Starliner L-1649 Panel Project HELP ! - Aircraft of World War II

SABURO · 10-16-2007, 02:34 PM

Hi everyone ,
I need help with my Starliner project.
I recently purchase an ex-Air France Starliner (F-BHBN) Co-pilot panel without instrument and I'm trying to complet it.
Unfortunatly the documentation about those aircraft cockpit are not very easy to find. If I identified most of the missing instruments I still have 2 parts that I can't put a name on it (one is a instrument the other one a switch (?)).
Does anyone on this forum know personnaly this beast ?
Does anyone have clear "1649" cockpit (1960 era it's important !) pictures of the cockpit / panel ? (The TWA panels were different from the Air France and Lufthansa Panel but it may be very usefull)
Does anyone have any technical manual for Lockheed Starliner ? (with parts number list will be the best...I know I'm dreaming...) ?
Thank in advance for any help on this subject.
Cheers,

Olivier

FLYBOYJ · 10-16-2007, 02:51 PM

You know the panel set up might be operator specific but If I had to guess I would think your missing instrument might be aa ADF head. Here's a photo but it doesn't show what you need.

FLYBOYJ · 10-16-2007, 03:01 PM

Here's a C-121 - I think this is close to what you have...

ccheese · 10-16-2007, 03:21 PM

Saburo: Here's a pic of the instrument panel of an EC-121T (N548GF)
which should be just about the same thing. Hope it helps.

Charles

SABURO · 10-16-2007, 04:04 PM

Thanks very much FlyboyJ & Charles that was quick !
The probelm with actual photos and C-121 is that they use mostly military instruments, I found this picture of the pilot panel on the net (see below) and it's from the TWA Starliner Pilot manual (but this is the only photo I've got), so is that the ADF you are talking about ?
Any ideas what is the selector switch (?) for ?
Thanks again for your help guys,

Cheers,

Olivier

FLYBOYJ · 10-16-2007, 04:14 PM

Hi Saburo;

Actually after looking at that picture the instrument is a directional gyro. As far as the switch, I thing it's a static source selector. It looks like it had "alternate" and "normal" positions.

SABURO · 10-17-2007, 04:52 PM

Hi FLYBOYJ,thank you for your time,
Today I went to one of the rare Aviation bookshop in Paris, and I found "Naval fighters number eight" C-121 constellation and there's diagram of a "typical" C-121 instrument panel on which there's a "static selector valve"
so your identification was very accurate !
You say that the instrument could be a directional gyro, the 1st word of the label just under this instrument looks like "Polar" as those aircraft were often used on "Polar Routes " do you think that was a very specific directional gyro ?
Thanks again for your very valuable help,
Cheers,
Olivier

FLYBOYJ · 10-17-2007, 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SABURO

Hi FLYBOYJ,thank you for your time,
Today I went to one of the rare Aviation bookshop in Paris, and I found "Naval fighters number eight" C-121 constellation and there's diagram of a "typical" C-121 instrument panel on which there's a "static selector valve"
so your identification was very accurate !
You say that the instrument could be a directional gyro, the 1st word of the label just under this instrument looks like "Polar" as those aircraft were often used on "Polar Routes " do you think that was a very specific directional gyro ?
Thanks again for your very valuable help,
Cheers,
Olivier

My pleasure Oiliver - The DG might of been set up so it compensates for variation as the aircraft operates over the poles - just a guess but I'll look into it. Charles flew on these guys he might have some info as well....

SABURO · 03-26-2008, 03:06 PM

Slowly but surely...
Not as easy as I though at first, civil US instruments are not so easy to find (from France).
I'm still looking for any document concerning original Starliner cockpit (manuals, lockheed photos...etc) Many Thanks.

Cheers,

Olivier

Célérité · 03-26-2008, 07:12 PM

Salut SABURO, connais-tu le site aviationtechno? Pas très technique certes, mais plutôt complet dans l'ensemble.

SABURO · 03-27-2008, 04:45 AM

Oui, Merci beaucoup Célérité, et comme tu dis trés complet, certainement le site le plus complet concernant les principaux modèles de constel et l'utilisation qu'en a fait Air France! Encore Merci, à bientôt, Olivier

Yes, Thank you very much Célérité, and as you say very good site indeed, certainly the most complete site concerning the three main models of connies and their use by Air France! Thank again, Olivier

SABURO · 08-27-2009, 08:22 AM

Some update of my panel...This is so far what look like after 2 year since I started this project, I think that I found the correct instruments for an Air France Super Starliner.
I will replace some of them by better one whenever I will find it.

Llinks to Air France Super Starliner original cockpit :

http://aviatechno.free.fr/constellat...poste_1600.jpg

http://www.rolfs-reisen.de/hpbimg/super6.jpg

Constellation - À Orly

Cheers,

Oliver

Micdrow · 08-27-2009, 05:25 PM

Nice job Oliver, looks great!!!

vikingBerserker · 08-27-2009, 08:00 PM

Tres bien!

wheelsup_cavu · 08-29-2009, 02:50 AM

That is extremely cool.

Wheels

10-16-2007, 02:51 PM	#2
FLYBOYJ IP/Mech THE GREAT GAZOO Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado, USA Posts: 16,051	You know the panel set up might be operator specific but If I had to guess I would think your missing instrument might be aa ADF head. Here's a photo but it doesn't show what you need. __________________ "IF ITS RED OR DUSTY, DON'T TOUCH IT" Last edited by FLYBOYJ; 10-16-2007 at 02:56 PM.

10-16-2007, 03:01 PM	#3
FLYBOYJ IP/Mech THE GREAT GAZOO Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado, USA Posts: 16,051	Here's a C-121 - I think this is close to what you have... __________________ "IF ITS RED OR DUSTY, DON'T TOUCH IT"

10-16-2007, 04:14 PM	#6
FLYBOYJ IP/Mech THE GREAT GAZOO Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Colorado, USA Posts: 16,051	Hi Saburo; Actually after looking at that picture the instrument is a directional gyro. As far as the switch, I thing it's a static source selector. It looks like it had "alternate" and "normal" positions. __________________ "IF ITS RED OR DUSTY, DON'T TOUCH IT"

08-27-2009, 05:25 PM	#13
Micdrow “Archive” Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 4,852	Nice job Oliver, looks great!!! __________________ "Valor does not mean Hero."

08-27-2009, 08:00 PM	#14
vikingBerserker Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: South Carolina Posts: 3,763	Tres bien! __________________ "Those who forget the past are condemned to repeat it" "Those who dwell in the past, condemn the future"

10-17-2007, 04:52 PM	#7
SABURO Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Paris France Posts: 82	Hi FLYBOYJ,thank you for your time, Today I went to one of the rare Aviation bookshop in Paris, and I found "Naval fighters number eight" C-121 constellation and there's diagram of a "typical" C-121 instrument panel on which there's a "static selector valve" so your identification was very accurate ! You say that the instrument could be a directional gyro, the 1st word of the label just under this instrument looks like "Polar" as those aircraft were often used on "Polar Routes " do you think that was a very specific directional gyro ? Thanks again for your very valuable help, Cheers, Olivier

03-26-2008, 07:12 PM	#10
Célérité Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Nantes Posts: 92	Salut SABURO, connais-tu le site aviationtechno? Pas très technique certes, mais plutôt complet dans l'ensemble.

03-27-2008, 04:45 AM	#11
SABURO Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Paris France Posts: 82	Oui, Merci beaucoup Célérité, et comme tu dis trés complet, certainement le site le plus complet concernant les principaux modèles de constel et l'utilisation qu'en a fait Air France! Encore Merci, à bientôt, Olivier Yes, Thank you very much Célérité, and as you say very good site indeed, certainly the most complete site concerning the three main models of connies and their use by Air France! Thank again, Olivier

08-29-2009, 02:50 AM	#15
wheelsup_cavu Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Corona, California Posts: 1,534	That is extremely cool. Wheels __________________ Cheers Wheelsup_cavu Wheels's Photos - Time lapse build of an F/A-18 Super Hornet - Lock N' Load

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