 | Werfergranate 21| Weapons Systems Tech. Discuss Werfergranate 21 in the Technical forums; I am looking for information about the Werfergranate 21. Att he moment I have very limited sources at home and ... |
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02-04-2008, 05:53 PM
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#1 | | Junior Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 4
Country:  | Werfergranate 21
I am looking for information about the Werfergranate 21. Att he moment I have very limited sources at home and in th library, and I can find very little on the Internet.
What I am especially looking for:
1. When was it first used?
I have several dates:
May 21, 1943 (Reported by the 303rd Bomb Group. They saw air to air rockets fired for the first time.)
August 17, 1943: Several sources. Heinz Knoke writes in his book that he put them on his plane on Aug 15 for the first time and used them on Aug. 17.
October 14, 1943: Some sources. One of them is Martin Middlebrook in The Schweinfurt-Regensburg Mission. He wrote that there were most likely no rocket attacks on the Aug. 17 mission. The reports may refer to the Oct 14 mission.
What is the truth?
2. Which units used the W.Gr 21? I have JG 1 and 26, but also ZG 26 and 76, JG 11, JG 7, JV 44 and the Sturmjäger. JG 1 and 26 were the first units to use them?
3. Tactics. How were they used? I think Knoke fired from the front (I imagine at around 10 o'clock), but I have also read that they were fired from 6.
4. Sturmstaffel 1 and Sturmgruppen: Did they use the W. Gr. 21? And do you have a good image in color of the "Whites of Their Eyes" insignia?
Signed,
Magnuzk.
Last edited by Magnuzk : 02-06-2008 at 04:06 PM.
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02-06-2008, 09:01 PM
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#2 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Kaluebbe
Posts: 103
Country:  | i have some documents from june 1943 mentioning about the good success of the 21 cm Wurfgranate. To that trials with a double tube discharger. | |
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02-07-2008, 09:01 AM
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#3 | | Junior Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 4
Country: | Arigatoo genkidesukasan. Genki? are the documents you have anything you can upload? Do you know which unit or units used the W.Gr in June 1943, and on which operations? | |
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02-07-2008, 09:22 AM
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#4 | | the old Sage
Join Date: May 2004 Location: Platonic Sphere
Posts: 9,003
Country:  | guess I should chime in on this one ..........the Wgr 21 or BR 21 officially known was used in april of 43, in JG 1 and JG 11. later JG 26 used them.
JV 44 never had them at all, JG 7 had a few jets flying experimentally with them under the nose which was a joke and they tore them of and dumped them in the junk pile. the Sturm units 12.Sturm/JG 3 used a similar device for a couple of weeks with it faced rearward but it was a failure and they pulled it off, one staffel in JG 300 did the same with the same negative results.
Twin engine destroyers, well everyone in the Reich defense used them, the schools, ZG's 101, ZG's 1, 26 and 76, in fact ZG 1 used them into August of 44. Bf 110G-2's and Me 410A and B's attacked from all angles rear, up, below and for the sides. | |
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02-09-2008, 08:49 PM
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#5 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Kaluebbe
Posts: 103
Country: | Here are the documents. | |
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02-09-2008, 08:57 PM
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#6 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Kaluebbe
Posts: 103
Country: | | |
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02-10-2008, 09:38 AM
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#7 | | Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 2,543
Country: | Maybe this will help also
Enjoy
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"Valor does not mean Hero." | |
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02-10-2008, 12:45 PM
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#8 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 845
Country:  | Hi Genkidesan,
>Here are the documents.
Thanks a lot!  But would it perhaps be possible to post them in at least slightly higher resolution? I can read some sentences, but others seem to be virtually illegible to me ...
Regards,
Henning (HoHun) | |
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02-10-2008, 01:49 PM
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#9 | | Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 2,543
Country: | Quote:
Originally Posted by HoHun  Hi Genkidesan,
>Here are the documents.
Thanks a lot! But would it perhaps be possible to post them in at least slightly higher resolution? I can read some sentences, but others seem to be virtually illegible to me ...
Regards,
Henning (HoHun) |
Hi Henning,
Try this Henning, Genkidesan had sent me a cd on this stuff a while back. I just made some of it into a pdf file.
Again many thanks Genkidesan
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02-10-2008, 02:03 PM
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#10 | | the old Sage
Join Date: May 2004 Location: Platonic Sphere
Posts: 9,003
Country: | thanks for the docs in brief Paul and our friend from Germany, interesting of such emphasis on the single Flak 18 for both the 110 and 410 a almost worthless cannon for bomber destroying of course the Wr 21's were really not much better as their accuracy was nil, powerful and impressive they were but that is about it, I base my statements on interviews of former ZG crewmen who used the devices, the combination of the four 2cm weapons was prime and the most effective having an overall better kill rate due to accuracy and placement of rounds at a longer range than the short range 3cm Mk 108's | |
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02-10-2008, 03:04 PM
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#11 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 845
Country: | Hi Paul,
>Try this Henning, Genkidesan had sent me a cd on this stuff a while back.
Thanks a lot to you, and thanks a ton to Genkidesan!
Regards,
Hennign (HoHun) | |
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02-10-2008, 05:52 PM
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#12 | | Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 2,543
Country: | Your welcome Henning 
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