What was the best Italian fighter

Soren · 06-07-2007, 03:42 PM

It was solved in the Re.2005 which could be dived at around 900 km/h without any problems.

Soundbreaker Welch? · 06-07-2007, 04:08 PM

The Spitfire might have been hard to build for the British, but I think the building a Hurricane was longer and harder, since it was made of metal and wood.

mosquitoman · 06-07-2007, 06:31 PM

Spit took longer because of the wings if I remember correctly

Parmigiano · 06-08-2007, 05:03 AM

Yes, Spit was a handful to build, but with the proper investments Vickers could achieve a good production rate.

I suspect than rather than the 'complications' of construction the problem of the G55 was that it was not conceived to be built in subassemblies by separate factories like the 190 and the 109.
If the Germans still had the possibility to setup a big production plant, building the G55 in big numbers would have been possible at an acceptable cost.
Fact is that in 1943-44 such factories were out of the picture in the Reich, too vulnerable to bombing.

Soren · 06-08-2007, 05:58 AM

Although certainly great fighters, building the G-55 or Re.2005 instead of the Bf-109 wouldn't have made any difference. The Bf-109 did alot better than most fighters could under the same circumstances - the Germans and Finnish clearly demonstrated this.

Fact is that the Bf-109 was the best fighter of WWII when handled by an experienced pilot. - The number of aces this a/c produced is simply astounding.

Soundbreaker Welch? · 09-17-2007, 07:23 PM

Maybe, but if more of the Allied Pilots had stayed in the service as long as the Germans had to, they wouldn't have ended up with higher scores than they did. But I admit, the Russians scores agains't the Germans never got as high, even though they also served longer than the British and Americans.

ToughOmbre · 09-17-2007, 07:34 PM

Primo Carnera

The Basket · 09-17-2007, 08:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soren

Fact is that the Bf-109 was the best fighter of WWII when handled by an experienced pilot. - The number of aces this a/c produced is simply astounding.

Dont buy that. The number of aces is not important because German pilots flew more missions. A British or American pilot would also have had high kill scores too over the Eastern front in same conditions.

The Bf 109 was the most important but not the best German fighter. IMHO the Fw 190 was better and the He 100 potentially would have been far superior.

Best Italian fighter for me was the Macchi mc 202. The best available in numbers when needed.

The Spitfire came about due to the Schnieder trophy races in which the Italians were the main rivals. It follows that the Italians could have had thier own Spit in the same timeframe.

Maybe I is thinking for another thread...the best Italian motorcycle marque! MV Agusta! The Italians can build the best when they put the effort in. Ducati in MotoGP is a good example.

Glider · 09-18-2007, 03:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soren

Although certainly great fighters, building the G-55 or Re.2005 instead of the Bf-109 wouldn't have made any difference. The Bf-109 did alot better than most fighters could under the same circumstances - the Germans and Finnish clearly demonstrated this.

Fact is that the Bf-109 was the best fighter of WWII when handled by an experienced pilot. - The number of aces this a/c produced is simply astounding.

I believe that the Italian planes would have made a big difference had they been available over the 109.
There were already well armed and able to take on the heavy bombers. As we all know the 109 had to be upgraded at a cost to its performance leaving it vulnerable to the escorting fighters.
The Italian aircraft ready equipped with the 3 x 20 would have maintained their performance and been a significant threat to the escorts.

DerAdlerIstGelandet · 09-18-2007, 12:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Basket

Dont buy that. The number of aces is not important because German pilots flew more missions. A British or American pilot would also have had high kill scores too over the Eastern front in same conditions.

Not argueing with you here because I agree somewhat with you but there were plenty of Luftwaffe Aces on the Western Front who scored over 100 kills and several that scored over 200 and they flew only on the Western Front or in the Med or N. Africa.

Soundbreaker Welch? · 09-18-2007, 02:50 PM

Luftwaffe pilots might have been trained more to survive in a loner situation, perhaps?

Glider · 09-18-2007, 04:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DerAdlerIstGelandet

Not argueing with you here because I agree somewhat with you but there were plenty of Luftwaffe Aces on the Western Front who scored over 100 kills and several that scored over 200 and they flew only on the Western Front or in the Med or N. Africa.

I admit that I always believed that only a few scored 100+ against western airforces and none of the 200+ scores were only against the west.

Is there anywhere I can go for a breakdown so I can add it to my favourites
Its easy to find a list of aces but I haven't been able to find anything that breaks it down into area of conflict.
Thanking you in advance

Focus_in · 11-14-2007, 10:16 AM

2005 for me too.

But as a personal favorite, the Saetta.
Just has a charm to it.

DerAdlerIstGelandet · 11-14-2007, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glider

I admit that I always believed that only a few scored 100+ against western airforces and none of the 200+ scores were only against the west.

Is there anywhere I can go for a breakdown so I can add it to my favourites
Its easy to find a list of aces but I haven't been able to find anything that breaks it down into area of conflict.
Thanking you in advance

This is an excellent website here. Our very own Erich has even helped on it I believe.
Kacha`s Luftwaffe Page

I did however make a slight mistake now that I look back on the website. There were no pilots that scored 200 or more only on the western front.

I apologize for this mistake.

Heinz "Pritzel" Bär who scored a total of 221 kills in WW2 had 125 on the Western Front and 96 on the Eastern Front. He is the one that I was claiming 200+ kills on the Western Front.

There were a total of 8 pilots who shot down 100+ aircraft on the Western Front and they are (total kills is in parenthases)

1. Hans-Joachim "Jochen" Marseille - 158 (15

2. Heinz "Pritzel" Bär - 125 (221)
3. Kurt Bühligen - 112 (112)
4. Adolf "Dolfo" Galland - 104 (104)
5. Joachim Müncheberg - 102 (135)
6. Werner Schroer - 102 (114)
7. Egon Mayer - 102 (102)
8. Josef "Pips" Priller - 101 (101)

In addition to that there were:

7 aces that scored between 70 and 99 kills on the Western Front.

22 aces that scored between 50 and 69 kills on the Western Front.

Either way still very impressive.

parsifal · 05-18-2008, 11:20 AM

Ive read in various places that the italians were never prepred to compromise the performance of their fighters, in the name of firepower, to the same extent as the LW was. Me 109g I have read were severely degraded in performance and handling because of the very heavy armament carried. Whilst italian Fighters also increased their firepower, it was never to the same extremes as the LW. Is this true, or is yet another fabrication???

The RA did operate significant numbers of Me 109s from the beginning of 1943 onwards. They could no more redress the allied air superiority that had been won by the end of 1942 any more than the home grown aircraft