British Debts

[FLYBOYJ]

Originally Posted by DerAdlerIstGelandet

Aw come on Joe, your Bark is worse than your bite...

....most of the time!

[Kilroy]

Originally Posted by Instal

The last thing I want to do with the following comments is to cast disparaging remarks to my friends south of the border but I have allways wondered about Britain owing money to the U.S. for WW2. I personally find it reprehensible that Britain would owe anyone anything for carrying the fight to the Nazi's particularly when the US had it's head in the sand. Profiting from someone who is fighting that kind of evil is just wrong. The British people suffered greatly from the war they should not be made to continue to suffer because they did the right thing. And ya ya ya I know they weren't the only ones to suffer.

Well if Britain and France had just stood up to Hitler in the thirties when they had the chance, the war in Europe might never have happened. At least as far as the Germans are concerned, the Russians on the other hand

[Instal]

You are correct but that is 20/20 heind sight. No one wanted another war after loosing so many in WW1 but it happened. Had Churchill been PM instead of Chamberlain WW2 would quite possibly have been avoided.

[Emac44]

I think as England being a future Ally to the US prior and during early part of WW2 is beholding to pay of the Debt to the US via Lend Lease. I will put it to a simplier terms. Say for example the US was a banking institution and England as a potential home builder borrowed money from the Bank this case being the USA. But Germany was trying to inhibit the purchase of the property that home buyer England was trying to purchase. France was also involved in the final purchasse by England but was stalling for reasons of her own. So England in desperation ended up seeking a cash advancements on building supplies from the Bank US but signed a promisiary note in this case Lend Lease to help fund Englands in her quest and repayment of debt was set at an Interest rate and over long period of time. But not all stockholders of US Bank (citizens) were happy about that England Home owner was granted a special loan by the US Bank President and members of the executive board and that the US Bank Stockholders didn't want to get involved in a England France German squabble over which the US Bank stockholders saw as none of their business. As it turned out the loan was approved England was abled to fund the necassary requirements she needed. France got over run by and occupied by a re energized Germany along with rest of Europe with the help of the Italians in some measure and England had to stand alone with her Commonwealth friends holding up brick work and panelling. Until the US Bank got actually involved in the whole building process directly by means of a Japanese take over bid elsewhere in the Pacific and Asia. But in this that the Bank US still was owed money from original debt England had signed previously in the intrim and at the interest rates set. And that US Bank Stockholder and investors had to have return on capital invested in first place with England when the building process was finally completed

I know I am trivializing Lend Lease with England and the US but looking at it as in business way of thinking and at a different angle the Debt being Lend Lease has to be repaid. You don't expect banks to lend money then forget the debt later when its inconvient to the borrower and hope the debt is forgiven later. I will have to side with the Americans on this one. US Tax Payers then and even now can't be expected to foot the bill. I hope what I have written makes sense at what I am trying to say on this debate

[Glider]

Originally Posted by Emac44

I know I am trivializing Lend Lease with England and the US but looking at it as in business way of thinking and at a different angle the Debt being Lend Lease has to be repaid. You don't expect banks to lend money then forget the debt later when its inconvient to the borrower and hope the debt is forgiven later. I will have to side with the Americans on this one. US Tax Payers then and even now can't be expected to foot the bill. I hope what I have written makes sense at what I am trying to say on this debate

You do realise I hope, that the bill has been repaid in full.

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Nice way to put it Emac!

[Emac44]

Originally Posted by Glider

You do realise I hope, that the bill has been repaid in full.

Yes I do Glider and I was using it as an example to the way I was thinking. And Adler I tried very hard not to trivialize the debate. And Glider I know it broke England for years and for many years I favoured that England didn't have to repay the debt until I began listening to the other side of the debate and realized US Citizens had to bare the cost until debt was paid. I thought long and hard about it Lend Lease and put different angles on it. And even though my sympathy laid with the British and Lend Lease etc. I came to realise there are no free lunches in this world and debts have to be repaid. Sorry Glider

[Glider]

If the French are making good noises to Bush maybe he will raise the issue of what France owes the USA.

Somehow I don't see that happening.

[Arsenal VG-33]

Originally Posted by Glider

If the French are making good noises to Bush maybe he will raise the issue of what France owes the USA.

Somehow I don't see that happening.

Well, before this descends into a predictable, "lets bash the French" thread, by the end of WWII, outstanding French debt (prewar purchases plus
lend-lease minus reverse lend-lease plus other loans) stood at some
$2bn. The Blum-Byrnes agreements (which you can look up for more detail)
wrote off the outstanding debt and added a new US loan instead. When De Gaulle became President in 1958, he insisted on financial
stabilization and in particular he wanted outstanding debts to the US
repaid, which was done in 1963. In short, The US felt that French participation in the defense of Europe against the Red Menace during the Cold War was better than a France struggling economically to repay war debts in full.

So on the one hand, France repaid its debt 40 years ago, but on the
other hand the amount to be repaid was far less than that owed by
Britain, so this doesn't really compare.

[Hobilar]

Originally Posted by Emac44

I know I am trivializing Lend Lease with England and the US but looking at it as in business way of thinking and at a different angle the Debt being Lend Lease has to be repaid. You don't expect banks to lend money then forget the debt later when its inconvient to the borrower and hope the debt is forgiven later. I will have to side with the Americans on this one. US Tax Payers then and even now can't be expected to foot the bill. I hope what I have written makes sense at what I am trying to say on this debate

Lets not forget that £300 Billion in Gold Bullion was shipped to the United States from Great Britain so that it would not fall into NAZI hands should the country be invaded. This plus other valuable assets more than compensated for British purchases during the war (mainly food, fuel and raw materials).

The idea that Great Britain owed money to the United States at the end of the war is utterly ludicrous. Great Britain had more than sufficient assets to pay for U.S. supplies.

The problem was that immediately hostilities ended, the Wall Street Bankers DEMANDED their money in cash. This money however was needed for the rebuilding of the British economy to a Peace-time situation (eg repairing damage cause by the enemy, modernizing industry, funding those matters that had been neglected because of the war such as the railways, hospitals and schools).

Hundreds of thousands of men were also returning home from the fighting services-All requiring homes and jobs.

Faced with this the Attlee Government was forced to appeal to the United States for financial assistance. An appeal that was initially refused by the Americans (though they later relented and allowed a financial loan (not nearly enough to cover requirements)). It was This loan that has recently been repaid (Not as many of todays Americans would suggest for Lend-Lease purchases).

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Originally Posted by Hobilar

Lets not forget that £300 Billion in Gold Bullion was shipped to the United States from Great Britain so that it would not fall into NAZI hands should the country be invaded. This plus other valuable assets more than compensated for British purchases during the war (mainly food, fuel and raw materials).

The idea that Great Britain owed money to the United States at the end of the war is utterly ludicrous. Great Britain had more than sufficient assets to pay for U.S. supplies.

The problem was that immediately hostilities ended, the Wall Street Bankers DEMANDED their money in cash. This money however was needed for the rebuilding of the British economy to a Peace-time situation (eg repairing damage cause by the enemy, modernizing industry, funding those matters that had been neglected because of the war such as the railways, hospitals and schools).

Hundreds of thousands of men were also returning home from the fighting services-All requiring homes and jobs.

Faced with this the Attlee Government was forced to appeal to the United States for financial assistance. An appeal that was initially refused by the Americans (though they later relented and allowed a financial loan (not nearly enough to cover requirements)). It was This loan that has recently been repaid (Not as many of todays Americans would suggest for Lend-Lease purchases).

As the money was rightfully demanded. If it had not been so as others have suggested it would have been the US citizen paying for it. That is not right.

[Instal]

Originally Posted by Hobilar

Lets not forget that £300 Billion in Gold Bullion was shipped to the United States from Great Britain so that it would not fall into NAZI hands should the country be invaded. This plus other valuable assets more than compensated for British purchases during the war (mainly food, fuel and raw materials).

The idea that Great Britain owed money to the United States at the end of the war is utterly ludicrous. Great Britain had more than sufficient assets to pay for U.S. supplies.

The problem was that immediately hostilities ended, the Wall Street Bankers DEMANDED their money in cash. This money however was needed for the rebuilding of the British economy to a Peace-time situation (eg repairing damage cause by the enemy, modernizing industry, funding those matters that had been neglected because of the war such as the railways, hospitals and schools).

Hundreds of thousands of men were also returning home from the fighting services-All requiring homes and jobs.

Faced with this the Attlee Government was forced to appeal to the United States for financial assistance. An appeal that was initially refused by the Americans (though they later relented and allowed a financial loan (not nearly enough to cover requirements)). It was This loan that has recently been repaid (Not as many of todays Americans would suggest for Lend-Lease purchases).

Hoilbar, was that $300 Billion kept by the U.S. or sent back?

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

No that 300 Billion went to paying off the debt.

[pbfoot]

the money was not sent to the US it was sent to canada where it was stored in the Sun Life Building in Montreal

[Instal]

And from there was it paid to the U.S. over time?