-162 into a useful airframe, Lippisch P-15. The front fuselage, including cockpit section and weaponry would have been taken from the He-162 A, the wings from the Me-263. The rear fuselage and the wingroots with air intake would have been needed to be the only new components. A HeS011 engine should give it a speed of around 625 mp/h (calculated according to the maths of march 45*).
You could also replace it with a BMW-003 E, saving over 1000 lbs of weight (for a reduced top speed of around 570 mp/h). Thrust to weight ratio, wingload and speed would have been excellent, as would the handling according to the Me-263 glider tests. Beside of Mock ups and wind tunnel models there was nothing left.
I expect that the plane could be realized pretty soon by overtaking of most parts from other serial build planes.

*) it wasn´t until early 45 that german methmatics developed a solution to calculate speeds at transsonic speeds correctly
 
very interesting to hear your thoughts on that, you're right you'd baisically be sitting on the jet engine so the power to weight ratio would be great, not sure about fuel though :lol:
 
the f80 has to be the one as it morphed into the T33 or TB1rd and its still going strong something that just can't be said about the 262 it spent its last days as a squadron hack or basic ecm machine
 

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i hardly think that's the -262's fault, the F-80 evolved into other machines because it was in a country where it could, the -262 could ahve been developed more, but it was in a country that lost the war, people learnt from her, but they weren't gonna carry on developing her, although the Czechs did a bit i think.........
 

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