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11-07-2005, 03:57 PM
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#61 | | Der Crewchief
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany
Posts: 30,270
Country:  | pD the F-14 could reach Mach 2.2+, I dont believe the Lightning was faster than the Tomcat. With its Pheonix's it could take anything out before the Lightning could.
__________________  US Army Blackhawk Crewchief 2000-2006 Classic ww2aircraft.net quotes: fly boy said: "isn't that the first jet bomber? becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles" "wait what ok who made the b-2 crash come on people that messed up its a b-2" "ah yes the mistel those things are so annoying is games and in real life" | 
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11-07-2005, 04:02 PM
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#62 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Orange County, CA
Posts: 8,477
| I wonder if the Lightnings had the radar and fire control needed to find and track very low flying aircraft.
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11-07-2005, 05:33 PM
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#63 | | Der Crewchief
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany
Posts: 30,270
Country: | That I am sure they did.
__________________ US Army Blackhawk Crewchief 2000-2006 Classic ww2aircraft.net quotes: fly boy said: "isn't that the first jet bomber? becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles" "wait what ok who made the b-2 crash come on people that messed up its a b-2" "ah yes the mistel those things are so annoying is games and in real life" | |
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11-07-2005, 05:52 PM
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#64 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: NIAGARA
Posts: 4,808
Country:  | unless the procedures have changed a lot the interceptor is usually vectored onto the target using awacs or ground based fighter cops (norad or ukadge) using data link and voice com being last option the a/c radar probably turned on during last part of intercept as to prevent detection by ecm (electro counter measures) guy on target a/c
The awacs has alook down capability and the ground based radar is supposededly able to detect a small object a low level at great distances over the horizon . the early interceptors (f101 104 F4) were easy to spot because of heavy smoke from engines was visable at a great distance .
it has been known for 2 engine interceptors to shut one engine down and go full on other cutting smoke to a minimum
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11-07-2005, 07:41 PM
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#65 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 12,061
Country:  | The Lightnings normally took off in twos. Ever heard of a doomsday scramble? Every single plane scrambled, went up, fired off missiles, came home, re-armed, re-fueled and back up again. The whole squadron could be up in about 20 minutes.
And the Red Top was designed for low-level nimble aircraft. It was perfectly capable at detecting low-level, and intercepting low-level targets.
Adler, if a Lightning caught and over-took a Concorde at 57,000 feet and Mach 2.2 while on stern intercept...it's going faster than Mach 2.2, don't yah think!?
__________________ "When you go home tomorrow, don't expect anyone to know what you have been through. Even if they did know, most people probably wouldn't care anyway. Some of you may get the medals you deserve, many more of you will not. But remember this, all of you are now members of the front-line club, and that is the most exclusive club in the world." - Lt. Col. Matthew Maer CO 1st Battalion, the Princess of Wale's Royal Regiment. Camp Abu Naji, Oct. 2004  To those in that club. | |
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11-07-2005, 07:49 PM
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#66 | | Der Crewchief
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany
Posts: 30,270
Country: | Yeah you got me there. Duh stupid me. I still believe that a Tomcat can fly faster than a Lighting and besides again a Pheonix can hit a target before a Lightning can. So my vote still goes for the Tomcat.
The F-15 also could outfly a Lightning.
Dont take me wrong I think the Lightning is a wonderful aircraft and one of the best intercepters ever built.
__________________ US Army Blackhawk Crewchief 2000-2006 Classic ww2aircraft.net quotes: fly boy said: "isn't that the first jet bomber? becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles" "wait what ok who made the b-2 crash come on people that messed up its a b-2" "ah yes the mistel those things are so annoying is games and in real life" | |
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11-07-2005, 07:53 PM
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#67 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: NIAGARA
Posts: 4,808
Country: | we called the doomsday scramble a flush it was fun to watch those big afterburners at night usually happened at night because of less congested airspace
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11-09-2005, 05:32 AM
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#68 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 12,061
Country: | Both the F-14 and F-15 failed to intercept the Concorde in the same circumstances as the Lightning. The official record for the Lightning was Mach 2.3, but that's the same record that said 60,000 feet.
The Lightning would rise to it's opponent and catch it before the other aircraft, it was so simple ...it was almost Russian! But ...at least it was built properly. 
__________________ "When you go home tomorrow, don't expect anyone to know what you have been through. Even if they did know, most people probably wouldn't care anyway. Some of you may get the medals you deserve, many more of you will not. But remember this, all of you are now members of the front-line club, and that is the most exclusive club in the world." - Lt. Col. Matthew Maer CO 1st Battalion, the Princess of Wale's Royal Regiment. Camp Abu Naji, Oct. 2004 To those in that club. | |
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11-09-2005, 10:59 AM
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#69 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: NIAGARA
Posts: 4,808
Country: | i think the concorde would be a pretty easy target immense heat source from those engines a head on attack is pretty common besides the f14,15 have bvr (beyond visual range) capability
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11-09-2005, 05:56 PM
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#70 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 12,061
Country: | The interception against the Concorde was a stern intercept, they were chasing it as it was flying away. The Concorde was at 57,000 feet and flying Mach 2.2 - the Lightning caught it, and over-took it!
__________________ "When you go home tomorrow, don't expect anyone to know what you have been through. Even if they did know, most people probably wouldn't care anyway. Some of you may get the medals you deserve, many more of you will not. But remember this, all of you are now members of the front-line club, and that is the most exclusive club in the world." - Lt. Col. Matthew Maer CO 1st Battalion, the Princess of Wale's Royal Regiment. Camp Abu Naji, Oct. 2004 To those in that club. | |
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11-10-2005, 06:55 AM
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#71 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: NIAGARA
Posts: 4,808
Country: | i guess that proves lightning was capable of ceiling higher then fl600 cuz it had to be going down hill to catch it also probably overhead the base because it sure would've been sucking back the fuel
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11-10-2005, 01:42 PM
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#72 | | Der Crewchief
Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ansbach, Germany
Posts: 30,270
Country: | No sorry, as was stated there the Lightning had to intercept its target. The Tomcat can hit the target before it even is in sight of it.
One reason and one reason alone. AIM-54 PHEONIX!
Sorry Plan_D but a Tomcat would out intercept a Lightening anyday.
__________________ US Army Blackhawk Crewchief 2000-2006 Classic ww2aircraft.net quotes: fly boy said: "isn't that the first jet bomber? becasue i have flown one in a flight sim before and i know how it handles" "wait what ok who made the b-2 crash come on people that messed up its a b-2" "ah yes the mistel those things are so annoying is games and in real life" | |
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11-10-2005, 06:03 PM
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#73 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 12,061
Country: | You obviously don't know how quickly a plane as fast as a Lightning can make up for deficiency in it's missiles range (which was 7 miles). The Lightning was up before the F-14, it was faster accelerating than the F-14 and was ultimately quicker than the Lightning. And it could fly higher than the F-14! Current standing at 88,000 feet for the Lightning.
__________________ "When you go home tomorrow, don't expect anyone to know what you have been through. Even if they did know, most people probably wouldn't care anyway. Some of you may get the medals you deserve, many more of you will not. But remember this, all of you are now members of the front-line club, and that is the most exclusive club in the world." - Lt. Col. Matthew Maer CO 1st Battalion, the Princess of Wale's Royal Regiment. Camp Abu Naji, Oct. 2004 To those in that club. | |
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11-10-2005, 06:23 PM
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#74 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Orange County, CA
Posts: 8,477
| But the Phoenix can intercept 100 miles out from launch.
If the F14 is catapult launched, it would be at firing altitude long before the Lightning was wheels up.
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11-10-2005, 06:46 PM
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#75 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 12,061
Country: | Read earlier in the thread ...land-based. Since the fact of the matter is the vast majority of interceptions took place from land-strips throughout Europe.
__________________ "When you go home tomorrow, don't expect anyone to know what you have been through. Even if they did know, most people probably wouldn't care anyway. Some of you may get the medals you deserve, many more of you will not. But remember this, all of you are now members of the front-line club, and that is the most exclusive club in the world." - Lt. Col. Matthew Maer CO 1st Battalion, the Princess of Wale's Royal Regiment. Camp Abu Naji, Oct. 2004 To those in that club. | |
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