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05-08-2004, 11:08 PM
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#136 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 12,061
Country:  | Well said Lightning Guy, although there were several raids that had more of an effect than others. The Dambusters being one of them...
__________________ "When you go home tomorrow, don't expect anyone to know what you have been through. Even if they did know, most people probably wouldn't care anyway. Some of you may get the medals you deserve, many more of you will not. But remember this, all of you are now members of the front-line club, and that is the most exclusive club in the world." - Lt. Col. Matthew Maer CO 1st Battalion, the Princess of Wale's Royal Regiment. Camp Abu Naji, Oct. 2004  To those in that club. | 
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05-08-2004, 11:21 PM
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#137 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 2,512
| I would agree with that. I would count the Ploesti raid in that group too. Looking back, it seems rather silly that both the British and the Americans really thought that spectacular raids like these would be enough to end the war.
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05-09-2004, 01:29 PM
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#138 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 12,061
Country: | Yes, but it's a lot easier for us to say it now since we've got the whole war in the past.
__________________ "When you go home tomorrow, don't expect anyone to know what you have been through. Even if they did know, most people probably wouldn't care anyway. Some of you may get the medals you deserve, many more of you will not. But remember this, all of you are now members of the front-line club, and that is the most exclusive club in the world." - Lt. Col. Matthew Maer CO 1st Battalion, the Princess of Wale's Royal Regiment. Camp Abu Naji, Oct. 2004 To those in that club. | |
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05-09-2004, 01:36 PM
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#139 | | Master of Ewes
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 19,959
Country: | there are definatly some raids that stand out above the rest, most of them involving low level bombing...............
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"Reminds me of the time I sank the Tirpitz" comments a Spitfire pilot, "One pass of course, old boy." | |
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05-09-2004, 07:52 PM
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#140 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 12,061
Country: | Amiens...
__________________ "When you go home tomorrow, don't expect anyone to know what you have been through. Even if they did know, most people probably wouldn't care anyway. Some of you may get the medals you deserve, many more of you will not. But remember this, all of you are now members of the front-line club, and that is the most exclusive club in the world." - Lt. Col. Matthew Maer CO 1st Battalion, the Princess of Wale's Royal Regiment. Camp Abu Naji, Oct. 2004 To those in that club. | |
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05-10-2004, 12:07 AM
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#141 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 2,512
| And insanely high loss rates . . .
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05-10-2004, 11:56 AM
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#142 | | Senior Member
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Posts: 12,061
Country: | Schweinfurt (sp?) That's what you get for not believing in the British code breakers..Black Thursday.
__________________ "When you go home tomorrow, don't expect anyone to know what you have been through. Even if they did know, most people probably wouldn't care anyway. Some of you may get the medals you deserve, many more of you will not. But remember this, all of you are now members of the front-line club, and that is the most exclusive club in the world." - Lt. Col. Matthew Maer CO 1st Battalion, the Princess of Wale's Royal Regiment. Camp Abu Naji, Oct. 2004 To those in that club. | |
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05-10-2004, 01:50 PM
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#143 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 2,512
| I believe that's right. I was pointing out that low-level bombing (at least with heavy bombers) usually resulted in totally unacceptable loss rates.
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05-10-2004, 04:28 PM
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#144 | | Master of Ewes
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 19,959
Country: | it depends, like you say, it you were in a mossie, you would be pretty safe, if you were in a lancaster, there were quite heavy losses, like the dambusters, 19 aircraft left, 8 didn't come back.................
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"Reminds me of the time I sank the Tirpitz" comments a Spitfire pilot, "One pass of course, old boy." | |
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05-10-2004, 06:39 PM
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#145 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Saco, MAINE!!!!
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Country:  | It was low leavel with bombers not for that bit. Polesti was a great idea, but the B-24s were just not for the 1000 ft hight. Now if they could have made a heavy that operated that low, it might be interesting.
But at the time planners thought the raid could have a great and devistating impact, well a few raids latter they were right.
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05-10-2004, 07:02 PM
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#146 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 12,061
Country: | The Mosquito was the best low-level bomber, a heavy at low altitude is really risky because of its size, and speed (or lack of). The Dambusters raid is a good example of heavy bombers in low with devestating effect, but high losses.
Amiens is a great example of the ideal aircraft, doing one of the best bomb jobs of the war. They were flying under 20 ft, that's lower than the wall they were going to hit.
They dropped their bombs and had to pull up get over the wall. One navigator even said he looked up to see a German sentry looking down on him... 
Briefing for the B-17s 'Target for today: Bremen ball bearing factory'
Briefing for the Mosquitos 'Target for today: Amiens prison, west wall and sentry garrison building'
__________________ "When you go home tomorrow, don't expect anyone to know what you have been through. Even if they did know, most people probably wouldn't care anyway. Some of you may get the medals you deserve, many more of you will not. But remember this, all of you are now members of the front-line club, and that is the most exclusive club in the world." - Lt. Col. Matthew Maer CO 1st Battalion, the Princess of Wale's Royal Regiment. Camp Abu Naji, Oct. 2004 To those in that club. | |
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05-11-2004, 12:00 AM
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#147 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 2,512
| B-25's were flying that low in the Pacific. There is one story about a B-25 pilot who drug his tail bomber through the sand on some island for several hundred feet. He claimed that he had to fly slow so to see in the windows of the Japanese bunkers so he'd know what to shoot at!
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05-11-2004, 07:24 AM
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#148 | | Master of Ewes
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 19,959
Country: | don't forget the dambusters bomber that lost his upkepp in the sea and got his tail gunner wet, that's low............
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"Reminds me of the time I sank the Tirpitz" comments a Spitfire pilot, "One pass of course, old boy." | |
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05-11-2004, 12:07 PM
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#149 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 2,512
| Yes that was very low. But (and I think the records point to this) low-level bombing in a heavy bomber wasn't a good way to stay alive.
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05-11-2004, 01:15 PM
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#150 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 12,061
Country: | Yes, it wasn't the best of ideas.
__________________ "When you go home tomorrow, don't expect anyone to know what you have been through. Even if they did know, most people probably wouldn't care anyway. Some of you may get the medals you deserve, many more of you will not. But remember this, all of you are now members of the front-line club, and that is the most exclusive club in the world." - Lt. Col. Matthew Maer CO 1st Battalion, the Princess of Wale's Royal Regiment. Camp Abu Naji, Oct. 2004 To those in that club. | |
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