Luftwaffe Cannons and Machineguns topic. - Page 12 - Aircraft of World War II

kool kitty89 · 11-03-2008, 01:55 AM

The comment about the "1000x 1000" performance not being obtainable by a "conventional" mechanism, isn't entirely true. There was a wartime version of the British Hispano that was sped up to ~1,000 rpm (and would have reached ~1,000 m/s wit the lighter German projectiles) but was not selected for production due significant changes to the parts.

Likewise, the post war Colt Mk.12 of the USN (a development of the Hispano) fired at 1,000 rmp with a velocity of over 1,000 m/s.

I think this would pretty much be the limit though, and the MG 213 (and USAF M39) both performed signifcantly better still, albeit at greater weight. (and somewhat greater bulk)

CharlesBronson · 11-03-2008, 04:24 PM

Quote:

The comment about the "1000x 1000" performance not being obtainable by a "conventional" mechanism, isn't entirely true. There was a wartime version of the British Hispano that was sped up to ~1,000 rpm (and would have reached ~1,000 m/s wit the lighter German projectiles) but was not selected for production due significant changes to the parts.

Likewise, the post war Colt Mk.12 of the USN (a development of the Hispano) fired at 1,000 rmp with a velocity of over 1,000 m/s.

That is 100 % correct, my comment was more related to the fact the germans didnt have at that time a 20 mm capable to reach 1000 rounds per minute. Probably they have some experimental gun but no one in service at 1942 with that rate of fire.

Junkers88A1 · 11-03-2008, 06:06 PM

i have this 30mm german shell from WW2..do you know what gun its from ??
its 100% from a aircraft..just not sure about what gun

kool kitty89 · 11-03-2008, 06:12 PM

It looks like a 30x90RB of the MK 108.

An introduction to collecting 30 mm cannon ammunition

Komet weapons: MK 108 cannon

Junkers88A1 · 11-03-2008, 06:23 PM

thanks

))

Junkers88A1 · 11-03-2008, 06:25 PM

lots of nice info there

CharlesBronson · 11-03-2008, 06:32 PM

It seems a explosive with self destruction shell.
For more about the MK 108 ammo, here:

http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/wea...tml#post263458 (Luftwaffe Cannons and Machineguns topic.)

Junkers88A1 · 11-03-2008, 06:41 PM

on the head it says ZZ 1589 B279 exw 44

the bottom read 754 CUX

a lot of interesting reading there

i ahve a bunch of early 20mm MGFF bullets and 13mm MG 131 but thisone has been "outside" the box for a while and i have never known much from the guns above Mg 151..

kool kitty89 · 11-03-2008, 06:44 PM

Looking at the above page I posted from Tony Williams site reminded me of another weapon I don't think has been brought up: the 30 mm Mauser MK 212 compeitor to the MK 108.

Any info?

CharlesBronson · 11-03-2008, 07:12 PM

Quote:

on the head it says ZZ 1589 B279 exw 44

the bottom read 754 CUX

The ZZ is very likely to means Zerleger and Zünder, selfdestructive and Fuze.
Number 44 is probably for 1944.

Quote:

I don't think has been brought up: the 30 mm Mauser MK 212 compeitor to the MK 108.

Any info?

I only know that was recoil operated, but I didnt find a single picture of the gun itself.

CharlesBronson · 11-26-2008, 05:58 PM

MG 17 handbook pictures:

Some pictures of the handbook MG 17 7,92mm machinegun for the Ejercito del aire (Spanish Air Force) including the synchronization gear.

Micdrow · 11-27-2008, 07:36 AM

Very interesting drawins there Charles, many thanks.

CharlesBronson · 11-27-2008, 07:42 PM

You are welcomed, the book is in a sorry state but the info is still good.

Burmese Bandit · 12-05-2008, 07:51 AM

I have browsed this thread for a long, long time before I came to this forum, and this thread is one of the strongest reasons why I did. Thanks to Bronson and all the other serious gun dudes who know their stuff, and are patient and kind enough to explain it to all!!!

CharlesBronson · 12-05-2008, 04:14 PM

You are welcomed BB, doing my best here.

11-03-2008, 06:12 PM	#169
kool kitty89 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 2,412	It looks like a 30x90RB of the MK 108. An introduction to collecting 30 mm cannon ammunition Komet weapons: MK 108 cannon Last edited by kool kitty89; 11-03-2008 at 06:22 PM.

11-03-2008, 06:32 PM	#172
CharlesBronson Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Cordoba - Argentina Posts: 3,150	It seems a explosive with self destruction shell. For more about the MK 108 ammo, here: http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/wea...tml#post263458 (Luftwaffe Cannons and Machineguns topic.) __________________ YouTube - Bronson's Videosl

11-27-2008, 07:36 AM	#177
Micdrow “Archive” Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 5,222	Very interesting drawins there Charles, many thanks. __________________ "Valor does not mean Hero."

11-27-2008, 07:42 PM	#178
CharlesBronson Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Cordoba - Argentina Posts: 3,150	You are welcomed, the book is in a sorry state but the info is still good. __________________ YouTube - Bronson's Videosl

12-05-2008, 04:14 PM	#180
CharlesBronson Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Cordoba - Argentina Posts: 3,150	You are welcomed BB, doing my best here. __________________ YouTube - Bronson's Videosl

11-03-2008, 01:55 AM	#166
kool kitty89 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 2,412	The comment about the "1000x 1000" performance not being obtainable by a "conventional" mechanism, isn't entirely true. There was a wartime version of the British Hispano that was sped up to ~1,000 rpm (and would have reached ~1,000 m/s wit the lighter German projectiles) but was not selected for production due significant changes to the parts. Likewise, the post war Colt Mk.12 of the USN (a development of the Hispano) fired at 1,000 rmp with a velocity of over 1,000 m/s. I think this would pretty much be the limit though, and the MG 213 (and USAF M39) both performed signifcantly better still, albeit at greater weight. (and somewhat greater bulk)

11-03-2008, 06:23 PM	#170
Junkers88A1 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Norway Posts: 1,264	thanks ))

11-03-2008, 06:25 PM	#171
Junkers88A1 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Norway Posts: 1,264	lots of nice info there

11-03-2008, 06:41 PM	#173
Junkers88A1 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Norway Posts: 1,264	on the head it says ZZ 1589 B279 exw 44 the bottom read 754 CUX a lot of interesting reading there i ahve a bunch of early 20mm MGFF bullets and 13mm MG 131 but thisone has been "outside" the box for a while and i have never known much from the guns above Mg 151..

11-03-2008, 06:44 PM	#174
kool kitty89 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 2,412	Looking at the above page I posted from Tony Williams site reminded me of another weapon I don't think has been brought up: the 30 mm Mauser MK 212 compeitor to the MK 108. Any info?

12-05-2008, 07:51 AM	#179
Burmese Bandit Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 489	I have browsed this thread for a long, long time before I came to this forum, and this thread is one of the strongest reasons why I did. Thanks to Bronson and all the other serious gun dudes who know their stuff, and are patient and kind enough to explain it to all!!!

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