Canada's Shame

DerAdlerIstGelandet · 10-19-2007, 06:48 PM

Really are you sure about that? I am not saying you are wrong but the pay in the US Army sure as hell aint bad. As an E-5 who was married and on flight status I recieved a little over $2,000 every 2 weeks. Thats after taxes and that aint bad...

You guys may make more but I believe once your taxes come out you see less than our guys see because we pay less taxes. Just a theory of mine, correct me if I am wrong.

pbfoot · 10-19-2007, 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DerAdlerIstGelandet

Really are you sure about that? I am not saying you are wrong but the pay in the US Army sure as hell aint bad. As an E-5 who was married and on flight status I recieved a little over $2,000 every 2 weeks. Thats after taxes and that aint bad...

You guys may make more but I believe once your taxes come out you see less than our guys see because we pay less taxes. Just a theory of mine, correct me if I am wrong.

but thats about 5600canadian 5900us a month and it doesn't matter if your single or married thats the equivilant e5 with flight pay
Regular Force Non Commissioned Members (NCM) Rates

DerAdlerIstGelandet · 10-19-2007, 07:40 PM

Actually if you look at it, you dont really make more than the US Army.

I just checked out your Army's website and they have a link to the pay rates.

An E-5 makes 4797 Canadian Dollars which equals with todays exchange rate 4966 US Dollars. Average Federal Income Tax is 22 Percent which comes to a deduction of 1055 Canadian Dollars which comes out to a monthly salary of 3741 Canadian Dollars which equals 3873 US Dollars.

You guys are payed every 2 weeks as well which comes out to a salary of aprox: 1870.50 Canadian Dollars which equals to 1936.64 US Dollars. After taxes as I said I saw on average 2183 US Dollars which comes to 2108 Canadian Dollars and a monthly salary of 4366 US Dollars or 4216 Canadian Dollars.

Maestro · 10-19-2007, 08:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DerAdlerIstGelandet

I used to fly with a Canadian in the US Army. He served with me in Germany, Kosovo and Iraq and is now an Apache Pilot. Good guy and good friend. He said he joined the US Army because he wanted to be in a "real" military and actually do something.

Ah... You are so right. A few factors can explain that...

1a - Our politicians (since the end of the War of Korea) let down the army, cutting down it's budget every year. For that reason, we are about 30 years behind the US army on the technology side.

1b - Not only are we late on technology, but the equipment we already have is in bad shape... very bad shape. F-18s are rusty and falling apart, Sea Kings can't stay in the air, submarines catch fire... I once saw a Canadian tank with a cookie plate underneath to prevent oil from falling on the floor of the show room. There is also the malfunctionning weapons... Remember that anti-tank rocket ? You want me to use one of those ? No f*cking way !

2 - Actually, some (not all, fortunatly) of our commanding officers are brainwashed freaks (a little like De Gaulle was), running away when the bullets start to fly. The best example being General Romeo Dallaire, the Canadian commander of the peace keeping force in Rwanda, who let ten of his men (mostly, if not all of them, Belgians) being slaughtered there. Those poor blokes fought off the rebels as long as they could but had to surrender when they ran out of ammunitions. They were then beaten up to death with shovels and pickaxes. Making Dallaire look like a coward to the Belgians but was threated like a hero by our politicians (being awarded the Order of Canada and appointed as a senator).

3 - Most of the guys (and gals) enlisting in the Canadian army today (I know some of them personnally), go there to "travel around the world" or to "help peoples who need it". They forgot the main point of being a soldier : killing. Basically, a soldier is a killer hired by a country to fight off an other one. This is very disturbing... because you don't know if the soldier next to you is one of them. Breaking down in tears as soon as someone starts shooting at them. Would you like to sit beside one of those ? Certainly not me !

Rule 1 : If you wanna travel around the world, enlist in Air Canada. Not in the Canadian Army !

Rule 2 : If you wanna help peoples who need it, enlist in the Salvation Army. Not in the Canadian Army !

That's the main reasons why I won't enlist in the Canadian Army unless I'm forced to.

Hey ! I got an idea ! Why not combine the US and Canadian Army ? The Canadian Army could become a kind of National Guard like the US have in some states.

pbfoot · 10-19-2007, 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DerAdlerIstGelandet

Actually if you look at it, you dont really make more than the US Army.

I just checked out your Army's website and they have a link to the pay rates.

An E-5 makes 4797 Canadian Dollars which equals with todays exchange rate 4966 US Dollars. Average Federal Income Tax is 22 Percent which comes to a deduction of 1055 Canadian Dollars which comes out to a monthly salary of 3741 Canadian Dollars which equals 3873 US Dollars.

You guys are payed every 2 weeks as well which comes out to a salary of aprox: 1870.50 Canadian Dollars which equals to 1936.64 US Dollars. After taxes as I said I saw on average 2183 US Dollars which comes to 2108 Canadian Dollars and a monthly salary of 4366 US Dollars or 4216 Canadian Dollars.

you might make e5 in less then 4 years but you'd have to be exceptional at which point thats a spec 2 with flight pay for another 300 not that anyone would be aircrew enlisted in that short period of time. Most of the FE's were about 10years in before they reached that plateau .

DerAdlerIstGelandet · 10-19-2007, 08:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pbfoot

you might make e5 in less then 4 years but you'd have to be exceptional at which point thats a spec 2 with flight pay for another 300 not that anyone would be aircrew enlisted in that short period of time. Most of the FE's were about 10years in before they reached that plateau .

Took me 5 years to make E-5.

The pay that I showed you for the Canadian Army was for E-5 as well.

Why do most Crew Chiefs have 10 years of experience before they can begin to fly? I think that is rather odd, because if you are good at your job and learn well there is no reason for you to have to wait that long. In my opinion it is a waist of a good flight engineer. I only had about 4 months experience before I started flying and I learned more as a Mechanic as a Crew Chief than I did in the Maintenance Company.

pbfoot · 10-20-2007, 01:28 PM

Making E5 in the CAF is agiven after 4 years but it is not a supervisory position in any way , you'd have be 5b or better to get to flight status if yoy were to achieve that in the Air Trades in 5 years your pretty much walking on water. A pongoe climbs the ranks at a faster rate.
Maestro whats wrong didn't the CAF accept you is that why your bitter or didn't you get your ration of smegma from your buddy today

Instal · 10-21-2007, 12:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maestro

Ah... You are so right. A few factors can explain that...

1a - Our politicians (since the end of the War of Korea) let down the army, cutting down it's budget every year. For that reason, we are about 30 years behind the US army on the technology side.

1b - Not only are we late on technology, but the equipment we already have is in bad shape... very bad shape. F-18s are rusty and falling apart, Sea Kings can't stay in the air, submarines catch fire... I once saw a Canadian tank with a cookie plate underneath to prevent oil from falling on the floor of the show room. There is also the malfunctionning weapons... Remember that anti-tank rocket ? You want me to use one of those ? No f*cking way !

2 - Actually, some (not all, fortunatly) of our commanding officers are brainwashed freaks (a little like De Gaulle was), running away when the bullets start to fly. The best example being General Romeo Dallaire, the Canadian commander of the peace keeping force in Rwanda, who let ten of his men (mostly, if not all of them, Belgians) being slaughtered there. Those poor blokes fought off the rebels as long as they could but had to surrender when they ran out of ammunitions. They were then beaten up to death with shovels and pickaxes. Making Dallaire look like a coward to the Belgians but was threated like a hero by our politicians (being awarded the Order of Canada and appointed as a senator).

3 - Most of the guys (and gals) enlisting in the Canadian army today (I know some of them personnally), go there to "travel around the world" or to "help peoples who need it". They forgot the main point of being a soldier : killing. Basically, a soldier is a killer hired by a country to fight off an other one. This is very disturbing... because you don't know if the soldier next to you is one of them. Breaking down in tears as soon as someone starts shooting at them. Would you like to sit beside one of those ? Certainly not me !

Rule 1 : If you wanna travel around the world, enlist in Air Canada. Not in the Canadian Army !

Rule 2 : If you wanna help peoples who need it, enlist in the Salvation Army. Not in the Canadian Army !

That's the main reasons why I won't enlist in the Canadian Army unless I'm forced to.

Hey ! I got an idea ! Why not combine the US and Canadian Army ? The Canadian Army could become a kind of National Guard like the US have in some states.

Wow that is a pretty harsh statement. You are as much as calling our troops cowards. I wonder if you would be brave enough to say that to one of them to thier face. I don't think anyone knows how they will react once under fire and there are many different motivations to join any army. You should be ashamed of yourself for such a statement.

Maestro · 10-21-2007, 12:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pbfoot

Maestro whats wrong didn't the CAF accept you is that why your bitter or didn't you get your ration of smegma from your buddy today

Uh ? I thought YOU were the blowjob ace around here... I never saw a more "brainwashed high-ranking officer's c*ck sucker" than you. You swallow everything the High Command tells you. But hey, you have the right to have your own opinion too...

Maestro · 10-21-2007, 01:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Instal

Wow that is a pretty harsh statement. You are as much as calling our troops cowards. I wonder if you would be brave enough to say that to one of them to thier face. I don't think anyone knows how they will react once under fire and there are many different motivations to join any army. You should be ashamed of yourself for such a statement.

No, no, no... Read carefully. Points 3 and 4 are only concerning a minority of the staff. And I clearly state it. The rookies (the ones that never saw combat before) are the worst. Why do you think the army got so many soldiers on the "Gulf War syndroma" (basically, a kind of nervous breakdown, for the ones who don't know what I'm talking about) ? Because those kids were not expecting to see brother-in-arms getting killed. But that's war : peoples get killed on both sides.

I remember of a girl in high school... We were talking of the "deal" the army was giving... "We pay your studies in whatever subject you want and you serve a minimum of 5 years for us." She thought it wasn't fair...

"It means that if there is a war within those 5 years, you'll have to go at war ? It's unfair !"

The teacher replied : "Hey ! That's the Canadian Army, not the Salvation Army."

I just say what seems to be the truth from the eyes of a non-soldier. Now, if you're too blind to see it...

DerAdlerIstGelandet · 10-21-2007, 07:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pbfoot

Making E5 in the CAF is agiven after 4 years but it is not a supervisory position in any way , you'd have be 5b or better to get to flight status if yoy were to achieve that in the Air Trades in 5 years your pretty much walking on water. A pongoe climbs the ranks at a faster rate.

For us getting promoted to E-4 is a given. It just happens with time and grade. E-5 being a supervisory position you have to have time in grade, time in service, experience and you have to go to boards and fullfill certain tasks and gain promotion points.

There is no rank requirment to obtain flight status because you are selected by the flight companies and they do your training. It is not like they go "Hey you are in a flight slot, here is flight suit and flight gear. Now go fly!"

You are selected and then you go through training with Flight Instructers (Crew Chief Trainers) and Instructer Pilots until they decide you are fit to be on your own.

DerAdlerIstGelandet · 10-21-2007, 07:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maestro

No, no, no... Read carefully. Points 3 and 4 are only concerning a minority of the staff. And I clearly state it. The rookies (the ones that never saw combat before) are the worst. Why do you think the army got so many soldiers on the "Gulf War syndroma" (basically, a kind of nervous breakdown, for the ones who don't know what I'm talking about) ? Because those kids were not expecting to see brother-in-arms getting killed. But that's war : peoples get killed on both sides.

Maestro unless you have been to combat you are unqualified to say what you just said. I have seen better men than me crumble under the pressure and fear of combat.

Each man (or woman now) reacts to fire in a different way especially when they see there friends turned into a bloody mess. Hell I cried a bit when I had this girls blood all over my flight suit one night. I pulled it together and did my job and did it well but not everyone can be expected to do so.

You dont know how you will be until you are in it.

Now as for your blowjob cocksucking comments up there. pB gave you a jab and you had every right to jab back at him but come on that was a bit uncalled for.

pbfoot · 10-21-2007, 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DerAdlerIstGelandet

For us getting promoted to E-4 is a given. It just happens with time and grade. E-5 being a supervisory position you have to have time in grade, time in service, experience and you have to go to boards and fullfill certain tasks and gain promotion points.

There is no rank requirment to obtain flight status because you are selected by the flight companies and they do your training. It is not like they go "Hey you are in a flight slot, here is flight suit and flight gear. Now go fly!"

You are selected and then you go through training with Flight Instructers (Crew Chief Trainers) and Instructer Pilots until they decide you are fit to be on your own.

Over here it was you had to be totally trade qualified and then you would get a course that would move you into flight engineer that would cross train with to other trades relative to the aircraft

mkloby · 10-21-2007, 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DerAdlerIstGelandet

There is no rank requirment to obtain flight status because you are selected by the flight companies and they do your training. It is not like they go "Hey you are in a flight slot, here is flight suit and flight gear. Now go fly!"

Hey - that's how they recruit us pilots

Being a primary flight instructor must be hilarious because we're all so stupid at that stage.

majorwoody10 · 10-25-2007, 08:27 AM

canadian troops have always aquitted themselves well and im glad they have always been allies for the last century or so ...why is the canadian public going hippie on their gallant military tradition ? we had a bout of it after the vietnam era ,but after grenada and gulf one its been pretty positive ,. is canadian public dissafection connected to our own post viet nam miasma ?