Who won Vietnam?!?

abhiginimav · 01-02-2007, 07:10 PM

Disregarding what history says, be honest in this one, not patriotic, who do you think won the vietnam war?

syscom3 · 01-02-2007, 07:30 PM

Still too early to tell.

Ask the same question in a decade.

abhiginimav · 01-02-2007, 07:33 PM

personally, i think the NVA were just too cunning for the USA , Quote from film platoon "we been kicking everyones asses for so long, maybe its time we got ours kicked" - american soldier whos name i forgot lol good film though...although the plane shots from the F-5 doing there bombing runs were a bit crap...it was a model on a string by the looks of it.....

mkloby · 01-02-2007, 07:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by abhiginimav

personally, i think the NVA were just too cunning for the USA , Quote from film platoon "we been kicking everyones asses for so long, maybe its time we got ours kicked" - american soldier whos name i forgot lol good film though...although the plane shots from the F-5 doing there bombing runs were a bit crap...it was a model on a string by the looks of it.....

We never got our asses kicked militarily, on the contrary US military crushed the vietnamese in virtually ever engagement. However, to forego the Clauswitz cliche, it was ultimately a political defeat.

abhiginimav · 01-02-2007, 07:40 PM

good reply, however i feel that the NVA put up a big fight, although they didnt win, they were a formidable foe. i think that the mistake was underestimating the vietcong. Yes they won the battles, but do you think america lost the war?

FLYBOYJ · 01-02-2007, 08:18 PM

Militarily the US beat the crap out of the NVA - Politically the whole campaign was a failure, plain and simple...

The NVA launched 2 major campaigns against South Vietnam and the American forces serving there. The US fought like it had one arm tied behind it's back and still easily defeated both offensives.

BTW on the Poll you should have "none of the above"

Erich · 01-02-2007, 09:14 PM

I could make numerous comments that would make your blood chill but I will refrain for personal reasons...........

think about it, we were in their backyard, their playground, did we ever really stand a chance when our own govt was not behind our existance there 100 % ?

We kicked the NVA just like we put a bullet in the forehead of nearly every Chinese we engaged at any range.

had we not pulled out and we able to bring in some big heavy firepower which we had, Hanoi would of been creamed off the face of the earth. Also to remember we were still not on very good terms with the Soviets during those shaking and world changing times

in essence nobody won, that is why the killing fields are mentioned in literature, a complete waste of humanity

davparlr · 01-02-2007, 09:54 PM

Initially, an idiotic, cowardly administration wanting to run the war from the White House, then a traitorous American news media, succeded in turning a proud and victorious military into demoralized, population hating draft military and handed the war to the NVA.

Crow · 01-03-2007, 03:50 AM

The North Vietnamese obviously.

wars are not won by adding up who was victorious in the most battles but by which state withdraws from the conflict. German soldiers killed Soviet soldiers in their millions yet they still ended up buried in the ruins of Berlin 1945.

Their was never the slightest chance of 'our' side winning, and if I`m going to get flamed by someone, at least let it be by someone who was there as well and has a different opinion, not just what you`ve read about. some of the stuff done their would give you sickening nightmares for the rest of your life.

like it has to me.

102first_hussars · 01-03-2007, 04:01 AM

If the americans had of stayed in even after Tet, the Veitnam war would have been a stalemate, the americans would never have won or even stabilized the region but the NVA or the VC never would have militarily been able to beat the Americans

plan_D · 01-03-2007, 04:23 AM

You seem to forget that the South opposed the North as well, and since the military victories in Vietnam were much more substantial than those in Korea it seems likely that the Communist insurgency couldn't have been defeated soundly.

The British did it in their "Vietnam" - so there's no reason that the U.S couldn't have done it in Vietnam. Given the proper political support, of course.

Gnomey · 01-03-2007, 06:22 AM

Agreed pD, if the American media and politicians had been 100% behind the war in Vietnam then the outcome could of been different than it was (similar situation as exists in Korea today?). The NVA couldn't defeat the USA militarily (but with the help of the American media could politically). Overall the war was a stalemate (and would of continued that way with the NVA being more of an insurgency than anything else). Had the support been their the US would of probably won (as they were doing before the pullout)

FLYBOYJ · 01-03-2007, 06:29 AM

South Vietnam initially stood as a nation, it took nearly 2 years for the NVA to eventually overrun the south and they did this at a time when they know the US would not come back to stop the onslaught. When the US pulled out there was a cease fire and the mission was in tact.

plan_D · 01-03-2007, 06:32 AM

I meant the Communist insurgency could have been beaten soundly. Sorry!

mkloby · 01-03-2007, 06:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crow

The North Vietnamese obviously.

wars are not won by adding up who was victorious in the most battles but by which state withdraws from the conflict. German soldiers killed Soviet soldiers in their millions yet they still ended up buried in the ruins of Berlin 1945.

Their was never the slightest chance of 'our' side winning, and if I`m going to get flamed by someone, at least let it be by someone who was there as well and has a different opinion, not just what you`ve read about. some of the stuff done their would give you sickening nightmares for the rest of your life.

like it has to me.

Crow - you're definitely right in the fact that war must lead to a political victory. The only shot for victory was to establish an independent and secure South Vietnam that would be able to sustain and defend itself against a hostile North. I believe it's the latter part of that, which may have been impossible - and that's the aspect that many people are paralleling to Iraq (although not vice North Vietnam!)

On the 2nd part - things done in every war are going to be sickening. Not to diminish the reality of it, but I think that's one thing that will always remain constant in warfare. I'll find that out firsthand soon enough...